Jessalyn_54 wrote:
good post Stephen

hey I'm off to wax my legs. I'll check in later. gotta shoot tomorrow.

too much info...  x_X

stefanie0324 wrote:
Most models are young and struggling to make money because they have new expenses.. responsibilities.. maybe they go to school.. maybe they have a new family. That sort of stuff

what service would we, as photographers, be doing these same young models who are trying to work in [mainstream] circles with commercial photographers who do, in fact, bill for their services? they too, the photographers, have expenses, both in & outside their work ...

(n.b., the young photographer who started this thread lists himself as like 21 yrs old; probably has typical young person expenses too)

... so especially for the younger professional models, those in the 14 - 16 yr old range, it's probably more beneficial to hasten their & their parents' arrival to the reality of working in [it].

just two cents,
F

brownbulldawg wrote:
... I would say this though, I think the reason why some models respond with such attitude is because [b]they hate getting turned down & it's a kick to their huge ego when someone says "no".[b]

Indeed, so the model presumed that since you were still in college and not a pro,
that you really *did* do TFP, and then the model concluded that you felt the model wasn't 'good' enough for you to consider TFP. This would account for their attitude. Not all that surprising really. People get so used to filtering the world through their own reality distortion field that it's pretty hard to break through sometimes.
...just saying...

Melissa Lynnette wrote:
Did you guys seriously have another discussion about TFP hate?  Gotta love this place.

BTW:  Love you Jess!

lol. thanks love! I really felt compelled to direct him to the search box but then I got all excited about taxes.

Jessalyn_54 wrote:

lol. thanks love! I really felt compelled to direct him to the search box but then I got all excited about taxes.

That's funny.  Excited about taxes.  I wouldn't have been able to believe it, except that I read it.

Jessalyn_54 wrote:
so no one had anything to say once I left to wax my legs? fine. yeesh.

So... How are you legs? Do you use Turtle Wax?

Mos Photography wrote:
Ever heard the saying A hit dog will holler????

um. no.

Jessalyn_54 wrote:

um. no.

Look it up.

Mos Photography wrote:
Ever heard the saying A hit dog will holler????

I just occurred to me to glance at your post count.  Heh.  Then I realized that the bulk of your posts must have come from this thread. 
For the record, your port is good, I might look you up if I have time this Christmas.
I agree that no model should respond rudely to you simply because you refused to trade, that's inexcusable.  As for the rest, well, bless em!

Melissa Lynnette wrote:

I just occurred to me to glance at your post count.  Heh.  Then I realized that the bulk of your posts must have come from this site. 
For the record, your port is good, I might look you up if I have time this Christmas.
I agree that no model should respond rudely to you simply because you refused to trade, that's inexcusable.  As for the rest, well, bless em!

Thanks Melissa. U have a great port also.

Mos Photography wrote:

Look it up.

I am excitedly running to google it right now.

[/sarcasm]

Jessalyn_54 wrote:

well it still goes the other way. if a model thinks she one the best or even is one of the best, shouldn't you be paying her? so you may think you're worthy of being paid but that model thinks the exact same thing.

From what I read, that is not an issue. He is commenting on models who ask him to shoot TFP and they are mad when he won't.

If they aren't going to help him generate money, why would he shoot them, if he isn't earning money that allows him that luxury.

RGK Photography wrote:
From what I read, that is not an issue. He is commenting on models who ask him to shoot TFP and they are mad when he won't.

I addressed that to him around page 3.

RGK Photography wrote:
If they aren't going to help him generate money, why would he shoot them, if he isn't earning money that allows him that luxury.

and this applies to models as well.

Melissa Lynnette wrote:

I just occurred to me to glance at your post count.

And? He only joined two weeks ago.

Jessalyn_54 wrote:

I am excitedly running to google it right now.

[/sarcasm]

I'm bored, so I did it for you.  Not that I'm sure it has that much to do with this thread.

From: http://www.stands4.com/bcl.asp?c=CASUAL&p=14

Hit Dog will Holler
If a stone is thrown into a pack of dogs, the one hit by the stone will usually holler...>The guilty party is usually the most vocal... The teacher said, "Hit dog will holler" to her noisey students who claimed they did not throw any paper in class.


Are you being tried for something in a court of law?

Jessalyn_54 wrote:

I am excitedly running to google it right now.

[/sarcasm]

Hit Dog will Holler
If a stone is thrown into a pack of dogs, the one hit by the stone will usually holler...>The guilty party is usually the most vocal... The teacher said, "Hit dog will holler" to her noisey students who claimed they did not throw any paper in class.

RGK Photography wrote:

And? He only joined two weeks ago.

Kisses sweetie.

