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Photographers, please answer this...
Why do you guys advertise for art photography and say you do that, but reject girls (bigger girls like myself) to work with? I dont understand how you could do "artistic work" with someone much much skinner than I am. Just give me some reason why...k? PS: sorry for the spelling errors and grammar, its like uber early for me :-p Aug 14 06 04:01 am Link Madalyn wrote: I don't reject anyone who wishes to work with me...Come to Pittsburgh and I'll prove it to you. Aug 14 06 05:21 am Link I like your port, and your right there is no reason that a photographer couldlnt do great art with you. How far are you from Hartford, CT. Aug 14 06 05:26 am Link tell me why someone must work with someone who they don't care to work with? why is it that you feel this sense of entitlement... that just because you call yourself a model that a photographer MUST work with you. Artists reveal their vision... they find muses who express their vision.. They shouldn't be bound to shooting with someone that does not express their vision whether they are large small medium or what ever. Being a muse has nothing to do with size... it has everything to do with confidence and spirit and attitude. I just recently shot a model who is twice your stated weight; and loved every single moment with her. Art photogs shoot what is inside of them... they shoot people who inspire them... Maybe the issue isn't your wieght, but that you simply do not inspire any one. Aug 14 06 06:03 am Link AMEN! ravens laughter wrote: Aug 14 06 06:05 am Link ravens laughter wrote: Nail on the Head Aug 14 06 06:07 am Link Madalyn wrote: I have never reject anyone who wants to work with me. Aug 14 06 06:49 am Link Madalyn wrote: (Art and beauty is in the eye of the beholder) Its to each his or her own Aug 14 06 06:58 am Link My main issue would be the large tattoo's that some art models have. If I want tattoo's in a shot, it better be some seriously good ink work. I have yet to see poorly done ink on a larger art model work. -PKD Aug 14 06 06:59 am Link Madalyn wrote: Why is it that a skinnier girl cant do artistic work? Sounds like youre being just as ignorant as the photographers you mentioned. Aug 14 06 07:09 am Link ravens laughter wrote: This is a bit harsh. Aug 14 06 07:15 am Link ravens laughter wrote: Larry, have your statements ever gotten wrong? :-) Aug 14 06 07:19 am Link As someone who does mostly figure modeling-both for photographers and for college art classes-I think that there could be several problems. Some of these have already been mentioned but... 1. you're not what the artist is looking for 2. you're not what the artist is looking for at that time 3. you are not a blank canvas. most people i know will not accept figure models with tattoos, and those that do say so by advertising on their pages that they looking for women with ink. 4. your portfolio does not at all embody what most people would call art yes, to each his or her own and beauty is in the eye of the beholder. but...if i were asked by a model if i would consider letting them be a part of my art project...to EXPRESS myself and everything i'm about, and i saw the pictures you currently have...specifically the last one...I would say no in a heartbeat. Consider revising your images. Clearing out a bit. This: will certainly not cut it. Additionally, any good photographer that does NOT have a specific look in mind, would not turn you down because of your weight. Have you seen Shyly's page? You should. Aug 14 06 07:24 am Link It obviously has nothing to do with size. If that were true, Shyly would never model. The fact is she is incredibly popular with artists and art photographers. I will say this to you, there are two components that are involved in making a model successful. The first is the look. That is something you can't change beyond attire, make-up and hair. But your facial features, figure, etc, are what they are. Sometimes they will fit the statement an artist wants to make, other times it will not. That is true of the best models. Even the most popular girls won't always fit the vision of the project. The second component is personna. You might want to call it your personality but it is more. It is the flora that the word of modeling sees when they see you. It includes your personality, your charisma and your ability to market yourself. Both are important. We often see models with imperfections doing well in the business while the ultimate uber-hottie can't get a job. I know a Playmate who is personna non-gratis at the mansion and couldn't get booked for a group shoot if she were the only model in L.A. If you are not getting booked, try to figure out why. Is it because you don't have the look photographers need? If so, try to find a market that fits you. If you think you have the look, then examine how you are presenting yourself. Perhaps there are things you can do to make the leap. In the end though there is a reality. More models fail than succeed. The bottom line is to keep your chin up and understand rejection. Sometimes good people make bad models. It isn't a reflection on you. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder and in the end, if you want to make it, you will have to find a match. Keep your chin up and good luck to you. Aug 14 06 07:28 am Link Well, to be honest, you have to be what the photogs are looking for. Generally fuller figured women are ideal for art, but at the same time there can be TOO full. In other words, height and weight IS an issue, and even as an artistic photographer I see many women who are overweight that I dont see them bringing talents to the table that I need. Also, you can have more images of what people are looking for and reflect that you can meet their needs. Finally, if you have to remember that many of these so-called photographers are merely GWC and are out to see 'naked hotties' and until they grow up, finding good SERIOUS photogs will not be an easy task. Keep pushing. Aug 14 06 07:34 am Link Claire Elizabeth wrote: This is what I want to know as well! What, I can't be an art model because I'm thin? Hardly.... I'm leaving in half an hour to shoot fine art for a week in the boundary waters. Aug 14 06 07:46 am Link Curiously, over the last couple of years, at least 4 plus size models have approached me for black & white artistic nudes but none of them worked out. I have been dying to experiment with lighting as I believe that larger curved surfaces will prove to be an amazing canvas for me to work on. However, all 4 girls were quite uncomfortable when it came down to getting out of their clothes - I suspect due to their body image issues. All of them stated that it would have taken at least 3 - 4 sessions for them to feel a little more comfortable. Now I have worked with dozens of conventional size models and this problem has NEVER come up before. I normally like to pay for the model's time so for me to pay 3 - 4 warm up sessions is out of the question. I am still hoping to find someone plus sized who is comfortable with their physical attributes to come in for a session in my studio!! Aug 14 06 08:35 am Link Madalyn wrote: Well for one thing why would you want to work with someone you do not inspire? Photography just like modeling requires inspiration, the fact that you are heavier than fashion models means nothing to a real photograher. Again, you put yourself in the photographers place, would you want to shoot someone that looks like a toothpick, really not looking for an answer. Would you shoot someone that just turns you off, I doubt it. Their are gorgeous models I would not shoot, I just don't like them, size has nothing to do with it. Aug 14 06 08:52 am Link Madalyn wrote: For me it would be your size. I just don't work with girls who are over weight . I turn down paid jobs all the time because it takes so much more time to get a good images that it is just not worth it. Aug 14 06 09:01 am Link As Mr. Wellborn has just so kindly illustrated, yes, your size will keep you from getting jobs. That's just how it is. You need to know that going in, expect to get rejected more often than you're accepted, and grow a tough hide if you want to be a fat art model. I'm not saying this to be mean, I'm speaking from experience. There aren't many of us, and most people don't know what to do with us or our bodies. Knowing that, but knowing also that if you're really good people will start to change their minds about you, you need to create a portfolio that will inspire. You will probably need to pay an artist or two to do that at the beginning. For all that artists are supposed to be visionaries, when it comes to an unexpected body type they often need to see someone else doing beautiful things with you before they can imagine themselves doing beautiful things with you. If I had a nickle for every time someone who rejected me when I started came back later and said, "Hey, now that I've seen what all these great artists are doing with you, I'd like to work with you" I'd be...a few cents richer.  Presentation is very important. More than once people have indicated an interest in working with me based upon my activity in the forums. All of Model Mayhem is a networking tool, and sometimes someone will decide to work with you just because they like you. Lastly, pound the pavement. I cannot even begin to tell you how many emails I've sent out over the duration of my time modeling. Everyone whose work interested me within a 150 mile radius heard from me. Most never responded. But if you send out hundreds of letters of interest, even if you only get a 1% response rate you've got a start. Be prepared to work hard, because it absolutely ain't easy. Best of luck to you. I hope you're able to find your niche. Aug 14 06 09:13 am Link Madalyn wrote: Photography is not all that different from dating. You can't make someone like you. You can't make someone interested in you. If a photographer doesn't see you as part of his vision, suck it up and move on. If you have an idea that you think you and the photographer can produce a vision that you have, hire the photographer. I'm sure at that point they'd be willing to take you on. Aug 14 06 09:17 am Link Sadly, you'll never know how many photographers have viewed your portfolio and have decided not to approach you and/or not to work with you. Further, you'll never know why they feel that way. You may assume that you are not getting work because of your size, but that may or may not be the reason. For example, I would not want to work with you simply because I don't like photographing tattoos, and I would not be able to work around yours. All I can say is that you should appreciate all the work you get, just as I appreciate all the models who agree to pose for me. Keep busy. Try concepts a bit outside of your comfort area. Concentrate on your successes and let go of the jobs that pass you by. Aug 14 06 09:28 am Link Madalyn, I certainly would have chosen