e-string wrote:
Maybe she thought you were good enough that she'd benefit from doing TFP rather than asking you to hire her which might be unreasonable depending on her and your levels of experience.

Or maybe she's just unproffessional and doesn't know how to read?

Yumemiru wrote:

Or maybe she's just unproffessional and doesn't know how to read?

The OP already said he does TFP...

e-string wrote:
Maybe she thought you were good enough that she'd benefit from doing TFP rather than asking you to hire her which might be unreasonable depending on her and your levels of experience.

Thank you for the compliment, but it still makes no sense.  How can she charge someone a PROFESSIONAL  rate to shoot her, but her port is not of professional quality.  It's putting the cart before the horse.  It's very simple.  You have to make an investment to get a return on an investment.  It's how business has ran for ever.

...Stacy wrote:
is it just me... or did I spell that wrong?

Let's see t-h-a-t.  Nope, it is correct.

Meehan Photography wrote:
I'm not sure, but the word 'verbatim' keeps ringing through my ears when I read your post.

Elaborate... please.

Shawn Ray wrote:
To top it off, she gave her rates in her bio!  How does this work?  Someone please break it down for me.

Out there, somewhere, is some guy willing to pay her some ungodly amount per hour to take her picture.  Her job is to find as many of those guys as possible.

Simple!

Shawn Ray wrote:

Thank you for the compliment, but it still makes no sense.  How can she charge someone a PROFESSIONAL  rate to shoot her, but her port is not of professional quality.  It's putting the cart before the horse.  It's very simple.  You have to make an investment to get a return on an investment.  It's how business has ran for ever.

Well perhaps she can get GWC's to pay those rates. She offered you TFP because your work would benefit her portfolio. Not having seen her stuff, that seems to be the most logical answer in my opinion.

I never paid a single photographer, by the way. And most of what I do now is paid work (legit, not GWC). So it doesn't ALWAYS work that way.

LarryB wrote:

Out there, somewhere, is some guy willing to pay her some ungodly amount per hour to take her picture.  Her job is to find as many of those guys as possible.

Simple!

Well said.  I eat my words.

Shawn Ray wrote:

Elaborate... please.

This issue you are experiencing is one that numerous other photographers and models have posted about. The issue, the words, the topic, the conundrum are similar yet there is no clear answer to be had in this forum.

C R Photography wrote:
I blame Bush!

That's probably what she wants to charge for...

markcomp wrote:

Let's see t-h-a-t.  Nope, it is correct.

Thank goodness, for a second there i was worried...

Meehan Photography wrote:

This issue you are experiencing is one that numerous other photographers and models have posted about. The issue, the words, the topic, the conundrum are similar yet there is no clear answer to be had in this forum.

You're absolutely right!  I think I posted before thinking.  Oh well.

markcomp wrote:

Let's see t-h-a-t.  Nope, it is correct.

Too perfect!  LOL 
(Hey, somebody had to do it . . . )

Shawn Ray wrote:
I just don't get it!!!  I just received a message from a so called "model" asking me for TFP's.  It's not that I don't or won't do TFP's, but that she was not willing to pay for a professional shoot (which she needed).  To top it off, she gave her rates in her bio!  How does this work?  Someone please break it down for me.

I don't even have a college degree and I can figure this stuff out...

Ok, it's called negotiating.  She contacted you and, in a way, lowballed your services.  Now it's your turn to decline, accept, or counter-offer.  And that's it, no further debate is necessary.

Hamza wrote:
How do you know she was not WILLING to pay a pro to shoot her?

Maybe she is BROKE?

What's wrong with her asking?  It's just a question.

You are making a mountain out of a molehill...or are you insulted because she didn't think you were good enough for her to pay???

Um, can we say EGO?

You have got to be kidding me!  EGO?  If I wanted your opinion I would have given it to you!

Shawn Ray wrote:

Thank you for the compliment, but it still makes no sense.  How can she charge someone a PROFESSIONAL  rate to shoot her, but her port is not of professional quality.  It's putting the cart before the horse.  It's very simple.  You have to make an investment to get a return on an investment.  It's how business has ran for ever.

You must be new in these parts.  There are plenty of photographers who will pay models even if they have crappy ports.  Some are hobbyists and some provide content for membership websites.  If NO ONE every hires her at her listed rates, she'll learn that she's not worth her quoting price and she'll either quit or adjust accordingly in order to get paid jobs.  It really is that simple.

But I could be wrong...

DigitalCMH wrote:

You must be new in these parts.  There are plenty of photographers who will pay models even if they have crappy ports.  Some are hobbyists and some provide content for membership websites.  If NO ONE every hires her at her listed rates, she'll learn that she's not worth her quoting price and she'll either quit or adjust accordingly in order to get paid jobs.  It really is that simple.

But I could be wrong...

As I said above... I'll eat my words.  I spoke... I mean wrote too soon.

PK Digital Imaging wrote:
What's so confusing?  Imagine a high profile model approaching you asking to do TFP?  Her rates are through the roof.  Would you turn her down and post here saying "OMG WTF was she thinking???"  Or would you do the TFP to enhance both your and her portfolios with the understanding that your work is going to get better exposure?

Excellent example!!


Heidi Klum - Hello, Christopher?  Yes, I've seen your work I think it's simply amazing. I would love to join you for one of your beach sessions during sunset.  Are you available for TFP?

Me - bahahahahahahahahahaha, Heidi who? sorry, I'm not taking anymore TFPs at this time, I'm pretty busy picking my toes and such.  If you want to shoot with me, my sessions are $400 and that includes an MUA.

