Posted by XtremeArtists: 
Excellent points area, and you demonstrated one does not have to start a new thread to make them.

Geez Herb, you stole my thunder.

The notions that stood out in area291's post are: cottage industry, OMP offering a premium service with no real ROI.

I am going to stickle (stickle?) about one thing: The basis of a Catch-22 is not "if you build it they will come;" rather, it comes from the book by the same name and boils down to "You can't be crazy if you think you're crazy."

Posted by Brian Diaz: 

Posted by studiomona: 

Posted by XtremeArtists: 

Posted by studiomona: 
I even thought of spoofing it and creating a border that will say "Showcase" on one of my pics hahaha....but that might be a bit much

Now there's a good spoof!

LOL let me see what I can whip up here hahaha

Maybe you could try a version in which you replace "case" with "off"...

Hmmmmmmm to that.

Posted by area291: 
Neither OMP nor MM are built on business models suitable for the industry at the street level.  The main reason for this is the empowerment of the membership.

For a web site to have value at the street level, all, not just a portion of the constituency must be viable.  To meet the needs of the industry, the industry itself must have control over those entering, just as they do at the brick and mortar level.  Tools, such as powerful search engines, would be put in place that gave business value, not just functionality based on wide sweeping criteria. 

Ad agencies, corporate creative teams and even M&T agencies simply don't have the time to filter through an unqualified talent pool.  If they have an active role in selecting the membership, they then might take an ownership and welcome the use of such a portal site.

Modeling portals have thus have become a "cottage industry" that remain for the most part outside the street level, and a place for those to enter and excel within itself, or perhaps through their own iniative, not within a portal that is generally overlooked.   

The conflict in creating the portal at the onset is somewhat of a Catch 22 in the "if you build it they will come" mentality.  Most have used the "capture a large user-base" rather than capture the large industry-base first approach.  The large user base does not serve the industry, a large industry base does not serve those unqualified to enter.

Where OMP has failed, and I suspect those headed in the same direction, is charging those at a professional level for a limited professional service that does not focus on presenting those at the same level.  Thus the reasoning behind such limited opportunity from those hiring on a daily basis within the industry.

Modeling portals have become nice, fun gathering places.  They're pretty far removed though, from the reality of the industry beyond the cottage. 

In a free-for-all environment, portals really should remain free-for-all.  The question individuals must ask themselves upon being asked for payment, "is there long term value to pay for entering the gathering with limited return on the investment beyond fun?"

Therein lies the difference, business or fun.  At the street level it's all business...

greats points. 

I'm one of those people that bail from the sites that start charging.  The reason is simple.  Paying clients do not find me on sites like this...EVER.  If I were testing this would probably be a great place to make connections.  I find these sites entertainig but not entertaining enough to pay for.

Posted by Mark Bodine: 
I'd Pay.  $25 annually very reasonable.  OMP is ridiculous in their fee structure and service provided!

Mark

Excellent thoughts.... Over the past year, as I have been a small time photog, trying to build a hobbie into a method of income, I have been forced to drop from overcharged sites such as MuseCube and OMP.  MM has proved to be the most benificial anyway just by design, while my site is being built.  While Free is great for starters like me, I know the ads and banners can only go so far- I would not be opposed to pay $25 annually for MM. 

Posted by ( ANT ) Mgaphoto:
Myspace is an entirely different style site than this so you can't compare the two. Everyone joins Myspace because they can, however the majority of people out there aren't photographers, MUAs, or Models.

You are so confused and lost.. How in the world can you say that they are different, cuz the majority of ppl out there are not photogs, models or mua..

How many of the people in this site can you truly consider any of those?

C'mon! Anyone with a digital camera can come here and call himself/herself a photographer and anyone with a damn webcam can be a model.. If you consider "the majority" of people here in this site models or mua or photogs.. then send me an email and i will send u websites to REAL models, mua and photogs..

Posted by stonescorpion: 
I like the idea of MM being free.  When I joined I was unemployed and living on a very tight budget.  MM still allowed me to get in touch with models I never would have even known existed, and do some great work (at least in my opinion).

Then again, if you can pay for internet, u were not THAT broke!

I could see a flat annual rate of $10-30, but going the way of a $20 MONTHLY fee like OMP is ridiculous.

I agree $20 a month is high, but only because most "models" here are not real models, just girls ( i dont include guys, cuz i dont shoot them so i have no clue as to how serious are they ) who have some pictures and like attention.

Right now if the numbers are right, there are 25,000 people on MM.  Yes: 25,000.
Do the math. 

If 1/2 the people don't subscribe at $10 a year MM would still stand to take in $125,000.  That's nothing to take lightly.  And I'm sure there are more serious photographers and artists on MM than there are people looking for a MySpace2 connection site.  I've seen those people here though, and their presence does bother me.

Have you ever thought how much the bandwidth cost? Im sure you have no clue, but I would bet, they are paying well over $15000 a month in bandwidth, based on the alexa rank which gives me an idea of how much traffic and base on the fact that they host images.

MM is getting by, and growing very healthy being just a free site.  Even a $5 year fee would generate a good chunk of revenue for them to use for things like better servers, more space for photos, etc.  But it would also add a complicating factor, adding new programs for gathering the money, more employees, new software all of which would cost extra money.

You mentioned that u were unemployed when you started here, is it ok to get by? Or is it better to make enough money to be comfortable ?

This post has gotten long.  I love the site free.  I think a nominal annual fee would be acceptable and worth it, but only IF the site needed funds and was facing shut down.  If it gets along on adds and banners, lets keep the free revolution going.

