Dave Krueger wrote:
her mother saying, "...she'll have to answer to the Lord for what she's done...".  Her father reportedly took it the hardest.

Yup... That's right. God made her with her clothes on, and she took them off. Shame on her.

mjr.

Nate Boguszewski wrote:
If nudity didn't mean anything in this country then neither would Playboy and the aspirtations of so many models and likely more photographers would be non-existant.

Every time I read something like this I ponder how many people are in this game for the vice of it.

You get the post of the day award!  Would anyone in her home town or her parents mind if she were in a film where she was killling people?  Yet its not
okay to be nude.  Intresting that we are willing to pay money to see other
people without anything on but when women do it are put down.  I wonder what
would happen if Americian in general relaxed about the whole nude or porn industry
would it still be a millions of dollars a month industry.

FabioTovar wrote:
Not to be a buzzkill or anything but put yourself in the PARENTS shoes.
Forget "god" and religion.. all that aside....

If you had a daughter (don't know if you do)  would you be proud she was getting into the porn industry?

and please don't start with the playboy isnt porn crap. It is what it is. Just considered high profile porn.

If I had a daughter.... I think I would cry too.  I think MOST parents would want their children to aspire for something BETTER than posing nude....?????  But that's just me what the F do I know.

What's BETTER than posing nude?  Being a doctor?  or a lawyer? Or a herbologist?  Or working fries at McDonald's?

Really who are we to say what's better for someone else?  MOST parents would cry because MOST parent try to control their children and want what THEY want for their child and not what their CHILD wants.

As a parent i'd want what makes my daughter happy and fufilled.  If that be posing in playboy or hustler then I'll support her and wear it proud.  Shoot I don't think Condelezza Rice's parent should be PROUD of the work she does.  I think that the big wigs at Halburton all have much more to answer for than Miss July.   I think that as a father if my son or daught grow up and anything they do causes hurt or pain to other peope it would dissappoint me, NOT if they gave a 12 year old his first hand baby.

Nate Boguszewski wrote:
If nudity didn't mean anything in this country then neither would Playboy and the aspirtations of so many models and likely more photographers would be non-existant.

Every time I read something like this I ponder how many people are in this game for the vice of it.

Tony Lawrence wrote:
You get the post of the day award!  Would anyone in her home town or her parents mind if she were in a film where she was killling people?  Yet its not
okay to be nude.  Intresting that we are willing to pay money to see other
people without anything on but when women do it are put down.  I wonder what
would happen if Americian in general relaxed about the whole nude or porn industry
would it still be a millions of dollars a month industry.

Actually yes.  My dad, the southern Baptist minister, lobbies against movies that have ludicy and excessive violence.  He doesn't like those violent killing video games, nor does most of his congregation.  So in the SB community. . .violence is just as bad.  Remember, these are the same kinds of individuals that pushed for TV ratings for every show on TV.  So it's not just nudity.

Nate Boguszewski wrote:
If nudity didn't mean anything in this country then neither would Playboy and the aspirtations of so many models and likely more photographers would be non-existant.

Every time I read something like this I ponder how many people are in this game for the vice of it.

By your agument people in China should be thanking tyrannical censorship for creating an underground press.

I won't even bother to comment on your assigning the vice label to it.

Jayne Jones wrote:
Actually yes.  My dad, the southern Baptist minister, lobbies against movies that have ludicy and excessive violence.  He doesn't like those violent killing video games, nor does most of his congregation.  So in the SB community. . .violence is just as bad.  Remember, these are the same kinds of individuals that pushed for TV ratings for every show on TV.  So it's not just nudity.

So , Jayne how does your father react to your tasteful nudes

IvyLynn wrote:
My problem with all this is that Playboy is BARELY even considered porn these days. It's more of an artsy nude mag. Now Hustler, Gent, Swank, Genesis, ect., that's PORN. I love porn, I love Playboy. I love them both for compleatly different reasons.

It's so wierd to think people are getting so bent out of shape over Playboy still. I'd be proud of my kids in whatever they do as long as they didn't have to have sex with someone in order to get there. Playboy doesn't even do toys, fingers, or other people. I don't see the problem with it.

So are you saying that you honestly believe there is no "casting couch" for Playboy?  Hmmm.  Interesting.  Almost as interesting as the concept that there are no GWC's.

UnoMundo Photography wrote:

So , Jayne how does your father react to your tasteful nudes

I'm not disowned.  He understands that God and I are in charge of my life.  He's not happy about it at all, but he knows he can't control what I do.

Jayne Jones wrote:
The choices you make are your own.  I'm sure Holley's hometown and family values didn't just magically mutate into what they are now overnight.  No doubt she's grown up with that her entire life.  I would like to think that she's a grown woman and can make her own decisions.  Unfortunately, all decsions have consequences.

