Mayanlee wrote:
You should really rephrase the "wannabe" into "nevergonnabe."  They're just not smart enough to realize it yet.

APPLAUSE ... APPLAUSE!!

What we need is a photographer's flake wall.  If a model flakes or is basically stupid, place her MM number on the wall.   This goes also for PWC (Pervs With Cams).

Somewhere we need to be able to educate these people to go hard or go home, that MM is not a MySpace and that childish BS doesnt belong here.  LOL  Like the NeverGonnaBe with cameraphone pics screening me to see how much I spent on my cameras, while she has had the same crap up for 3 months now.  Gurls like her need a wall so that we can just make fun of them.

Jeff Genung wrote:
No more TFCD or TFP stuff for me. I am sick of models either not showing up or wanting to play f-ing phone tag or not reading their e-mail.

If you want to be professional then SHOW UP. If you want to be paid ever, then READ YOUR EMAIL.

I have too many paying clients and friends that will happily let me run an extra roll of film with to try something new to bother with you any more.

I am giving myself ulcers attempting to be nice to women that I would love to have model for me. I am giving myself headaches attempting to bend over backwards to accomodate your wishes and schedules. My fingers are raw from e-mailing into a black hole that I never hear back from. My ear is in pain from listening to your phone ring when you never answer it. My forehead bleeds from banging it against the wall to rid myself of your stupidity.

Like I said a few weeks ago in a thread, "Photographers are a dime a dozen" and you have just proven my point again.

Models get all kinds of offers so they can shit on who they feel like.

E Patrick Williams wrote:
I'm tired with dealing with dumb ass photographers who never give you ur damn photos! Is it that hard to put some pictures on a cd?!?!?! Shit takes like 5 min. I'm tired of this bullshit, I haven't done any shoots in awhile and haven't been to this site for awhile cause i'm sick of it.

A great case in point...super bright models who have no idea what we as photographers go through!

Do you know how many images we might take @ a shoot? 600? Maybe a thousand? Maybe more, who knows!?!

Do you know how long it takes to go through the images? To work with them in photoshop? Takes more than five minutes brother!

Michael Barrett wrote:

A great case in point...super bright models who have no idea what we as photographers go through!

Do you know how many images we might take @ a shoot? 600? Maybe a thousand? Maybe more, who knows!?!

Do you know how long it takes to go through the images? To work with them in photoshop? Takes more than five minutes brother!

It can be argued that a photographer who takes 600-1000 images in a session is making more work for himself without gaining much in the way of useable material.

Mikel Featherston wrote:

Michael,

I looked over your portfolio, and I think I found your problem. You use a Nikon camera. Guaranteed to make models flake.

HEY!!

DigitalCMH wrote:

HEY!!

You overcome your camera-handicap with a sparkling personality.

Mikel Featherston wrote:

Michael,

I looked over your portfolio, and I think I found your problem. You use a Nikon camera. Guaranteed to make models flake.

Heyyyyyyy. I resent that(lol).

Click Hamilton wrote:
Except for one psycho meth addict who I misjudged, everyone who models for me has been kind, polite, thoughtful, motivated, responsible and a pleasure to work with. Trying to help the tweeker was my mistake, so I failed in my efforts to reach out.

There are nice people everywhere. Choose carefully to improve your quality of life. It's not a matter of money or TFP, etc. It's a character issue.

I am not a tweeker!  I kept telling you I don't want to model and I certainly don't want to model naked, even if artistically.

Mikel Featherston wrote:

You overcome your camera-handicap with a sparkling personality.

Nice save   How's the printer?

Dr Molly Black wrote:
I think it's just because I'm lucky and careful about my choices. At least I hope that's why!

It's because people know what a pain it is to get in and see the doctor. They don't want to miss their appointment and have to reschedule.

STANLEY LAFLEUR wrote:

what kind of editing are you expecting i am just confused... cuz u people get confused.... between editing and airbrushed.....

EDITING MEANS... GETTING RID OF THE BAD PICTURES( OUT OF FOCUS, BLURED, EYES WIDE SHUT)

Nope, that's culling. Editing is getting the images you DO like to a point where you don't mind other people seeing them, and they're ready to print out. If that includes "airbrushing", so be it. For me, it means tweaking levels, saturating/adjusting colour (or making it b&w), straightening/cropping, and anything else necessary- and it takes a long time. A raw digital file is just a 'negative'. Necessary, but hardly a finished product.

Jeff Genung wrote:

So far its the amateurs that have done great for me and the "professionals" that are the screwups.

Real genuine professional models are one thing but the wannabes are driving me loopy....

If you want a "Professional" model go thru an agency.  Like anything else on the internet, Caveat Emptor.

J n X Photography wrote:

If you want a "Professional" model go thru an agency.  Like anything else on the internet, Caveat Emptor.

Professionals are good it's the "Professionals" that are wiggy--and yeah--you are 100% correct.

Jeff Genung wrote:
No more TFCD or TFP stuff for me. I am sick of models either not showing up or wanting to play f-ing phone tag or not reading their e-mail.


I am giving myself ulcers attempting to be nice to women that I would love to have model for me. I am giving myself headaches attempting to bend over backwards to accomodate your wishes and schedules. My fingers are raw from e-mailing into a black hole that I never hear back from. My ear is in pain from listening to your phone ring when you never answer it. My forehead bleeds from banging it against the wall to rid myself of your stupidity.

Now Jeff, a word of warning.

You've made a very dramatic goodbye to TFP MM models posting. I'd give it a 7.5 on a scale of 1 to 10.  You'll probably have generated 140 postings on your thread once it's done. (500+ if someone somehow figures how to introduce religion nudity or audrey into the thread).

So, here's the warning. 

We better not see in your profile a request to work with models TFP or read that you're in the casting section, you looking for models for trade!

