Focuspuller wrote:
Absolutely nothing to worry about, folks. As Medal of Freedom winner Dr. Rush Limbaugh has said,"I want to tell you the truth about the coronavirus.,,, The coronavirus is the common cold, folks."

Oh! now I feel sooo much better!!. let's go back to free travel around the world! The rest of the world is over reacting!
We are the leaders we know better!! maybe just get extra boxes of tissues if need be...….

IMAGINERIES wrote:

Oh! now I feel sooo much better!!. let's go back to free travel around the world! The rest of the world is over reacting!
We are the leaders we know better!! maybe just get extra boxes of tissues if need be...….

I know you are being sarcastic, but why?  You are making no sense.  First, that isn't a quote from Limbaugh.  That isn't what he said, so apparently you are commenting on Focuspuller's personal views.  Why?
There are a lot of things going on right now.  There is so much new information.  There is a lot of cooperation going on.  You seem to be stuck behind the times in some kind of lie-world that amuses you.  'Not relevant.

Tony From Syracuse wrote:
One thing I feel is under reported, is the skew between the infection rate and the deaths. this virus appears to be very infectious, yet the statistics so far paint a picture of something mass people are getting and by and large are recovering. going by the numbers so far, one could say 80% of the people who are getting this, appear to be getting something that seems far milder than whats being reported.

it would seem, the full weight of the reporting is centered on its infectious abilities. there are exceptions, but by and large, people are getting it, and surviving. 

despite what you hear on the news, that this isnt the flu, sure I get this...the elderly and those with underlying illness are especially susceptible to this...but the thing is, they always are, as those are the usual suspects who tend to die the most during any outbreak of whatever, from swine flu, to the regular flu. in large numbers.

Remember the swine flu in 2009? 60 million Americans infected. 17.000 dead, among them many children and the elderly.
yet this thing they are giving a very lopsided view of it.

It keeps getting repeated that you are at low risk unless you have some combination of being elderly and health issues.

"...they are giving a very lopsided view of it."  Yes, but we have just formulated a new national approach to dealing with pandemics that, if it works, may becomes the basis for future plans.  We may be adjusting our view so that the outcome of something like the H1N1 flu where so many died seems outrageous.  The president will probably start calling shots early rather than waiting around, golfing, and never calling it an emergency.

Focuspuller wrote:
As Medal of Freedom winner Dr. Rush Limbaugh has said,"I want to tell you the truth about the coronavirus.,,, The coronavirus is the common cold, folks."

Fist Full of Ish wrote:
First, that [the above] isn't a quote from Limbaugh.  That isn't what he said....

Here’s the verbatim quote from Rush: “This coronavirus, they’re just — all of this panic is just not warranted. This, I’m telling you, when I tell you — when I’ve told you that this virus is the common cold.“

Fist Full of Ish wrote:
Yes, but we have just formulated a new national approach to dealing with pandemics that, if it works, may becomes the basis for future plans.

I see you’ve got your Dr. Epidemiology hat on again. Allow me a simple response-WTF!!! “A new national approach”!!! “The basis for future plans”!!! Ummmmm...The U.S. is playing catch up with the rest of world as to how to competently handle this current pandemic. The U.S. response is being held up as to what NOT to do. I know. I know. Your obvious political beliefs gives you special insight so you know more than the doctors.

Fist Full of Ish wrote:
[...]First, that isn't a quote from Limbaugh.  [...]

sorry- you're wrong.

transcript from Rush Limbaugh's Feb 24, 2020 broadcast (as published on his own website):  (bolding is mine)

"Folks, this coronavirus thing, I want to try to put this in perspective for you. It looks like the coronavirus is being weaponized as yet another element to bring down Donald Trump. Now, I want to tell you the truth about the coronavirus. (interruption) You think I’m wrong about this? You think I’m missing it by saying that’s… (interruption) Yeah, I’m dead right on this. The coronavirus is the common cold, folks."
    -----Rush Limbaugh
https://www.rushlimbaugh.com/daily/2020 … nst-trump/

rfordphotos wrote:

sorry- you're wrong.

transcript from Rush Limbaugh's Feb 24, 2020 broadcast (as published on his own website):  (bolding is mine)

"Folks, this coronavirus thing, I want to try to put this in perspective for you. It looks like the coronavirus is being weaponized as yet another element to bring down Donald Trump. Now, I want to tell you the truth about the coronavirus. (interruption) You think I’m wrong about this? You think I’m missing it by saying that’s… (interruption) Yeah, I’m dead right on this. The coronavirus is the common cold, folks."
    -----Rush Limbaugh
https://www.rushlimbaugh.com/daily/2020 … nst-trump/

Thanks.  I stand corrected.

