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Are internet models dedicated to modeling?
I must ask this question, which I am sure has been asked a time or two on this site, but regardless here goes. Are internet model dedicated to modeling? Are they willing to: spend what is needed do what is needed work as needed behave as needed invest totally as needed I hear how dedicated they are to modeling, as long as they do not have to pay anything LOL! I ask because I find it troublesome how many models on these sites who are totaly unprepared when it comes to wardrobe, makeup or even keeping appointments. I think that TFP allows models to take a easy path. Please take this for what it is worth. I am not complaining, I am just wondering? Nov 12 06 11:21 pm Link I know I've spent tons of money on my modeling even with doing TFPs.I buy a lot of props and clothing to wear because I like to style my own shoots and most photographers agree with my creativity.Plus I've bought countless hair clips,makeup and press on nails for shoots.So even without paying for a photographer I've paid over 1000 dollars on modeling atleast.Not to mention how many times I've paid to travel out of town to get to shoot with people.Gas and hotels aren't cheap.And yeah that comes out of my own money most of the time,Not my moms.I have a job.lol Nov 12 06 11:26 pm Link The models you had trouble with most likely didn't know any better. Agencies teach models things like that. Without an agency, it's kind of a crap shoot. But, instead of "wondering", you could start a thread with advice for would-be models concerning well...your concerns. Nov 12 06 11:32 pm Link Emotive Photography wrote: Good question to ask oneself in any business. That is the key right there ... the word "business!" Nov 12 06 11:32 pm Link Nora_Neko wrote: So what are your intentions and goals? I know you are 17 years old, but are you going to pursue modeling in a way that you can make an income? Either signing with an agent (you are good enough!) or in freelancing as your own business? Nov 12 06 11:36 pm Link K. Holden wrote: I've not found it to be a factor. There are many models who are not signed with agencies that are wonderful to work with. They treat their freelance career as a business. Nov 12 06 11:39 pm Link I am very dedicated to this profession. This is also why I don't do TFP. I have paid my dues ;-) Nov 12 06 11:43 pm Link I personally as well spend a lot of money for shoots. I always buy clothes before the shoot, always make sure my nails are done along with toe nails, buy new make-up as needed, Although I can not travel much, due to not having a license .However, I buy accessories and anything needed for my shoot to be just perfect! So I just think you might not be picking the best ones to work with... because there are those like us who actually do pay for things in regards to shoots. I also do not pay photographers but not always needed... If I had the money to do that, I sure would!! :DChantelle:D Nov 12 06 11:48 pm Link LanaV wrote: Very good point! I do agree the press on nails and hair clips can be VERY expensive and one posted replied, but so can studio space, camera and strobes! Nov 13 06 06:38 pm Link Emotive Photography wrote: You're one of those people that associates serious models with ones that pay photographers, right? Just asking. Nov 13 06 07:01 pm Link Some have dedication some don't Same as any thing else. So why is it we keep discussing thus? Nov 13 06 07:21 pm Link Most internet models appear dedicated to themself. '2006 EL Nov 13 06 07:26 pm Link Patrick Walberg wrote: I'd like to sign with an agency I just always look like crap in poloroids. Nov 13 06 07:30 pm Link Emotive Photography wrote: Blame the Internet or love the Internet. Do not blame the models. Thanks to technological advances, many more people now have the ability to pick up a camera or get images of themselves than ever before! Nov 13 06 07:36 pm Link Nora_Neko wrote: Well you have a wonderful portfolio of images on here! Don't show the Polaroids! I would say skip going to the lower or middle agencies ... go straight to the very top ones like Elite and Fords right now. Then if they don't sign you right away, work your way down to a comfortable "fit" for your look and experience. Get a short term but renewable contract. Then approach them again when you turn 18. This may also mean relocating to the best market for you. Nov 13 06 07:46 pm Link and the answer is no, no and no again. While some here are willing to work hard and invest as needed and I'm not just speaking about paying for shoots but for MUA's or new outfits, etc. Most on-line models don't want to spend a dime. I belong to another site that charges a small fee to host images. While free at first the webmaster decided to charge everyone and the site hasn't been the same