DigitalCMH wrote:

Excellent example!!


Heidi Klum - Hello, Christopher?  Yes, I've seen your work I think it's simply amazing. I would love to join you for one of your beach sessions during sunset.  Are you available for TFP?

Me - bahahahahahahahahahaha, Heidi who? sorry, I'm not taking anymore TFPs at this time, I'm pretty busy picking my toes and such.  If you want to shoot with me, my sessions are $400 and that includes an MUA.

What?  you woudn't make heidi  do her own makeup?

DigitalCMH wrote:

Excellent example!!


Heidi Klum - Hello, Christopher?  Yes, I've seen your work I think it's simply amazing. I would love to join you for one of your beach sessions during sunset.  Are you available for TFP?

Me - bahahahahahahahahahaha, Heidi who? sorry, I'm not taking anymore TFPs at this time, I'm pretty busy picking my toes and such.  If you want to shoot with me, my sessions are $400 and that includes an MUA.

I agreed with you a minute ago, but I have to disagree on this one.  That would be like ME pursuing her for a TFP.  I'm by far not at her level, as a photographer.  It's just that she is a non-professional pursuing a professional.  Please understand I'm not trying to be egotistical, it's just not the same.

Shawn Ray wrote:

Hamza wrote:
How do you know she was not WILLING to pay a pro to shoot her?

Maybe she is BROKE?

What's wrong with her asking?  It's just a question.

You are making a mountain out of a molehill...or are you insulted because she didn't think you were good enough for her to pay???

Um, can we say EGO?

You have got to be kidding me!  EGO?  If I wanted your opinion I would have given it to you!

Hey Genius, you DID ask for my opinion.  As a matter of fact you asked for ANYONE's opinion.  Don't you remember what the title of your post was?  Do you have Altzheimers?  Can't remember?   

No it's not ego, by your response I can totally see that...L M A O !

Shawn Ray wrote:

As I said above... I'll eat my words.  I spoke... I mean wrote too soon.

I can understand something that I think does frustrate a LOT of photographers and since you know the model in question, this may be the feel you got from her.  But I do know a model that has contacted me a few times for TFP and I just decline it.  She doesn't really have a look I care for so that's part of it.  But MOSTLY I turned her down because of, in my opinion, her arrogant proclaimation that, "I do NOT PAY photographers!"  On the flip-side and in her defense, may be was constantly getting contacted by photographers giving her their rates, but the way she wrote it...or perhaps, just the way I READ it, she came off as a snotty diva that in all honesty, does NOT have the looks to pull it off.  And that says a LOT coming from me because I find plenty of "average" looking women to be quite beautiful to me.

Lost Coast Photo wrote:
What I don't understand is this obsession with who should pay who.  As if models and photographers paying each other is some kind of road to fame and fortune?  Only in the fantasy parallel universe of the internet.

Fame and fortune no,  but you CAN make a bit of money off other peoples dreams if you try hard enough.  why do you think there's so many scammers?  (on both sides of the camera/production/agency/etc)

Hamza wrote:

Shawn Ray wrote:

Hamza wrote:
How do you know she was not WILLING to pay a pro to shoot her?

Maybe she is BROKE?

What's wrong with her asking?  It's just a question.

You are making a mountain out of a molehill...or are you insulted because she didn't think you were good enough for her to pay???

Um, can we say EGO?

You have got to be kidding me!  EGO?  If I wanted your opinion I would have given it to you!

Hey Genius, you DID ask for my opinion.  As a matter of fact you asked for ANYONE's opinion.  Don't you remember what the title of your post was?  Do you have Altzheimers?  Can't remember?   

No it's not ego, by your response I can totally see that...L M A O !

It's called 'Sarcasm" sugar tits!  Go back to having your dog lick peanut butter off you.  This was a civilized forum until you tainted it.

...Stacy wrote:

What?  you woudn't make heidi  do her own makeup?

Not if she's already paying me.  It's included in my package price.  Seriously, my MUA has done soooo much TFP for me, that if I can land a paid gig, I'm going to do my best to make sure she's part of it.

Shawn Ray wrote:

Hamza wrote:

Shawn Ray wrote:

Hamza wrote:
How do you know she was not WILLING to pay a pro to shoot her?

Maybe she is BROKE?

What's wrong with her asking?  It's just a question.

You are making a mountain out of a molehill...or are you insulted because she didn't think you were good enough for her to pay???

Um, can we say EGO?

You have got to be kidding me!  EGO?  If I wanted your opinion I would have given it to you!

Hey Genius, you DID ask for my opinion.  As a matter of fact you asked for ANYONE's opinion.  Don't you remember what the title of your post was?  Do you have Altzheimers?  Can't remember?   

No it's not ego, by your response I can totally see that...L M A O !

It's called 'Sarcasm" sugar tits!  Go back to having your dog lick peanut butter off you.  This was a civilized forum until you tainted it.

By the way, I'm just busting your chops.  No harm intended.  Just having a little fun.  Please forgive me.

Shawn Ray wrote:
I'm by far not at her level, as a photographer.  It's just that she is a non-professional pursuing a professional.  Please understand I'm not trying to be egotistical, it's just not the same.

You may not be trying to be egotistical, but you are! 

I guessed it the first time!

You were insulted because you believe and I quote, "I'm by far not at her level, as a photographer."

No, that's not an egotistical thing to say....LMAO!

Dude, you're killing me!!!