PPRO Analyst wrote:
Yesterday, I had a model walkout on a scheduled shoot because I “didn’t tell me you’re black!”  This model and had several phone conversations about the planned shoot, her portfolio, my portfolio, etc.  We even talked about family and educational goals.  You know all the normal stuff adults talk about.

The shoot was at my condo in the Lincoln Park section of Chicago, not exactly the hood!
Average home costs around $550,000 so you get the idea of the community.

As a minority photographer, shooting nudes, should I make a point of advising new models that I am Black?

No you shouldn't...it shouldn't make a difference, let the quality of your work speak for itself.

Now the "flip" side...usually one's sexual preference, color of skin, sexual tastes are sometimes evident by the type of photograph.

For instance...a male photographer with only nude male models can be assumed to be gay....same for a male "glamour" photographer who only shoots females...

Some people who fully haven't developed a diverse portofolio shoot only the people that are around them...for example a hillbilly photographer might only have access to hillbilly models...an urban photographer might only have access to african-american models.

I by NO means am trying to be judgemental or racial with these comments...this is just an honest and innocent observation I have made in the last few months.

For the record by the way, I'm brown and hispanic!!!...but I don't list that anywhere because to me I rather my work speak for itself!!!

Peter Dattolo wrote:
Everybody seems quick to say she is wrong and a racist.

Does everybody know her past and why she made the comment?
Does everybody know the context of how it was said to him?

Not everybody has a good life, she may have had something happen to her at some point in her life that she is not comfortable with. Maybe it was a black man, or maybe it was a bad experience in a bad part of town and it scared her.

It could be the content of the shoot mixed with the neighborhood and the fact that he is black, mixed with feeling uncomfortble is the reason also.
One thing a model should always do is if she/he feels uncomfortable, DO NOT do the shoot.... it is preached on this site day after day, and now your all bad mouthing this model for following thru with it.

EDIT: The above is not directed at you PPRO. What the model said was wrong but maybe the situation to her was really scary? Did you ask her for a reason as to why it was a problem?
You being black should not be an issue, but some models you may hire/TFP with may have an issue with it, that is not something you can change.

so im supposed to be scared of white people due to the scary experiences ive had with a few of them in the past?

hasan wrote:

so im supposed to be scared of white people due to the scary experiences ive had with a few of them in the past?

No, not by any means. But not everybody handles situations very well either, some cant handle it at all and fall apart. On the other hand if what those people did left that much of an impression on you, then they succeeded in what they were trying to do.
It like being afraid of the dark, stand up to your fears and you find out they really are not that bad.
Maybe she has issues she cannot deal with, but it does not make what she said alright and i sure would not have let her walk out with a few words of my own.
Referrences is called referrences for a reason, her fault for not checking.

Peter Dattolo wrote:
Everybody seems quick to say she is wrong and a racist.

Does everybody know her past and why she made the comment?
Does everybody know the context of how it was said to him?

Not everybody has a good life, she may have had something happen to her at some point in her life that she is not comfortable with. Maybe it was a black man, or maybe it was a bad experience in a bad part of town and it scared her.

It could be the content of the shoot mixed with the neighborhood and the fact that he is black, mixed with feeling uncomfortble is the reason also.
One thing a model should always do is if she/he feels uncomfortable, DO NOT do the shoot.... it is preached on this site day after day, and now your all bad mouthing this model for following thru with it.

EDIT: The above is not directed at you PPRO. What the model said was wrong but maybe the situation to her was really scary? Did you ask her for a reason as to why it was a problem?
You being black should not be an issue, but some models you may hire/TFP with may have an issue with it, that is not something you can change.

That's what a racist is, someone who draws negative inferences based on someone's race.  She did that, so she's a racist.  I don't give a fuck that she once was scared by a black pony, or whatever her unworked-out problem is.  She's a racist and a lowlife and she should have been kicked in the butt as she was leaving.  Her parents should be kicked, too.

e-string wrote:
What the HELL?! I can't believe people are THAT openly racist anymore. Wow.

They you should be subetly racist?

George Butler wrote:

They you should be subetly racist?