since. Models left like someone had passed gas in a small room. Most of the photographers stayed but the site is a shell of its former self. The message was clear, models won't pay. The webmaster decided to only charge the photographers but it was too late. Now very few new models are joining and many of the photographers are leaving. Part of the problem is the large number of willing and often talented photographers giving away the world to shoot models. Part is that things have changed. Sites like MM are great but its hard to know which models want to improve and are serious. Example: as I stated above. If a model is getting a TFP shoot why not invest in make-up. If money is a problem go for one of the free make-overs if you buy some of the make-up. Mac and other counters offer this. If you need a nice dress either buy or rent one. Borrow from a friend if you have too. Nov 13 06 08:30 pm Link Better overbook by about 50%. You will have that many no shows. Just going on past exp. Nov 13 06 08:35 pm Link K. Holden wrote: I would love more advice from photographers.... Nov 13 06 08:38 pm Link You know what would happen if everyone stopped doing TFP? Money would change hands. Think about it. Nov 13 06 08:39 pm Link Sure I pay. I pay travel costs. I pay for a new outfit for almost every shoot I do. I pay for makeup. I pay by being professional. I pay by taking the time out of my day to come to the photographer. I pay by being there on time and doing what I need to do. Do I pay the photographer for his time after I do all of these other things and he gets the copyright and can sell the images? No I do not, and I don't think I would. I don't think it's because I'm not dedicated. Frankly the idea that "if I don't pay a photographer, I'm not dedicated enough" offends me. I worked hard to get where I am, and I paid my dues. I think slapping money down in front of a photographer and getting into an agency with just one shoot to your name is taking the easy way out, not the other way around. I don't think photographers should pay models and I don't think models should pay photographers. I think clients should pay. If the photos aren't being sold and you're only getting experience (maybe) and some pictures why would you pay $400+ for them? Nov 13 06 08:42 pm Link I think it depends on what type of models you are looking for because if you are talking about high fashion models compared to glam. girls it is really different. Girls online who do more fashion seem to go out and try harder to get work, print, etc.. but I think the reason is that it is tougher to be a high fashion model, especially if youre not with a big agency and are online looking for work. Nov 13 06 08:47 pm Link Patrick Walberg wrote: Thank you so much Patrick for the nice compliment, I do appreciate this. All of us have worked hard to make it in this profession, both photographers and models. Nov 13 06 08:48 pm Link Models should invest in themselfs or find an agency that will invest in them.... How much does the average model invest in their business? I have over $100k invested in my business. Nov 13 06 08:57 pm Link Hmmm Nov 14 06 07:28 am Link This year alone I've spent over $5,000.00 on custom latex, corsets, hats, stocking, shoes, plane tickets, makeup artists and miscellaneous accessories needed to make the look perfect. That's just this year and I have the receipts to back that up for tax purposes. Saying models on the internet aren't willing to pay money is bullsh*t. Nov 14 06 07:34 am Link Susi wrote: I would say you Susi are an above average model in most respects!!! Nov 14 06 07:44 am Link Ron Casas wrote: lol, well thanks Ron. Honestly most of the models I know personally put alot into what they do financially. And frankly, those who don't you can tell by the quality of images that they achieve. In my niche part of the job in modelling is having the wardrobe that artists want to shoot...I buy, borrow from designers, beg...lol...but I never steal;-) Nov 14 06 07:50 am Link Most internet models have no clue how to build a career........... most just want some hot pictures and attention...... and lets face it, a lot of photographers dont want them to go to an agency since they would then have to pay! Any model I shoot, who I think might have a chance in ANY niche in modeling, I try to convince to go to the agencies. I have had the pleasure of shooting quite a number of "internet" models and in many cases they were every bit as professional as any in the business, if not more so. But................. most just want hot pictures and the attention... just my experience. Nov 14 06 08:00 am Link Susi, you are an exception. You are totally professional and your reputation in the business speaks for itself................ total pro. Nov 14 06 08:01 am Link Jeff Marsh wrote: Thanks Jeff....I'm glad it hasn't gotten out that I'm a pain in the ass yet:-P Nov 14 06 08:04 am Link Mitsukai wrote: Why pay for photos? Because it is an investment. That $400 spent could lead to a $10,000 job! While it is agreed that clients should pay both models and photographers for commercial work, when a model needs my skills to get her/him good images to help market themselves, then yes I charge. If the model is "amazing", then hell yes I would shoot them for free, but most of the time they will pay because they understand the benefit of good images in their book (this is in regards to agency models). Nov 14 06 08:30 am Link LanaV wrote: to discard tfp because "dues have been paid" says there is nothing more to offer to the creative process. there are many reasons for choosing not to accept the process. placing oneself on high based on past credit should not be one of them. Nov 14 06 08:33 am Link No, but what really amazes me is how much time has passed and aspiring photographers haven't gotten tired of bitching about this very same topic. There comes a point when you finally have to wake up and go, you know, this site doesn't offer me anything professionally. At that point you can either move on or just quietly sit back and offer advice when someone with a chance and half a brain comes along. So the real question is, are YOU serious enough to do just that? Andy Nov 14 06 08:46 am Link There are many reasons why people decide to try their hand at modelling through the internet. Not all of them are condusive to being serious about the process. And ditto what Andy said. I realized a long time ago that the internet has no effect on what I do, professionally. It's fun to chat and hang-out, though. Nov 14 06 08:48 am Link Wayne Sclesky wrote: Well, I'm realistic enough to know that it's not likely I'll be getting a $10,000 job. I'm not 12, I weigh more than 100 pounds and I don't rival any NBA players for height ( Nov 14 06 08:52 am Link Ron Casas wrote: And I will most likely never spend that much, but I will certainly spend top dollar for all the necessary tools I need to keep my product (myself) in top order. No dollar to dollar comparison is ever going to come out in a model's favor unless she's purchasing her own couture for shoots. Nov 14 06 08:54 am Link All the time there are photographers on this site complaining about models not paying them, however if models are your only source of income, then you probably are not a very successful photographer, and you also have the option of not offering free test shooting. Ideally clients should pay both you and the model. It is not your place to tell some one what to spend their money on. Nov 14 06 09:01 am Link Wayne Sclesky wrote: Alot of the agency's have photographers who will shoot their models for free, because it is an opportunity for them to work with real models. Nov 14 06 09:03 am Link Jeff Marsh wrote: Yea every1 talks about how models should act so professional on here, but fashion is a flakey industry, it is just as flakey out in the real world as on the net. And you know what, no1 is expecting anybody in the fashion industry to show up with a suite and brief case and not be five minutes late. Nov 14 06 09:06 am Link I think there needs to be a distinction made here between agency models and models who will never be able to sign with an agency. In my experience (and I am just talking fashion/editorial modeling here, because that is all I have experience with), $400-$500 is an average figure for testing with a good, agency-recommended photographer. And that will most definitely pay off- the photos will be what is needed by the agency to market you to clients. Hopefully, what you earn as a result of those photos will be many times that. It is a small, and absolutely necessary, investment in a model's career. That said, a strictly "internet model"- that is, a model who is unsuitable for an agency and is strictly seeing this as a fun hobby most likely does NOT need to pay for photos. The money that the model spends on photographs will probably be more than or roughly equal to the amount of money she or he will make with "internet modeling" gigs during the entire year. Therefore, any kind of investment in professional photos would be fairly useless. It just seems a waste of money for a model who doesn't really have the potential to make any kind of substantial income at modeling. Just my humble opinion, though. Maybe there are a ton of successful short and otherwise unconventional models out there. I will admit that I don't know a whole lot about strictly commercial modeling. I just feel kind of bad for models who pay several hundred dollars for photos that, no matter how lovely, will most likely not help them get work, due to the fact that the person in the photos is short, too heavy, or otherwise just wrong for most paying jobs. Nov 14 06 09:08 am Link |