Baanthai wrote:
...
I see you’ve got your Dr. Epidemiology hat on again. Allow me a simple response-WTF!!! “A new national approach”!!! “The basis for future plans”!!! Ummmmm...The U.S. is playing catch up with the rest of world as to how to competently handle this current pandemic. The U.S. response is being held up as to what NOT to do. I know. I know. Your obvious political beliefs gives you special insight so you know more than the doctors.

You are dreadfully wrong on all points here.  Yes, a novel, new approach and a model for what we will do in the future.  But you have to be aware of what has transpired yesterday to know what was happening in the previous two weeks. 
YOU are showing obvious political bias.

LightDreams wrote:
Well apparently, a large chunk of the previous "hold-outs" (that didn't understand the seriousness of the situation) have gotten on board over the last week.

The bell curve has seemed to have shifted some but
I know a lot more people that are not taking it seriously
than those that are.

LightDreams wrote:
[...] {just to save space}

Cross your fingers, as the more people that get educated, the better!

Isnt this always the case? In every emergency situation I can remember, the best "medicine" for the "nerves" of the citizens has been clear, concise pertinent information.

Rumors, propaganda, misdirection, outright deliberate misinformation--- just dont serve any good purpose. Inevitably they are exposed as the true facts emerge, and the rumormongers, the liars, the opportunists are exposed, and shown to be the charlatans they are.

We have to get back to a world where it is ok for our leaders to admit--- "hey we dont know yet- we are working on it"

Rather than hollow hopes, admit we dont yet know, tell the truth. The flip side of that is media has to stop beating the hell out of a leader that doesnt have EVERY fact about EVERY situation immediately on hand.

LightDreams wrote:
Well apparently, a large chunk of the previous "hold-outs" (that didn't understand the seriousness of the situation) have gotten on board over the last week.

But according to Quinnipiac University Polling, the last real "die-hards" are apparently older Americans who identify Fox News as their main source of news.  That's a little surprising since, despite their earlier days of downplaying and false comparisons to the regular flu, etc, the Fox News brass are now fully onboard.  The shift is to recognize it as a medical crisis rather than a possible political threat.

The Fox News brass memos to their staff called it a very serious crisis, and have ordered a switch to working from home and using Skype, etc.  Along with major steps to block as many staff and vendors from entering the offices, combined with heavily reduced studio bookings, etc.  They also indicated that they have even more steps coming to deal with the "crisis of this magnitude".

Apparently fewer of the Fox News "talking heads" are still in denial, but they're being pushed to get more realistic as there's been a realization that "the network's coverage could harm their very own viewers".

Cross your fingers, as the more people that get educated, the better!

You obviously don't watch Fox News.  You think there are people changing their stories.  I haven't seen it.  They've been telling a consistent story.  You even show how you use poling of university students to provide you with "truth".  "[the "truth" doesn't surprise you because ... you assume something else]"  'Ridiculous!

rfordphotos wrote:
...

Rumors, propaganda, misdirection, outright deliberate misinformation--- just don't serve any good purpose. Inevitably they are exposed as the true facts emerge, and the rumormongers, the liars, the opportunists are exposed, and shown to be the charlatans they are.

'Darned right!  You just need to pay attention right now.  One side is lying big time, and it's obvious!

Fist Full of Ish wrote:
You obviously don't watch Fox News.  You think there are people changing their stories.  I haven't seen it.  They've been telling a consistent story.  You even show how you use poling of university students to provide you with "truth".  "[the "truth" doesn't surprise you because ... you assume something else]"  'Ridiculous!

Let's stick to facts, shall we?

1)  These are not (to quote you) "poling of university students to provide you with "truth". These are respected national polls.  As Wikipedia describe it, "Quinnipiac University Poll receives national recognition for its independent surveys of residents throughout the United States. It conducts public opinion polls on politics and public policy as a public service as well as for academic research."

2) The Fox News Tucker Carlson shift:  To quote Tucker Carlson (who has the second highest rated show on Fox):  "People you trust — people you probably voted for — have spent weeks minimizing what is clearly a very serious problem,” Carlson told his audience. “Though these people have good intentions as they say this — many of them, anyway ― they may not know any better. Maybe they’re just not paying attention or maybe they believe they’re serving some higher cause by shading reality.”

3) Fox Business Benches Trish Regan After Outcry Over Coronavirus Comments
The host of “Trish Regan Primetime” told viewers this week that concerns about the coronavirus were “yet another attempt to impeach the president.”... etc, etc.  Fox News made a decision to put her show on hiatus "until further notice".  This is not the kind of reaction that they've had in the previous weeks / months to that kind of on air claim.

4) No one (ESPECIALLY Fox News) has disputed the email sent by Fox News Chief Executive Suzanne Scott and Fox News President Jay Wallace and how they described the seriousness of the crisis that we're facing and the emergency orders they issued to all staff.

5) I will ignore your claim that "One side is lying big time, and it's obvious!".  This is about ALL of us, not "one side" or the other.