Yes, all decisions have consequences.  If you decide to be naked in Alabama, you should be prepared to be hated by "God's children".  I guess we should all be celebrating the fact that at least we don't make women wear burqas (although burqas probably didn't happen overnight either).

Jayne Jones wrote:
My father is a minister.  His father is a Theologist.  My mother is actively involved in the church.  Get where I'm going with this??  Every decision I make has an impact on them.

My point is that her modeling for Playboy doesn't have an impact on them.  Their reaction isn't coming from her, it's coming from within them.  It's their own self-righteous intolerant mob mentality bubbling to the surface.    By "them", I mean everyone in the town who feels like she did something evil (not just her parents).

The idea that she should accept the consequences of her actions is hollow as it would be if you were telling that to the people who are publicly executed in front of cheering crowds in Afghanistan for having the audacity to believe something different than what the religious leaders declare to be the truth.

IvyLynn wrote:
My problem with all this is that Playboy is BARELY even considered porn these days. It's more of an artsy nude mag.

If that's art... the cartoons maybe... the photography... it's posturing. It's trying to be something it is no longer and trying to stay in business in changed times. I haven't heard of anyone having fun on a Playboy shoot since the 60's.

luv2bfitt wrote:
I believe that some people of the christian faith need to remember that god has already forgiven them for their "sins"
   So personally, I think God's answer will be, "No Problem..."

that's pretty simplistic, and wrong, in my opinion (you're forgiven when you repent, not do nothing or ask for forgiveness without any plans on not doing the same action in the future)

There are those who would say Tom DeLay lost his job as House majority leader because he was indicted by a Texas grand jury for money laundering and conspiracy, or because of his extensive ties to lawbreaking lobbyist Jack Abramoff. But they would be wrong.

In fact, the Texas Republican fell from power because he is a Christian.

That, at least, is the view of Rick Scarborough, convener of a conference this week called "The War on Christians."

"I believe the most damaging thing that Tom DeLay has done in his life is take his faith seriously into public office, which made him a target for all those who despise the cause of Christ," Scarborough said, introducing DeLay on Tuesday. When DeLay finished, the host reminded the politician: "God always does his best work right after a crucifixion."

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.c … HVJNE1.DTL

Dave Krueger wrote:
The idea that she should accept the consequences of her actions is hollow as it would be if you were telling that to the people who are publicly executed in front of cheering crowds in Afghanistan for having the audacity to believe something different than what the religious leaders declare to be the truth.

Every action has a consequence.  Some good.  Some bad.  That's just how life is.  You should weigh that out before you perform the action.

Dave Krueger wrote:
Holley Dorrough, a small town Alabama girl (MM 8932), is featured as the April centerfold in Playboy.  There may be one or two models on here who would characterize that as no small accomplishment.  Maybe even something to write home about.

But, according to a story in the Birmingham News, Holley's Southern Baptist parents cried for two months when Holley told them about it, her mother saying, "...she'll have to answer to the Lord for what she's done...".  Her father reportedly took it the hardest.

In letters to the local news paper, one high school librarian wrote that her students were disgusted and one of Holley's high school teachers wrote  asking Holley not to ever mention where she went to high school for fear of the shame it will bring to the school.  It goes on and on.

Here is the story

Sorry folks, but the attitude toward sex and nudity in this fucking country is so juvenile that it borders on insanity.  Add to that, a healthy dose of guilt dipped in fanatical religious hypocrisy (the South's most important export) and you have a shining example the kind of hate filled mind control so typical of all of "God's chosen people" everywhere on the planet.

I find it disturbing, in the extreme, that a girl should attain an enviable measure of celebrity and success only to be persecuted by the community where she grew up.  It makes me ashamed to be a part of this backward, zealot-dominated state.

*end of rant*

-Dave

FabioTovar wrote:
Not to be a buzzkill or anything but put yourself in the PARENTS shoes.
Forget "god" and religion.. all that aside....

If you had a daughter (don't know if you do)  would you be proud she was getting into the porn industry?

and please don't start with the playboy isnt porn crap. It is what it is. Just considered high profile porn.

If I had a daughter.... I think I would cry too.  I think MOST parents would want their children to aspire for something BETTER than posing nude....?????  But that's just me what the F do I know.

I agree with you Fabio, I would be devestated if it were my daughter.  I think people need to understand that people have different standards and values, we do not all share the same values and the ones you are brought up with are the ones your parents expect you to have forever....it doesnt happen that way but we all raise our kids in our own value system.

Like an extreme environmentalist raising a a kid that grows up a logger....or an extreme left wing radical raising a kid that grows up to be a right wing Rush Limbaugh fan....its a dissapointment to have your offspring stray so far away from your point of view and way of life but it happens.  People that think posing for Playboy is a good thing just need to be more open minded and understand that not everyone believes just as you do.  People have the right to be upset about what their children do, you invest your life raising them with your values.