Mos Photography wrote:

Hit Dog will Holler
If a stone is thrown into a pack of dogs, the one hit by the stone will usually holler...>The guilty party is usually the most vocal... The teacher said, "Hit dog will holler" to her noisey students who claimed they did not throw any paper in class.

LOL......you went to the same site I did.

Jessalyn_54 wrote:

RGK Photography wrote:
From what I read, that is not an issue. He is commenting on models who ask him to shoot TFP and they are mad when he won't.

I addressed that to him around page 3.


and this applies to models as well.

I am not at the right level, but in the real world, how often do photogs pay models??

Jessalyn_54 wrote:

RGK Photography wrote:
From what I read, that is not an issue. He is commenting on models who ask him to shoot TFP and they are mad when he won't.

I addressed that to him around page 3.


and this applies to models as well.

I dont even understand how you tried to flip the whole situation. I have stated from the start that models who have rates should be paid. Why are you acting like this is 50/50 when its clearly not? My original post was about a model being rude when I said "Im sorry, I no longer do TFP". Simple as that.

I think you like arguing, even at the risk of sounding like you have no idea what you are arguing about. You have a nice night Jessalyn.

Jessalyn_54 wrote:

the basic premise behind TFP/TFCD is that the shoot will benefit both parties. You're sounding pretty selfish here. It's a waste of your time but not hers.

and a model has never used the same argument?

RGK Photography wrote:
I am not at the right level, but in the real world, how often do photogs pay models??

I didnt even want to say that, but its true. Its so more common for a photographer to be paid instead of a model being paid. The only time a model is really making steady money from photographers is when she has become famous.

Jessalyn_54 wrote:
And you can better believe that if the IRS can assume that you will add it to your wardrobe and use it later on that they will disallow it.

At one of my former accounting jobs a woman was running a painting business and put down the pants she bought for the business as a business deduction. Once they're covered in paint you wouldn't wear them for anything else right? Well when the IRS audited her return they disallowed it.

Garbage, if they are pants which can reasonably be assumed to be used for work, they are a business deduction. If you couldn't argue that then you aren't very good.

Koray wrote:
there is the thing that I dont understand about the OP mentioning the best photographers...I'm a model and want to pay...just wondering who the best photographers are..to pay??

Its your decision to decide who is the best photographer for you. We all shoot different and in the end, the model decides who is the best. I may be the best for one model, but the worse for another. It all depends on what the model is looking for when she is paying.

Koray wrote:
there is the thing that I dont understand about the OP mentioning the best photographers...I'm a model and want to pay...just wondering who the best photographers are..to pay??

They can't be hard to find in New York of all places.

RGK Photography wrote:
Garbage

Thoughtful.

Mos Photography wrote:
I didnt even want to say that, but its true. Its so more common for a photographer to be paid instead of a model being paid. The only time a model is really making steady money from photographers is when she has become famous.

*sigh... (this again)

are you talking about models paying photographers for portfolio images vs. photographers paying models for personal projects or what? Cause in the REAL world, CLIENTS pay both photographers and models.

EDIT: And his/her being FAMOUS has fek-all to do with it.

K. Holden wrote:
Thoughtful.

very, did you prefer my updated answer

RGK Photography wrote:

Garbage, if they are pants which can reasonably be assumed to be usesd for work, they are a business deduction. If you couldn't argue that then you aren't very good.

You are a) an accountant (b) tax consultant (c) irs employee?

Mos Photography wrote:
I didnt even want to say that, but its true. Its so more common for a photographer to be paid instead of a model being paid. The only time a model is really making steady money from photographers is when she has become famous.

I make steady money from photographers. I'm not famous. If I were famous, I'd probably make steady money from clients. 

Really, I don't know why you feel compelled to complain.  People are pushy and rude.  That's nothing new.  You can't agree on terms with someone, don't work with 'em. Move on.

oldguysrule wrote:

You are a) an accountant (b) tax consultant (c) irs employee?

Until she provides her CPA accredidation and the actual IRS audit and the reasons behind it, my response is just as valid as hers. I am not a tax accountant, but I have worked in accounting for 20 years and have coworkers who are tax accountants and have been working in business in general for a longer period.

theda wrote:

I make steady money from photographers. I'm not famous. If I were famous, I'd probably make steady money from clients. 

Really, I don't know why you feel compelled to complain.  People are pushy and rude.  That's nothing new.  You can't agree on terms with someone, don't work with 'em. Move on.

Well you do pose nude. Not many are willing to do that for free.

Mos Photography wrote:

Its your decision to decide who is the best photographer for you. We all shoot different and in the end, the model decides who is the best. I may be the best for one model, but the worse for another. It all depends on what the model is looking for when she is paying.

the thing is the best photographers dont make threads like this one...its like

"anybody wanna shoot some sexy and creative...but you gotta pay"

and I like it better when a photographer is backed up by a model...fun to watch