Jeff Genung wrote:
No more TFCD or TFP stuff for me. I am sick of models either not showing up or wanting to play f-ing phone tag or not reading their e-mail.

If you want to be professional then SHOW UP. If you want to be paid ever, then READ YOUR EMAIL.

I have too many paying clients and friends that will happily let me run an extra roll of film with to try something new to bother with you any more.

I am giving myself ulcers attempting to be nice to women that I would love to have model for me. I am giving myself headaches attempting to bend over backwards to accomodate your wishes and schedules. My fingers are raw from e-mailing into a black hole that I never hear back from. My ear is in pain from listening to your phone ring when you never answer it. My forehead bleeds from banging it against the wall to rid myself of your stupidity.

Right on you said a true mouth full

ravens laughter wrote:
have I got a resource for you!!!


http://www.realdoll.com/

Got a great shot of a girl smoking the other day, if I could get a realdoll that smoked, I might head that way. $5000 bux worth of real doll or $5000 bux worth of Tagamet...hmmm

Jay Bowman wrote:
Still, I've found that many models who don't do this professionally to be on time, ready and eager to work, and very dedicated.  Perhaps you just need to set things straight long before the shoot...

So far its the amateurs that have done great for me and the "professionals" that are the screwups.

Real genuine professional models are one thing but the wannabes are driving me loopy....

ntyme photography wrote:
I can relate to what you're saying. It seems the ones that pay are the ones that show most tymes. People, including "models," put a value on money. If they are willing to pay, they usually have more respect for your time and they're. That's why I do a limited amount of tfcd work. Maybe photographers need to cut back on the number of tfcd work that they do, then "models" will place more value on a shoot when they are able to get one.

I agree. Also, I think models get too used to TFCD shoots and never want to actually pay a photographer. I've always been very particular about doing those shoots and have done only a few. My time is freeing up a bit for about a month and there are a few ideas I want to do and have just recently decided I'd be open to doing a some TFCD work...But, Because I've known so many photographers complain about no shows, etc..I'm charging a deposit to be paid before the shoot is booked, to ensure my time isn't wasted.

Michael Barrett wrote:
Wow...I posted something similiar a couple of weeks ago about no-shows and how models demand so much, but have no idea what we go through...

And some told me to stop whining!

See? I'm not alone...don't give up!

Michael,

I looked over your portfolio, and I think I found your problem. You use a Nikon camera. Guaranteed to make models flake.

Mikel Featherston wrote:
Michael,

I looked over your portfolio, and I think I found your problem. You use a Nikon camera. Guaranteed to make models flake.

Hey...can't afford the big guns...yet!

ravens laughter wrote:
have I got a resource for you!!!
http://www.realdoll.com/

Kaori & Jenny look pretty good. I wonder if they can get me into the Diamond Lane?

Hamza wrote:
Stop the crying! 

Wahhh!!!!!


Poor baby, models from the internet flaked?  You don't say?

I knew we could rely on you for your compassionate viewpoint.

E Patrick Williams wrote:
I'm tired with dealing with dumb ass photographers who never give you ur damn photos! Is it that hard to put some pictures on a cd?!?!?! Shit takes like 5 min. I'm tired of this bullshit, I haven't done any shoots in awhile and haven't been to this site for awhile cause i'm sick of it.

5 mins? Hmm. Perhaps I should have you do my editing for me.

Stephen Melvin wrote:

5 mins? Hmm. Perhaps I should have you do my editing for me.

please... my pictures are never edited when i get them even when the photographer says he/she is gonna edit them. The only editing that get's done on my pics are resizing them so i can't get them printed out which pisses me the fuck off!

E Patrick Williams wrote:

please... my pictures are never edited when i get them even when the photographer says he/she is gonna edit them. The only editing that get's done on my pics are resizing them so i can't get them printed out which pisses me the fuck off!

Damn! How much are you paying for that poor service?

Tony Lawrence wrote:
I feel you.  Its a bad part of the internet in general.  Models are able to
upload images for free and have nothing invested so showing up or calling
means very little to them.  I do a kind of phone interview where I try and
get a ideal of a models interest.  I ask casual questions that aren't really so
casual.  Like how many people you've shot with?   Do you have a comp card?
Where do you want to go with modeling?  If a model is really interested she will
usually sound excited.  I dismiss models who seem distracted or bored.  None
of this is easy but there are a small number of serious models here.  Where they
are is anybodies guess.

I agree 100% with Tony , it's really all about your screening process. You need to hone that down to a fine art into itself.

First e-mail : Hi - checked your post / site , please have a look at my site , if you like my style please contact me off MM at XXX.mail.com

Second Email ( off MM) : What is it you liked about my style and or what image could you see yourself in ?

Third e-mail: Lets set up a meeting to go over details , pick a shoot date, review written agreement. I am available ......

Two or three day delay between e-mails ---> Drop it , modeling is just a passing hobby, not serious enough about making great images to bother wasting my time.