Uh, where did I say "should"? I just thought that most people dumb enough to be racist were at least smart enough not to be so obvious about it.. at least in places like Chicago.

Peter Dattolo wrote:

I am not going to get into a argument on racism and what i said or she/he said over this. I have some good friends who are black and none of them would have let her walk out saying that to them, without getting in thier face and asking for a reason as to why. After that it is easy to remark something in defense like she was a racist, or narrowminded (depending on the situation) before kicking her out.
I am sure alot of choice words would come up in this situation, and most probably would be correct on both counts.
It was wrong for her to say that and i stated that several times. His skin color should not be an issue either.....but it was. I am not black but if that was said to any friends of mine, i sure would not have let them leave without a few choice words.


EDIT: I looked at the site but did not read it. I happen to agree with a black friend who told me this once "Racism comes from two points, the people who practice it and the people who will not let it die".
If racism is to die then somebody has to be the bigger person and let it go.

You should read the article.  It makes some very salient points on why black people are loath to point out or respond to obvious racism.

PPRO Analyst wrote:
Yesterday, I had a model walkout on a scheduled shoot because I “didn’t tell me you’re black!”  This model and had several phone conversations about the planned shoot, her portfolio, my portfolio, etc.  We even talked about family and educational goals.  You know all the normal stuff adults talk about.

The shoot was at my condo in the Lincoln Park section of Chicago, not exactly the hood!
Average home costs around $550,000 so you get the idea of the community.

As a minority photographer, shooting nudes, should I make a point of advising new models that I am Black?

Like it or not, we are all products of our environments, good or bad. Obviously her environment was less than perfect. Most apparently you were not what she was expecting and, not knowing just how to handle this unexpected situation, did a very poor job of dealing with it. The flip side is if she had stayed & shot, with her having the issues in her head, you would have never gotten what you wanted and you would have wasted your time & efforts and may have never known why.

Regrettably, I would say if this becomes a regular issue, then it may be a good idea, just to save you the grief of having these issues thrown in your face. However if this happens once in a blue moon (or Black Moon) then no.

Quite nice work by the way. The really good thing to come out of all of this is she did not get the satisfaction of getting a stunning nude image of her taken by you… and never will.

Steve Thornton
http://www.stevethornton.com

UnoMundo Photography wrote:

Hint: to show dumb shitheads your ethnicity, here are code words or phrase to use during the phone conversation.
culo
sistah
in your uncle your daddy ?
you like chow mein ?
I have  gold teeth
your baby daddy is your escort
dats your cuzzin pickup truck
es tu cholo ?
ooohh, you are soooo gay!



you can simply say " I dont work with dumb phucks"

hahahaah good ones

So Says Amara. wrote:
you should have shot back, 'you didn't tell me you were a bigot!' and thrown her ignorant ass right in the street.

HELL YES!!! I love it!

PPRO Analyst wrote:
Yesterday, I had a model walkout on a scheduled shoot because I “didn’t tell me you’re black!”  This model and had several phone conversations about the planned shoot, her portfolio, my portfolio, etc.  We even talked about family and educational goals.  You know all the normal stuff adults talk about.

The shoot was at my condo in the Lincoln Park section of Chicago, not exactly the hood!
Average home costs around $550,000 so you get the idea of the community.

As a minority photographer, shooting nudes, should I make a point of advising new models that I am Black?

this industry has no room for this type of ignorance. race should really only matter at  model/actor castings where certain races are being requested. Who the hell cares if the photog is black, white, etc!! I wasn't aware that race affected your talent as a photog. She's such a dumb ass with no class. :-)

Steven Barrett wrote:
Maybe you should change your professional name to 'Film Noir'?

lol

dee740 wrote:

this industry has no room for this type of ignorance. race should really only matter at  model/actor castings where certain races are being requested. Who the hell cares if the photog is black, white, etc!! I wasn't aware that race affected your talent as a photog. She's such a dumb ass with no class. :-)

I second that...

PPRO Analyst wrote:
Yesterday, I had a model walkout on a scheduled shoot because I “didn’t tell me you’re black!”  This model and had several phone conversations about the planned shoot, her portfolio, my portfolio, etc.  We even talked about family and educational goals.  You know all the normal stuff adults talk about.