"Cough up a buck you cheap bastard."  - Joe to Mr. Pink

I would never mind paying for something that gives me a ROI, usually sites like this one .. you have to contact 30 'models' before u get a productive shoot.

Posted by StaciF: 
I personally love AllModelZone If you pay to upgrade it give you all the benefits of OMP,Musecube and MM combined without all the not so pro people so it is more of a real community of photographers and models. 

Are you serious? That site looks like a joke.. Just look at the avatars.. lol

Next I expect someone to come out and say that the best modeling site is explore talent LOL.

Posted by StaciF: 
To each his own- but I think it adds a fun feel-

So you can just pay to stay here then.

To each his/her own.. See you think it adds a " fun " feel... my point exactly as to why these sites are not worth paying for.. This is a busines and should be treated as one... Photography is fun.. and should be fun.. have u seen carreerbuilder.com or any of those other mainstream job places.. are they fun? I think they are serious.. and real..

Mind u im not attacking u or coming down on you... Don't forget that reading text confuses the delivery.. Take it all as if  i was telling it to you VERY nicely..

I wont stay here and pay for it.. because there is not a return on my investment from a business point of view.. fine this place is fun to hang out and chat and all that.. but is far from a real business place.. 

best!

Posted by Photogeeks: 
I'd have no problem paying a minimal fee but I think it could REALLY discourage new membership.

Only because there is a feeling that this is not serious.. Would you not pay $100 a month if it meant u could and most likely would bill $750 ?

I sure would! Would I pay $20 a month so that i can look at some pics? no...!

Posted by bill wylie: 
Let's talk business, I am a commercial advertising photographer
whom is represented by a new york agent. I shoot with different
models for different reasons. I use the nyc agencies for fashion or
lifestyle. With MM, I am building a editorial portrait book. A book
that I will take to the street. A book that I will show to Art Directors. I do not shoot talent for fun. Anyone whom is in front
of my camera, will be seen by the real world. If you have no vision and or idea of how to conduct your business; Yes, this site
is fun time, with no return on investment.

I do not need CD/ AD's to see my work on this site. I sort out
whom I want to work with and market to them direct. Everything
I do is based on increasing the growth of my business.

I'm not here to sell anything and there are plenty of places to get models for editorial shots.

Why you feel the need to question everyone else's business model is beyond me.

Posted by CThomson: 
How many photos do you really need to display what you do?
I feel if you can’t describe whom you are or what you can offer the others, do you really think 20 more images will help you?

Tell em Craig!! That was a great point, that many people seem to overlook.

Posted by Dax: 

Posted by ( ANT ) Mgaphoto:
Myspace is an entirely different style site than this so you can't compare the two. Everyone joins Myspace because they can, however the majority of people out there aren't photographers, MUAs, or Models.

You are so confused and lost.. How in the world can you say that they are different, cuz the majority of ppl out there are not photogs, models or mua..

How many of the people in this site can you truly consider any of those?

C'mon! Anyone with a digital camera can come here and call himself/herself a photographer and anyone with a damn webcam can be a model.. If you consider "the majority" of people here in this site models or mua or photogs.. then send me an email and i will send u websites to REAL models, mua and photogs..

Dude get off the crack! You make no sense at all so how can I start to answer what you just wrote? It seems like you think MM and Myspace are very similar which is a joke. They can continue to set it up like Myspace, have these models promote there, and yes I have had people e-mail from Myspace telling me to join MM because it is so much better, lol so cheesy. Anyway regular people join that site because it was designed for regular people. This site maybe designed to attract more people outside of the industry but it isn't going to turn into another Myspace because it is directed to specific sector of society, being photographers, models, etc... It is like saying everyone will start shopping at Home Depot for things you find at Target. Yes there maybe similar items along the way but for the most part they are very different stores with different types of customers.

Posted by ( ANT ) Mgaphoto: 

Posted by Dax: 

Posted by ( ANT ) Mgaphoto:
Myspace is an entirely different style site than this so you can't compare the two. Everyone joins Myspace because they can, however the majority of people out there aren't photographers, MUAs, or Models.

You are so confused and lost.. How in the world can you say that they are different, cuz the majority of ppl out there are not photogs, models or mua..

How many of the people in this site can you truly consider any of those?

C'mon! Anyone with a digital camera can come here and call himself/herself a photographer and anyone with a damn webcam can be a model.. If you consider "the majority" of people here in this site models or mua or photogs.. then send me an email and i will send u websites to REAL models, mua and photogs..

Dude get off the crack! You make no sense at all so how can I start to answer what you just wrote? It seems like you think MM and Myspace are very similar which is a joke. They can continue to set it up like Myspace, have these models promote there, and yes I have had people e-mail from Myspace telling me to join MM because it is so much better, lol so cheesy. Anyway regular people join that site because it was designed for regular people. This site maybe designed to attract more people outside of the industry but it isn't going to turn into another Myspace because it is directed to specific sector of society, being photographers, models, etc... It is like saying everyone will start shopping at Home Depot for things you find at Target. Yes there maybe similar items along the way but for the most part they are very different stores with different types of customers.

Whatever you say..  In MY eyes.. very few ppl here qualify as real or pros.. That is how i see it.

If you see it the other way around.. then happy shooting!

- D

Posted by bill wylie: 
...is fun time, with no return on investment....

Then it might ring true that what you posted had no value?

Posted by DeviousElite: 
This is where I have a difficult choice. I hate OMP, but I still get WAY more business on OMP than I do here. It's just fun to hang out here.

I totally agree with you