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GWC needs help
Actually I'm probably to old to be a GWC, so I guess that makes me DOMWC. Must be the case because I am having little luck recruiting models on MM, OMP (with one notable exception), or mySpace. Granted I'm still learning and live in the middle of the cornfields but there are a few models around. Questions are: Models: What in my profile or pictures scare you off? (If your professional and out of my league I inquire about rates rather than asking for TFP.) Photographers: How do you go about contacting models? I have been sending out the following email: I am looking for models in the Champaign area. I am actually looking for two things. First, any models interested in TFP. Iâm at the point now that I am ready to become more creative and need more than simple portraits. I am particularly interested in digital manipulation, turning pictures into art; and at the other end of the spectrum, b&w. I think I can make it worth your time. If you have any ideas that you would like to work on, I would be interested. Secondly, I am also looking for one or two models to work with on a more regular basis, about once a week or every two. I have several projects in mind and want to practice different techniques. I would be willing to discuss rates. We can also work out a compromise between the two. Iâm pretty flexible. Thanks, Oct 20 06 12:00 pm Link well you just labled yourself as a GWC, A GWC is one who uses a camera as a way to meet and spent time with and seduce women more than as a means to be a photographer. So think about that. Why are you shooting? To create great images or to get laid? As for your portfolio fill your portfolio with what you want to shoot. not what others want to see. If you want to shoot nudes fill it up with nudes, if youwant to shoot headshots fill it up with headshots. If you already know that you live in a less populated area then you have to work harder to get models in your studio and then keep them coming back. If you want models to work with you TFP you need to be able to reliably supply models with images that are BETTER then her mid level images. Good models who work TFP don't care about dressing rooms, being offered coke vs pepsi at a shoot, how big of a wardrobe you have, they care about the quality of your images, that is the bottim line. The whole email is good, it is just a numbers game. keep sending it out or send out a I want to hire you at this rate email and practice shooting more. If no one is biting change up your portfolio and improve your images. Oct 20 06 12:10 pm Link After viewing your Port I saw some strong images and weak ones..........we aren't perfect so dont take this as harsh..........what you shoot should display your own style and I'm sure that you are more than a GWC,,,,,,,I'm sure that you will find models that you enjoy working with and I look foward to seeing more of your work.........juz be yourself and let the creativity flow.......and ignore the idiots here who may put down your work.......good luck!! Oct 20 06 12:14 pm Link That shot of Kristine in the red dress is fantastic! Good work! Oct 20 06 12:20 pm Link After reading the message, you send out, I think it may be too generic. From my experience, and I stand to be corrected by models, it seems to me that a model want to know exactly what you want to shoot with her. The more information you can provide the better - be specific. Marty Oct 20 06 12:23 pm Link The GWC or DOMWC might scare off some models. Otherwise I don't see a problem. Unless models are more interested in cash than photos. You have a good portfolio. Oct 20 06 12:24 pm Link College town and no models? I found (living in the sticks too so to speak) that the best way to get models is to shoot people who aren't but make them look great. Sooner or later, you are gonna shoot some kid or somebodys daughter and they are going to have a cousin or friend who is model material. Word gets around that you are looking for "models" and it starts to roll. Frankly, 95% of the girls I have shot who are "modelike" and in my port I didn't meet on the web but through friends and acquaintances Mark Oct 20 06 12:26 pm Link I prefer to target the message, which is basically what Iona said. For example, if I'm shooting artistic, I include a link to a series that's closest to what I'm trying for, and describe that in the paragraph. Oct 20 06 12:27 pm Link Thanks for all the responses. I figured "GWC" would be like a lightning rod. I'm was getting a bit frustrated. Thanks to all. Iona, your right I said that but if I was looking to get laid, my wife would lay me out cold with a frying pan. Spanish Eyes, thanks for commenting on my pics. Living in a vacuum is hard. Friends all say they like my pics but of course thats just being polite. I need real critiques. Thanks again, SE and Neoracer,for pointing out the good and bad. Marty and Jim, thanks, I'll try to be more specific. I'm still exploring and don't know what my "style" is. I'll shoot about anything that's