The shoot was at my condo in the Lincoln Park section of Chicago, not exactly the hood!
Average home costs around $550,000 so you get the idea of the community.

As a minority photographer, shooting nudes, should I make a point of advising new models that I am Black?

it's sad, but it happens more often than you think. there was a report that PDN magazine did on minority photographers and the racism that they experience in the photography field. some of the experiences were sad while at the sametime comical.

must've been that fear that you wer going to ravage her 'lilly white' body. oh well, tis life. Laugh at her and move on. that's what I do. not every black man wants to 'uck' you. we are about business too.

Kris Perry Photography wrote:
I've never had a problem, but i'm in Cali also. Not saying that i'm here makes a difference ,but I just don't run into of that much out here. Most of my shooting is done with another photographer (white) and when we meet the models they show mad love. Hell most of the time i'm the only brotha there lol. She was ignorant dawg. If she was stressin that hard then she needs to find a new line of work. Who cares what color the person is? If they can shoot fine. If not then you'll find out later. Judge the work not the person.

KP

that's why, because u r with a crew. trust me, it dioes happen more often than you think. i get a kick out of some the expression on some faces. or even if they hear your voice and just can't help but to ask what is your nationality.

Lenny Hamilton wrote:
I think its a Terrible Shame...!  What does your color have to do with your talent as a photographer?  Does being a white photographer...make the work any better or the model feel safer, because  your white?  I believe talent is talent...not color!
If the model feels different you don't need to work with them.
Thank you for hearing my point of view!
Lenny Hamilton

agree. but what happens is the myths and stereotypes of black men. one of those myths is that if you are a white women, then he will try to attempt to get in your pants.

Steven Barrett wrote:
Maybe you should change your professional name to 'Film Noir'?

Believe it or not, i actually considered Film Noir as a "professional name" a while back...But then i realized that almost nobody forgets a guy named "Melvin".  Occasionally people actually think my given name is a stage name.

Leonard Imagery wrote:
I agree with Ravina. I never plan on shooting any one until we have met and gotten to know each other a bit. It is an extra investment in my time and theirs, but I think it is worth it and makes the actual shoot go better.

Having said that I am stunned to think that any model would be that stupid and prejudiced. Your work is outstanding and she does not deserve to be in your book.

Harry

agree roo. i always setup a meeting. this gives me a general idea on what will be.

keithart wrote:
You SHOULD tell her - for your own sake.  Look at the energy and time and emotional capital wasted because of her reaction.  You can't afford that in your life.  Better to let that person know everything about you and then let them come or not come.  If someone is going to discriminate against you because you are black, or white, or jewish, or hispanic, or fat or whatever - let them.  They are going to anyway,  but let them not waste your time and the only way to ensure that is going to happen is to let them know up front.

Maybe she was just a 'delicate flower' type and anything that did not match her expectations upset her - who knows.  I had a situation where I was interviewing someone for a job and they were 350lbs and all I had were chairs with arm-rests.  She couldn't fit into them!  We had to have two people carry in a couch from the lobby for her to sit in.  How embarrassing for me, and for this poor woman.  But if she'd let me know beforehand I'd have had a chair without arms for her to sit in and things would have gone much better.

I guess I wasn't aware that being black was "something to tell". This model was using the photog's race as a character assessment, not  really the same as accomodations for an overweight individual. So here are two questions about your situation. a) How was she to know about your chair problem? b) why would I call a job and tell them anything that could be used as a reason  to "overlook" my resume before they even hear me out? What all should we tell people?  Should I be calling jobs after they've seen my resume and disclosing I'm African American? I mean what the hell?!  She saw his work and decided she liked waht she saw, so if she had a problem with his racial makeup maybe she should have disclosed that.She wanted to judge him for some reason  based on race and all he's doing is shooting her, not making babies with her.

UnoMundo Photography wrote:
I for one, am NOT working with fat photographers, so there !

Yah right!!! It never stopped you before! Macho, macho Man!!!! LOL!