Others have suggested to you that with your constant baiting and, in this case, claims of "truth" and "ridiculous" doesn't accomplish anything and wouldn't change anyone's mind, or vice versa.  So why not "agree to disagree" and leave it at that?

Or possibly, how about trying to helpful about the situation?  There's a lot at stake for a lot of people.  I know you won't listen to me, but maybe, just maybe, take a bit of advice from Tucker Carlson at Fox News, and/or both the Fox News Chief Executive and the Fox News President?  Or even the more recent approach that is now being taken by the White House?  Or...?

LightDreams wrote:
Let's stick to facts, shall we?

1)  These are not (to quote you) "poling of university students to provide you with "truth". These are respected national polls.  As Wikipedia describe it, "Quinnipiac University Poll receives national recognition for its independent surveys of residents throughout the United States. It conducts public opinion polls on politics and public policy as a public service as well as for academic research."

2) The Fox News Tucker Carlson shift:  To quote Tucker Carlson (who has the second highest rated show on Fox):  "People you trust — people you probably voted for — have spent weeks minimizing what is clearly a very serious problem,” Carlson told his audience. “Though these people have good intentions as they say this — many of them, anyway ― they may not know any better. Maybe they’re just not paying attention or maybe they believe they’re serving some higher cause by shading reality.”

3) Fox Business Benches Trish Regan After Outcry Over Coronavirus Comments
The host of “Trish Regan Primetime” told viewers this week that concerns about the coronavirus were “yet another attempt to impeach the president.”... etc, etc.  Fox News made a decision to put her show on hiatus "until further notice".  This is not the kind of reaction that they've had in the previous weeks / months to that kind of on air claim.

4) No one (ESPECIALLY Fox News) has disputed the email sent by Fox News Chief Executive Suzanne Scott and Fox News President Jay Wallace and how they described the seriousness of the crisis that we're facing and the emergency orders they issued to all staff.

5) I will ignore your claim that "One side is lying big time, and it's obvious!".  This is about ALL of us, not "one side" or the other.

Others have suggested to you that with your constant baiting and, in this case, claims of "truth" and "ridiculous" doesn't accomplish anything and wouldn't change anyone's mind, or vice versa.  So why not "agree to disagree" and leave it at that?

Or possibly, how about trying to helpful about the situation?  There's a lot at stake for a lot of people.  I know you won't listen to me, but maybe, just maybe, take a bit of advice from Tucker Carlson at Fox News, and/or both the Fox News Chief Executive and the Fox News President?  Or even the more recent approach that is now being taken by the White House?  Or...?

1. OK.  The university poll just sounds like a student poll.  I still put little faith in polls.  I also think you inserted some interpretation that I wouldn't agree with.
2. I agree.
3. OK.  I don’t see a problem.
4. The message you speak of: : In email seen by the paper, Fox News’s chief executive, Suzanne Scott, and president, Jay Wallace, wrote: “We are reducing the staff footprint at our headquarters in New York and some of our bureaus and will be instituting telecommuting starting Monday, March 16th for all of those departments capable of doing so.” 
Yeah.  ‘Looks fine to me.
5. OK.  You don't recognize the sides.  I think we're good.

I don't really have much difference with you except on your first point.  We can agree to disagree on that.

I haven't been "baiting" anyone.  Maybe it's you who are doing that, 'cause it isn't me?

Your last paragraph fails because the one major thing that I'm not going to "listen" to you about is your interpretation of the polls.  Also, I'm fine with your points on Fox, and certainly the WH.

Hunter  GWPB wrote:
From day one, this has been bungled by inept people, using the most knee jerk reactionary measures.  No planning.  No foresight.  Silence the experts, as has been protocol in other areas.  All other areas in which reality doesn't match policy. 

...

Yeah, I can see your point about how so many people (even presidential candidates!) called the president's early imposition of travel restrictions "xenophobic", and now Dr. Fauci of the National Institute of Health (parent of the CDC) has said the president's action was a crucial move.  What a mass buffoonery!  But after two weeks of bipartisan planning, congress has released a new nationwide testing program that will alleviate the huge strain on medical facilities caused by an epidemic under our current practices.

Fist Full of Ish wrote:
What a mass buffoonery!  But after two weeks of bipartisan planning, congress has released a new nationwide testing program that will alleviate the huge strain on medical facilities caused by an epidemic under our current practices.

