BCG wrote:
what mother would let her child shoot like this and what photographer would accept this type of shoot???

The ones involved in the shoot. BTW, and you might wanna sit down for this, but,,,,,,,the girls of the same age or actually even younger( I recall in the past some as young as 13-14) have done  some work with Victorias Secret even.

Glamour Boulevard wrote:

The ones involved in the shoot. BTW, and you might wanna sit down for this, but,,,,,,,the girls of the same age or actually even younger( I recall in the past some as young as 13-14) have done  some work with Victorias Secret even.

better yet, girls this age and younger are HAVING SEX.

they're not just looking sexy. they're SEXING.

Synthetic Shadows wrote:

better yet, girls this age and younger are HAVING SEX.

they're not just looking sexy. they're SEXING.

Yea, I know, but the subject was modeling, not sexual habits,lol.

Glamour Boulevard wrote:

Yea, I know, but the subject was modeling, not sexual habits,lol.

Which in some way means that they can express their their sexuality by having orgies, live and celebrate their sexuality, but can't express themself in a fashionshoot.

Weird, isn't it?

Hartsoe wrote:
I would accept this kind of shoot... No problem at all...

Yes but you don't live in america...land of the lawsuit.

lll wrote:
Ever read Vogue?  W?  Cosmopolitan?

Lots of the girls in there are in their teens.  What's the problem now?

This is what I am saying, if you can get into vogue at 16. DO IT, but if it is for joe schmo photo down block, don't.

Nemi wrote:

Yes but you don't live in america...land of the lawsuit.

and defiled youth

Nemi wrote:

Yes but you don't live in america...land of the lawsuit.

Exactly... and still most of our teens are no gun carrying maniacs or gangbangers. Cool - huh?

UdoR wrote:

Which in some way means that they can express their their sexuality by having orgies, live and celebrate their sexuality, but can't express themself in a fashionshoot.

Weird, isn't it?

Oh the irony

BCG wrote:

and defiled youth

Either that or overenlongated youth...

Brian Diaz wrote:

Either that or overenlongated youth...

This reminds of an essay a model I once knew  wrote for her human sexuality class. The basic idea behind her essay which got her an A was" Is todays world full of pedophiles and underage sluts , or are things just coming full circle", meaning are things just going back to how they used to be. I will see if I can find this model again and see if I can gert a copy of the essay.

Nemi wrote:

Yes but you don't live in america...land of the lawsuit.

But in a way, it's also... america...land of the double standard. designers create the clothes, clients market them, photographers aid in the marketing, and young girls (12, 13 and up) buy them and wear them. schools set dress codes and these are ignored and flaunted on a regular basis because our consumer society pushes the styles. then, when a 16 year old wants to cash in on her looks and "model" the clothing, discussions like this take place. there is a contradiction here someplace.

Hartsoe wrote:

Exactly... and still most of our teens are no gun carrying maniacs or gangbangers. Cool - huh?

let us not get into comparing countries mien photographer.

jac3950 wrote:
schools set dress codes and these are ignored and flaunted on a regular basis because our consumer society pushes the styles.

I was in for a big shock when I moved from Ohio to California and saw what the girls were allowed to wear to school. Stuff which would have gotten girls sent home or in some cases suspended for wearing to school when I was in highschool and junior high. I have seen girls in boy shorts, skirts cut just under the butt cheeks, garters and fishnet thigh high stockings with stilleto heels,form fitting tops showing lots of cleavage, form fitting thin material tops without bras underneath, halter tops just big enough to cover their breasts, and makeup so thick it looks like it was put on with a putty knife, etc.

BCG wrote:

let us not get into comparing countries mien photographer.

Nahhh - I will lose immideate when it comes to size and population...

Glamour Boulevard wrote:

I was in for a big shock when I moved from Ohio to California and saw what the girls were allowed to wear to school. Stuff which would have gotten girls sent home or in some cases suspended for wearing to school when I was in highschool and junior high. I have seen girls in boy shorts, skirts cut just under the butt cheeks, garters and fishnet thigh high stockings with stilleto heels,form fitting tops showing lots of cleavage, form fitting thin material tops without bras underneath, halter tops just big enough to cover their breasts, and makeup so thick it looks like it was put on with a putty knife, etc.

You haven't been back to Ohio in awhile have you?  It's that way here.  The bus stop just down the street from my home, on the corner, could pass as a street corner for hookers, these are junior high girls and they look like hookers!  One of the girls came to the house one day to 'hang out' with my daughter, I told her to go home and come back when she put some clothes on!  I said do your parents know you dress like that?  Her response was, my mom bought the outfit for my birthday.  She was wearing a skin tight, SHORT skirt, that was slight at the front of the thigh and went up to about wear the leg of her underwear would be.  A tube top that JUST covered her breasts and 6 inch stripper shoes!  She had on enough make-up for 3 people....no way did I want that in my home....people might talk!!!!!  needless to say i got a very nasty phone call from her mother...oh well.

BasementStudios wrote:

You haven't been back to Ohio in awhile have you?  It's that way here.  The bus stop just down the street from my home, on the corner, could pass as a street corner for hookers, these are junior high girls and they look like hookers!  One of the girls came to the house one day to 'hang out' with my daughter, I told her to go home and come back when she put some clothes on!  I said do your parents know you dress like that?  Her response was, my mom bought the outfit for my birthday.  She was wearing a skin tight, SHORT skirt, that was slight at the front of the thigh and went up to about wear the leg of her underwear would be.  A tube top that JUST covered her breasts and 6 inch stripper shoes!  She had on enough make-up for 3 people....no way did I want that in my home....people might talk!!!!!  needless to say i got a very nasty phone call from her mother...oh well.