Jeff Genung wrote:
No more TFCD or TFP stuff for me. I am sick of models either not showing up or wanting to play f-ing phone tag or not reading their e-mail.

If you want to be professional then SHOW UP. If you want to be paid ever, then READ YOUR EMAIL.

I have too many paying clients and friends that will happily let me run an extra roll of film with to try something new to bother with you any more.

I am giving myself ulcers attempting to be nice to women that I would love to have model for me. I am giving myself headaches attempting to bend over backwards to accomodate your wishes and schedules. My fingers are raw from e-mailing into a black hole that I never hear back from. My ear is in pain from listening to your phone ring when you never answer it. My forehead bleeds from banging it against the wall to rid myself of your stupidity.

Funny, I have this problem with photographers. They set up a shoot then cancel on me last minute coming up with the oddest excuses or saying they need to "postpone" only to never set up a new date. I am always professional, always on time, usually early (unless I get lost in which case I  call).. I know and have seen first hand that models do it too but this isn't a one way street.

Jeff Genung wrote:
I still think I need to show up at next shoot with 20lb tripod with a Holga on it.

Pentax 110 on a camera stand.

Just Shoot Me Photograp wrote:
Jeff you ever think that they may not like your work?It is not that great.But that is just me.

There's always one in every group.  These are models who have accepted  a
shoot and then flake.  The 'quality' or lack of 'quality' of a photographers work
often has little to do with models being reliable.  Many of the models here are
young.  Most aren't serious and even if they were wouldn't be hired to pass
out flyers at a mall.  To be taken serious you have to do little things like respond
quickly to emails and  return calls, hell show up.  I have a casting call for Chicago
area models.  One part of the shoot pays $75.00 and you wouldn't believe the
responses I've gotten.  When and I do mean some of the models have returned
calls they act like they are from Venus or Mars.  One of my friends owns a clothing
store and is always telling me about people she hires.  She starts them at
$10.00 per hour and while thats not a lot its better then McDonald's.  Most
come late after the first week.  Some are always on their cell phones.  Several
stole and one snuck her boyfriend and was... well the point is its sad.  I have
limited funds and I'm sorta stuck trying to use Internet models and while many
have been professional and polite they are so in the minority you could say they
don't exist.

Just Shoot Me Photograp wrote:
Jeff you ever think that they may not like your work?It is not that great.But that is just me.

s'ok -- While I work in film, I have a book of prints to show clients who want a specific look. I guarantee that silver and palladium prints look better in person than as a shitty digital image. I don't do nude stuff so you may not understand that a lot of people who want to have a portrait done of them or a daughter or family aren't looking to have pictures of their boobies hanging on the wall.

Michael Raveney wrote:
I must say I have never had that happen to me, I seem to be the one at times flaking more than anything, and some models MUA or stylists have complained about me not getting back to them.

In going over the photographers comments on this topic I see that most do this as a hobby or as an art outlet and the subjects are amateurs at best, so to be fair...I think that it is one of those things you have to accept as part of the process, that those you call models are not so, but subjects you wish to photograph and are not agency working models. So other than you getting your time wasted, they have no worries about losing out, as after all, it’s not their job or reputation on the line.

Now I know in the fashion world we due tend to get distracted by parties, late night events etc…. so I am not saying it is perfect, but I know models that will be up all night and sleep three hours and show up on set looking like they need a spot in NYLON magazine! And that is frustrating…but they do show!

M.

Very true as is how much location plays a part.  I know a good looking younger
photographer that doesn't seem to have a flake problem but he goes to
lots of parties and he's pretty popular.  There are no consequences to not showing
and  any model showing some boob or butt gets hundreds of offers.  We can
complain all day it ain't gone change.

Rossi Photography wrote:

I agree. Also, I think models get too used to TFCD shoots and never want to actually pay a photographer. I've always been very particular about doing those shoots and have done only a few. My time is freeing up a bit for about a month and there are a few ideas I want to do and have just recently decided I'd be open to doing a some TFCD work...But, Because I've known so many photographers complain about no shows, etc..I'm charging a deposit to be paid before the shoot is booked, to ensure my time isn't wasted.

Tony Lawrence wrote:

Very true as is how much location plays a part.  I know a good looking younger
photographer that doesn't seem to have a flake problem but he goes to
lots of parties and he's pretty popular.  There are no consequences to not showing
and  any model showing some boob or butt gets hundreds of offers.  We can
complain all day it ain't gone change.

almost thought you were speaking about me! HA!

E Patrick Williams wrote:

please... my pictures are never edited when i get them even when the photographer says he/she is gonna edit them. The only editing that get's done on my pics are resizing them so i can't get them printed out which pisses me the fuck off!

They are resized to keep you from printing them because it wasn't a paid shoot so the images are only to be used on the internet.  Try paying for prints to have the quality the photographer shot, not Walgreens crap prints!

Michael Raveney wrote:

almost thought you were speaking about me! HA!

LOL, I suspect you are young and I'm sure a good looking guy.  One thing
photographers have to consider is that people feel if somethings free it has
no value.  That may not be true but I think it tends to work that way.  Free
shoots to many models means a photographer isn't that good or desperate to
shoot.  I remember a old story about someone throwing away a old couch.
They put a sign on it that said free for the taking but nobody took it.  They
replaced it with a sign saying $100.00 it was taken in less then a hour.
Many people simply feel free means your works worthless.   Then to add
to that feeling some photographers are willing to drive to pick the model up
and make a million calls to see if she is still willing to shoot.  STOP. 
Your time is valuable too.  Call and email a model once or twice, if she doesn't
call back or email you move on.  The day of the shoot have her call and confirm
not you calling and almost pleading for her to shoot.  In other words have
a damm backbone.  Have models offer the same respect you give them.