Every June a whole crop of fine looking 18 year olds are looking to become a models. After the first e-mail , if model does not make it off the MM server about a 98% chance your in the flake zone.

You get what your membership cost you here on MM :-)

Good luck

Mikel Featherston wrote:

Damn! How much are you paying for that poor service?

Well u got me there... but still photographers should still take things serious not just brushing things off cause u didn't get paid.

Tony Lawrence wrote:
I feel you.  Its a bad part of the internet in general.  Models are able to
upload images for free and have nothing invested so showing up or calling
means very little to them.  I do a kind of phone interview where I try and
get a ideal of a models interest.  I ask casual questions that aren't really so
casual.  Like how many people you've shot with?   Do you have a comp card?
Where do you want to go with modeling?  If a model is really interested she will
usually sound excited.  I dismiss models who seem distracted or bored.  None
of this is easy but there are a small number of serious models here.  Where they
are is anybodies guess.

I agree 100% with Tony , it's really all about your screening process. You need to hone that down to a fine art into itself.

First e-mail : Hi - checked your post / site , please have a look at my site , if you like my style please contact me off MM at XXX.mail.com

Second Email ( off MM) : What is it you liked about my style and or what image could you see yourself in ?

Third e-mail: Lets set up a meeting to go over details , pick a shoot date, review written agreement. I am available ......

Two or three day delay between e-mails ---> Drop it , modeling is just a passing hobby, not serious enough about making great images to bother wasting my time.

Every June a whole crop of fine looking 18 year olds are looking to become a models. After the first e-mail , if model does not make it off the MM server about a 98% chance your in the flake zone.

You get what your membership cost you here on MM :-)

Good luck

E Patrick Williams wrote:

Well u got me there... but still photographers should still take things serious not just brushing things off cause u didn't get paid.

You are absolutely right. They *should* take things seriously. They *should* provide what they promise. Did you enter into a contract with any of the photographers you have worked with? Is there a written agreement stating what compensation you are being given for your time and effort? What time frame are you talking about? How long after the shoot have you waited for images? Depending on the image, it can take 5 minutes, it can take 8 hours, although most 8 hour jobs should just be tossed in the trash, as the image was probably too broken to begin with if it takes that much work to 'fix'. Unless the point is to heavily manipulate it.

E Patrick Williams wrote:

please... my pictures are never edited when i get them

what kind of editing are you expecting i am just confused... cuz u people get confused.... between editing and airbrushed.....

EDITING MEANS... GETTING RID OF THE BAD PICTURES( OUT OF FOCUS, BLURED, EYES WIDE SHUT)

Afablb wrote:
Two or three day delay between e-mails ---> Drop it , modeling is just a passing hobby, not serious enough about making great images to bother wasting my time.

You get what your membership cost you here on MM :-)

One of my flaked models showed me MM so at least I got that out of it.

I definitely think you are right on the money about screening. I just can't afford the time not to do it better than I have been and need to get a better set of questions down. So part of the problem I will lay at my own feet.

I need to quit sniffing the Dektol and start sniffing flakes before they piss me off.

Jeff Genung wrote:
So far its the amateurs that have done great for me and the "professionals" that are the screwups.

Real genuine professional models are one thing but the wannabes are driving me loopy....

is that kind of like:

You better cut the pizza in four pieces because I'm not hungry enough to eat six.

When you come to a fork in the road, take it.

The future ain't what it used to be.

A nickel ain't worth a dime anymore.

It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future.

I knew I was going to take the wrong train, so I left early.

Nobody goes there anymore because it's too crowded.

You've got to be very careful if you don't know where you are going because you might not get there.

I don't want to make the wrong mistake.

You can observe a lot just by watchin'

Always go to other people's funerals; otherwise, they won't go to yours.

Never answer an anonymous letter.

We made too many wrong mistakes.

When asked what time it is: "Do you mean now?"

I usually take a two hour nap from one to four.

I never said most of the things I said.

--face reality

Jeff Genung wrote:

I definitely think you are right on the money about screening. I just can't afford the time not to do it better than I have been and need to get a better set of questions down. So part of the problem I will lay at my own feet.

Very proud of you Jeff, takes a true master to say I am doing something wrong and will now work at fixing it !

Kinda bold still working in film at $ 100+ a session with TFCD, I hung out in the film world too long also....nothing like a quick card reader and an hour later in photoshop your about 98% of what it takes with processing .... in the end your wallet will stay lots thicker.

Best regards,

FA

Jeff Genung wrote:
I have too many paying clients and friends that will happily let me run an extra roll of film with to try something new to bother with you any more.

All these folks with too many paying clients....I must be in the wrong geographic location..

anyway, with all these payers and friends, why would you EVER contemplate or have to work with other people.

Plus, since you have too many paying clients, maybe you can pay more models to work with you and therefore not have to worry about trades!