Don't blame the kids, they don't know any better.

Nemi wrote:

Don't blame the kids, they don't know any better.

Oh I don't blame the kids, they're just being kids, they have to be guided by the adults, but I do blame the parents.....they let the kids run around like this then wonder why their daughter is pregnant at 14!

BasementStudios wrote:
You haven't been back to Ohio in awhile have you?

I am 33, so I have not been in school for a while. I also moved from Ohio in 98.And even back in 98 when my nieces were about to become teenagers or were young teenagers back then, that sort of stuff was never allowed.

A lot of things have changed back there from what I see. For one thing, it seemed that as soon as I moved, all SORTS of models came out of the woodwork allover Ohio and especially my home town of Censornati.

DawnElizabeth Moderator wrote:
Another one about underage and sexy or nude?

Personally, I wouldn't accept a shoot like that nor would I allow my daughter to participate. But, I can understand how it is the norm in the workd of high fashion and print. ANd some parents are okay with this and some are not okay.

you hit the nail on the head Dawn...when did the pre and early teens become "norm" or the set "standard" for women???

BasementStudios wrote:

Oh I don't blame the kids, they're just being kids, they have to be guided by the adults, but I do blame the parents.....they let the kids run around like this then wonder why their daughter is pregnant at 14!

I meant by kicking the girl out....When I was younger I was running around looking like a  little hooker child and I didn't even realize it...The same thing happened to me once, my friends parents kicked me out of their house and forbid me to hang out with their daughter...Little did the parents know, I might have looked like a ho...but their daughter actually was one.

Glamour Boulevard wrote:

BasementStudios wrote:

Glamour Boulevard wrote:
You haven't been back to Ohio in awhile have you?

I am 33, so I have not been in school for a while. I also moved from Ohio in 98.And even back in 98 when my nieces were about to become teenagers or were young teenagers back then, that sort of stuff was never allowed.

A lot of things have changed back there from what I see. For one thing, it seemed that as soon as I moved, all SORTS of models came out of the woodwork allover Ohio and especially my home town of Censornati.

Censornati!  That's a good one!

Yes things have definately changed around here.  There's a ton of 'teen models' around Ohio now.  There has also been quite a few arrests made around Ohio from the teen model sites.....some very questionable images.....they nailed on guy that had a site similar to that Webe Models guy in Florida....running a site for 10 - 12 year old girls and adult lingerie...etc

BCG wrote:

you hit the nail on the head Dawn...when did the pre and early teens become "norm" or the set "standard" for women???

Because most of the fashion designers are gay and they like that little boy straight and narrow look. If it was up to the average male the fashion models would be look like .... well playboy models.

Nemi wrote:

I meant by kicking the girl out....When I was younger I was running around looking like a  little hooker child and I didn't even realize it...The same thing happened to me once, my friends parents kicked me out of their house and forbid me to hang out with their daughter...Little did the parents know, I might have looked like a ho...but their daughter actually was one.

Well, different case, I didn't forbid her from hanging out with my daughter, she's really a very nice kid, very polite well mannered, so on, but I personally did not want to look at her dressed that way, just like when something is on TV that I don't care to look at, I change the channel.  She is welcome in my home anytime, as long as she has clothes on.

Terry Breedlove wrote:

Because most of the fashion designers are gay and they like that little boy straight and narrow look. If it was up to the average male the fashion models would be look like .... well playboy models.

Hehe.

BasementStudios wrote:
Censornati!  That's a good one!

It was dubbed that nick name partly as a result of the Maplethorpe exhibit in which the cincinnati police threatened to arrest not only the gallery owners but anyone who went to VIEW the exhibit.

Glamour Boulevard wrote:

It was dubbed that nick name partly as a result of the Maplethorpe exhibit in which the cincinnati police threatened to arrest not only the gallery owners but anyone who went to VIEW the exhibit.

Dam, I think I'm going to use that one too!

Nemi wrote:
Little did the parents know, I might have looked like a ho...but their daughter actually was one.

Oops!

Shayuma wrote:

Dam, I think I'm going to use that one too!

lol. It is one of the reasons you couldn`t PAY me to move back there. It had a great art community but on the other hand the local Government was way too conservative, especially where art was concerned.

Brian Diaz wrote:
Juliet (as in Romeo and...) was 13.

Hmmm...  Fictitious characters...  By the way how did that story end?  I would have no probelms if the age of consent in this country were 16 - but it isn't...  I don't accept shoots from minors - regardless of parental release or not...  Modeling is a very obbjective profession...  In order to acheive some success the models have to jump through all kinds of hoops - this isn't child's play...

Terry Breedlove wrote:
Because most of the fashion designers are gay and they like that little boy straight and narrow look. If it was up to the average male the fashion models would be look like .... well playboy models.

Sorry, you are wrong Terry!

Young fashionmodels are being chosen for their female attributes and usually have a height and body proportion that is the one of a slender, adult female.

A thirteen years old, with the proper makeup and lighting as well as clothing, looks like a 19/20 years old young woman, and that's who they are marketing to.

Because of the makeup artistry, that underaged teenager portraits a young adult until she is way over the age she's being portraying.

At age 29, they make her look like 22, and then the cut off is near.

To summarize, what they are looking for is to develop a model, and face recognition that caters to the looks of a 20 years old for (in this example) 15/16 years.

To develop a model like that, it's a lot of time and money and often, when they use a model of "her age", she doesn't have that long of a time in the industry, as opposed a very young model, that they can make look much older...