[EDIT] Deleted as it's time for me to quit reacting to his claims.  Anyone can easily Google What Congress actually passed for themselves, and at what level they get involved versus where they don't. Additional general funding for the COVID-19 fight, yes, but that one was a while back.  The new relief plan that they did just pass, is quite different, as anyone can check.  However, it did legislate that testing should be free. [/EDIT]

----------------------

In unrelated (breaking) news:

The Federal Reserve just cut their target interest rate to Zero Percent...

rfordphotos wrote:
...
The fatality rate is hard to determine. If you use ONLY "test confirmed cases", it seems to be about 3.5%. (35 out of a 1000 infected, die.)
...
But- if you calculate the rate like we do for seasonal flu---- using BOTH tested and suspected (cases with no medical intervention)- the fatality rate will undoubtedly drop much lower. (estimated at a bit less than 1%)
...
Lets play with those numbers....

175,000,000 infected.
lets say 80% get mild cases, and dont need a doctor.
that would be ~140,000,000 staying home, getting well, and returning to normal.
leaving 35,000,000 needing a doctor.
at a worst case fatality rate of 3.5% that is about 1.25 million dead.
at a hopefully more accurate fatality rate of 0.75% about 250,000 dead.

Excellent points.  One question on the math, though.  Doesn't the "more accurate fatality rate" already factor in the cases that don't need a doctor?  I.E. The "more accurate fatality rate of 0.75%" should be applied to the "175,000,000 infected number" instead of the reduced (and already factored in) "35,000,000 needing a doctor" number?

I.E. Is it possible that you've inadvertently knocked down that number twice as a result?

IF so (and I'll leave it to you to check), then 175,000,000 infected times the "more accurate fatality rate of 0.75%" comes up with 1.3 million dead.   Personally I REALLY prefer a lower result, so if I haven't followed what you intended properly then I'll defer to you.

Either way, your point is well made.

LightDreams wrote:
[...]

I.E. Is it possible that you've inadvertently knocked down that number twice as a result?

[...].

Is it possible my math is wrong LOL---- Ohhhhhh Yeahhhhhh- 'rithmetic be hard for me

in truth, it was unclear in the stuff I was reading if the lower rate was arrived at the same way as the seasonal flu. I wasnt really able to find out if they were calculating the lower fatality rate including untreated cases, or if they were saying the fatality rate was that low in KNOWN cases. What a surprise, the statistics arent clear.

What I tried to do, I hope successfully, was to represent a realistic lower limit on the expected deaths.

but could I be wrong--- LOL---- for sure!

nwprophoto wrote:
What should we expect in the USA? Get prepared for?

Maybe national lock down like Italy?!

nwprophoto wrote:
What should we expect in the USA? Get prepared for?

FFantastique wrote:
Maybe national lock down like Italy?!

I think it is more likely they will target certain groups-- seniors/vulnerable people and restrict them.

California is already asking seniors over 65 to self isolate. I dont find it hard to believe they could make that mandatory.

I think it is reasonable to expect at least regional lockdowns... a more severe form of what they did in New Rochelle.

The CDC is recommending more and more stringent tactics, nearly every day.


I have NO clue how this is all going to work out. Regardless of your personal views on this, I hope each you make safe, responsible decisions that protect you and your families from WHATEVER this turns out to be.

FFantastique wrote:
Maybe national lock down like Italy?!

Would not surprise me to see it.

Jerry Nemeth wrote:
Canada is going to close the border with the US.

Been expecting that.
Maybe Mexico too.

Jerry Nemeth wrote:
Canada is going to close the border with the US.

Trudeau has been dropping hints.  It sounds like he's been coordinating things so that both sides would be able to pull the plug at the same time (a politically smarter move).  How far off that is, is unknown.

I think that both countries (and probably many others) are waiting to give as many citizens a chance to get back home first.  Lots of warnings (on this side of the border) about getting home from any other country "while you can", without getting too specific.  I also think that the Governments are thinking in terms of the kind of nightmare problems they'd run into with citizens stranded throughout the world, with all sorts of situations (country by country) blocking them from getting home.  So try and get them all back now, just to be safe.  Of course, they're all supposed to go into 14 day self quarantine upon their return, regardless of the country they were in.

Personally, I doubt that the closure will be specific to the Canada / U.S. border.  I'm going to predict it's when both countries (in conjunction with each other, and probably others), escalate things to generally stop the movement of most people (not freight) from crossing borders.

I notice there's some speculation that the U.S. may bar domestic passenger flights at some point (presumably a later step?).  All to try and contain any "hot spot" areas within the country.  Who knows if that will actually happen, but I suspect that it will depend on how well, or not, things are playing out.

Jerry Nemeth wrote:
They are closing the borders between many European countries.

Jerry is right. My home country, Denmark, has at a very short notice closed it's borders for all foreign visitors, so far untill April 13th. Also all Danish citizens have been advised to return to Denmark as soon as possible.
Things are changing rapidly here at the moment, so I strongly recommend anyone who have planned to go to Denmark to check the actual situation at the Danish Foreign Ministry's homepage at um.dk
Right now I would not recommend anyone at all to try to travel to Denmark, as visitors from abroad are stopped at the borders and returned back home a.s.a.p.