tasteful (except weddings!). Oct 20 06 12:40 pm Link Dude U R takin' my name in vein and all that biblical stuff!!! GWC!!! Oct 20 06 12:44 pm Link How many models have you contacted on here? You will find that your percentage of models that actually shoot with you will be low. At least that has been my experience. Most say they are interested but when it actually comes down to it...well not sure what happens to them. Oct 20 06 12:48 pm Link BTW, in your profile you state you are retired so that makes models assume you are probably in your 50's or 60's. I'm sure some models (a lot??) are looking to shoot with someone more their age because_______(you can fill in the blank). Oct 20 06 12:52 pm Link Eric5312 wrote: I look for portfolios on MM that have models who are 99% out of their clothes all the time. Then I message them and say "will you show me your b(o)(o)bies?" Oct 20 06 01:00 pm Link I usually find myself going the other way in my introduction letter... for new models to a particular site anyhow. I welcome them, let them know that I am available, and then (a big thing that helps) caution them about something they almost ALL do... check to make sure that their email is anonymous. I had a model I worked with get into a series of late night and harasing phone calls because her email had her name and zipcode. Most new members appreciate the advice, the more serious ones will visit my website, and from there we talk about TFCD and other specifics. Just how I handle it... some models may want more details, but if they dont care enough to respond to an email, what makes me think they are going to show up for a shoot? -Dan. Oct 20 06 01:03 pm Link
Post hidden on Nov 28, 2012 11:53 am
Reason: contains personal info Oct 20 06 01:15 pm Link Iona Lynn wrote: That's fucking genius. That's the best thing anyone has ever said on this site. Ever. Oct 20 06 01:16 pm Link GWC wrote: You're so cool ;-) Oct 20 06 01:17 pm Link Most will never show up so double book.. then make a list of those who don't show up and put them on your myspace page and point everyone you know to the link so they can see the lame excuses. www.myspace.com/emgstudios Oct 20 06 01:19 pm Link
Post hidden on Nov 28, 2012 11:54 am
Reason: contains personal info Oct 20 06 01:27 pm Link Again, thanks for all the responses. My power went off shortly after starting this forum. I will get back to it later and to those of you that emailed. Oct 20 06 01:37 pm Link I figure that the least a model wants out of a shoot is money or usable shots for her portfolio. If you say you want to use the time to experiment, she is probably not sure she's going to get usable shots (and since it's TFP, she won't get money either). Oct 20 06 02:57 pm Link This is harsh, but what I see in your portfolio is a general lack of anything useful to you or the model. No examples of great composition, great angles, lights, anything. You're not showing the models at their best. Any one of those models could've taken those pictures with a tripod and a timer. You're shots are just so generic, you as a photographer aren't needed. You definately must improve your compsition and you're "eye." Also you need to re-think the shots in your portfolio. Many of them don't show the models at their best. Oct 20 06 03:24 pm Link i think the main problem is the expressions on the models. plus your no pro. look at the faces on my port im also amateur. you havto pose and capture a sexy sultry look. a couple in your port look a bit scared of you , possibly you make too much casual conversation , or seem nervous. Oct 20 06 06:39 pm Link Doug Sampson wrote: Because why? Oct 20 06 06:41 pm Link Doug Sampson wrote: Any model worth a damn doesn't care at all about a photographer's age. That's so shallow. Oct 20 06 06:46 pm Link e-string wrote: And we older photographers appreciate your attitude! Oct 20 06 06:54 pm Link e-string wrote: I think I'll start the "old guys for E-String". Oct 20 06 06:58 pm Link Rich Davis wrote: I might not be much of a photographer yet (and I'm not arguing, I agree) but I am old. I'll join that group. Oct 20 06 07:12 pm Link Ivy Bressler wrote: Too harsh and you are wrong You definately must improve your compsition and you're "eye." Also you need to re-think the shots in your portfolio. Many of them don't show the models at their best. And you need to work on your spelling Oct 20 06 09:43 pm Link Get some critiques on your port from some pros, and drop the stuff that doesn't cut it. The truth can be harsh, as I can attest, but take it in stride. You don't have to fill out all the slots in your port, just keep the best of your best. I think you spiral stairs shot is far better than some of your earlier shots(!), btw, but what do I know. Oct 21 06 03:53 am Link Thread title: GWC needs help Don't they all?  Oct 21 06 06:09 am Link Ivy Bressler wrote: RGK Photography wrote: Ivy Bressler wrote: RKG Photography wrote: I agree! Always consider the source when being flamed. Ivy says a lot about herself. Oct 21 06 06:14 am Link I feel for you. I am not quite good enough to be a GWC. I would love to shoot Black nudes. 100s of asking and O responce. Most is cause I don't know what I am doing. Lots of models want a top ten photographer, as they should. Even when they are not top ten models. Some just want to say they are models to their friends and never update their shots. So for people like you and me MM is a great site to learn and be exposed to great photography. As a place to hook up with models, not so much. >M< ~ Oct 21 06 06:51 am Link Time to thank everyone one again and answer back. Gunfitr, your right and I am working on that, it is just so slow and I need practice while I'm waiting, Need the chicken and the egg. Can I borrow some of your patience. Rue 99, good advice. GWC, sorry. I'll try not to take your veins in vain again. Doug, I'm in my early 50's (partly retired & loving it) which is why I guess I would be called a DOMWC rather GWC. Maybe I should leave out the part about retirement. One look and they'll know. Oct 21 06 07:18 am Link Dan, good advice to me and to new models. I like the idea. Daniela V, I plead guilty. I have been disappointed when I haven't heard back from professional models (I write off the amateurs that don't respond) but sometimes I don't get back to them after they send their rates. I figured I was just wasting their time if they were higher than I was interested in but I'm sure it works both ways. GWC, there's maybe 100 "models" around here (maybe a couple of them are real), not a 1000. No b(o)(o)bies for me. Wouldn't know how to light them anyway. Oct 21 06 07:57 am Link I agree with some of the other comments. I think you should delete a few pictures from your portfolio and tighten it up a bit (I'm one to talk...I know). Bob Randall on this site gives some constructive (sometimes painful) advice if you send him a message. Also, from a human nature standpoint -I read your bio on the main page and it seemed really intense. You may be scaring people off. I know human nature is to "test the waters" on situations. Make your bio a little more brief, much more light, and after you shoot with a model and have a great time together then you can ask her for some repeat business. Don;t ask for someone to commit to regular work or multiple shoots without getting to know you first. Just my advice. Also, we have equal success handing out business cards in pubs and at concerts as we do contacting people on this site. I carry part of my portfolio around on a Zen Vision M (google it-you'll understand). If I see someone I think would be interesting I show them my portfolio and hand them a card or get their email address. I keep it very non-commital and say "Take a look at my portfolio if you think you might want to be part of it...send me a message" I also tell them that since no money is exchanged (at this point in our photography career) that all they have to lose is a few hours of time and there is a very good chance they'll get a really cool picture out of it. I've been told that it also makes potential models feel more comfortable because I work with my wife. Maybe your wife might want to be part of it. My wife does all the visual stuff like make up, hair, and clothes. If I'm shooting and a models hair falls across her face my wife fixes it. It's easier to have a partner who keeps an eye on the model and keeps her hair and clothing looking right. After we're done shooting -my wife helps with the editing. Just another idea... Good luck and enjoy life. The Fates will get you where you need to be... Oct 21 06 08:32 am Link Eric5312 wrote: Definetly always get back to those that quote rates that you a. don't want to pay b. cannot afford...either negotiate or just say thanks, but no thanks...because you never know when you might want to pay those rates, and then that model won't get back to you. Oct 21 06 09:15 am Link So much good advice its taking a while to answer. Paul and JvR the verbage will go. Believe it or not I that was the short version. No doubt you right. Ivy, harsh? Yes. Did I ask for it? Yes. Thanks. Darkfotoart, don't think I ever scared a model. Made them laugh (at me), maybe. Thanks. Bob Randall, I love your avatar and comment. e-string, I liked yours even better. Oct 21 06 12:28 pm Link RGK, Austin, and Stevens, you guys make me feel better. Maybe I won't give it up. Naw, never intended to. Too much fun and too much to learn. Golden Light, we'll get there. Oct 21 06 01:48 pm Link Gunfitr wrote: From another midwestener, when I was living in Kansas in a small college town, I gotta second this. I didn't know anything about MM, OMP, Craigslist, or Myspace, so I took out an ad in a local paper. Cost me something like $25 and the response was immediate and amazing. I interviewed about 25, shot 8 and reshot most of those at least once. Some then brought me friends, some of whom I shot. I planned to sell the images (and did), so I payed them. All the images of women on my port come from these sessions. Only two of them had any experience at all. Oct 21 06 02:33 pm Link |