you for anyof my "Art Photography" projects. I have done Art Nudes with a variety of women of allll sizes. One just has to view each woman with the potential of casting her in all of her beauty onto my photography canvas, so to speak. Shame you are not in the Seattle area, would love to work with you!! Aug 14 06 09:34 am Link I guess I didnt read the "Rule Book" that states that in order for a photograph to be considered Artistic, the model has to be overwieght. Come on, by making a statement like that you are looking worse than any photographer who doesnt want to work with you based on your size. Aug 14 06 09:35 am Link work on your looks # and expressions / hair / make up the face has to fit too! also get some (even 1) good art nude or whatever you want to show what you have to offer i looked at your port but im not seeing anything bookable for art they are mainly head shots and not inspirring to me personally in any way at all keep at it and good luck! Aug 14 06 09:44 am Link Shyly wrote: Right to the point --Marketing is the key and in this case quality images are a part of it . Aug 14 06 09:50 am Link I personally would probably not contact you to work with me just because while you do have a lot of what I look for in a model, your features are very innocent looking even in the image of you with the crop - it just doesn't work for me. Your features are too soft/innocent. However, for me it has nothing to do with weight - I work with all shapes, sizes and types of girls all the time - Over the years I have found there is something about a lot of the girls that I photograph that makes the shot. You are definately very pretty, and while heavy, you still have a fairly good figure... I model occasionally myself, and as a plus sized model, I use energy and passion ...and outrageous make up to get the look I'm going for... Keep at it! Good luck. just my .02 ~Saryn Aug 14 06 09:55 am Link Like most of the other posts in here state, there are things that photographers are looking for and its not always what you have to offer. We are like models in a way. A model wants to have different strong shots in several genres within their portfolio, and so do I. I have several projects that I have been trying to find just the right person for almost 6 months now. I'm patient that somewhere the right person will pop into my viewfinder, but I haven't gotten there yet. I would fire this back at the models: -Why is it that you think every photographer should work with you? -Why do "models" with terrible images and cameraphone images think that they are able to charge? -Why do models list as professional, yet have no background in modeling? Its not just MM its OMP also Aug 14 06 09:59 am Link Jason Bostic wrote: I always thought it was so we could laugh and point. Aug 14 06 10:26 am Link Madalyn wrote: Some answers, at least from on figurative art photographer. Aug 14 06 10:27 am Link J. Welborn wrote: A photographer should be able to see art and beauty everywhere. Aug 14 06 10:46 am Link Stevens Photography wrote: ravens laughter wrote: This is a bit harsh. It may be harsh, but it's to the point and upfront! It's LIFE! Aug 14 06 10:58 am Link Madalyn wrote: Big, small, tall, short, white, black, blue or green. Art has no boundaries. You shouldnt be rejected, unless of course you're asking people to shoot you for free...then its open game I suppose for any reason. I really like most of the responses here though. Simply put, perhaps you're just not right for someone's vision at that time Aug 14 06 11:02 am Link Melvin Moten Jr wrote: Probably one of the few reasons to go to pittsburgh. just wear a helmet Aug 14 06 11:04 am Link Rod Vito wrote: OKAY OKAY OKAY...I have gotten recommendation from photographers ON HERE that I should try artistic modeling for my size...but I have looked at photographers around here who "do art photography" and all I see is smaller females...and as whathisface mentioned, okay, so what, but what about when I DO shoot with photographers, and ALL My pictures get dismissed? What then???? What in the world am I supposed to think other than "Okay, I need to be a twig to get noticed around here" Aug 14 06 01:40 pm Link Madalyn wrote: I've already invited you to shoot with me in Pittsburgh. I guarentee I'll do a better job than all the guys shooting twigs anyway. All you have to do is show up, and it's on. Aug 14 06 08:39 pm Link Melvin Moten Jr wrote: Well I will try to get down there :-p but as for my location, thats all there is...... Aug 15 06 03:50 am Link Madalyn wrote: Are you paying the photogs or wanting to be paid? Money buys anything, so if it's that important, just find a pro and pay her/him. Aug 15 06 07:49 am Link WillSun wrote: Im just trying to get more experiance and add some pics to my portfolio, so as of now, im doing tfp/tfcd stuff Aug 15 06 02:25 pm Link Do you specifically mean why won't they work with you for free, or why won't they pay to work with you, or why won't you let you pay them to work with them? I very very seldom work for free - TFP is seldom free for the photog - we buy equipment, we put several hours AFTER the models is done with the shoot editing, etc - that said, I will work TFP with a model that meets my need at that time or whom I have a great respect for their work and desire to work with them. Besides, I don't have TIME - I stay booked pretty solid between my agency work and paid work - TFP is usually time I don't have. If the tog is paying the model, then they are ONLY going to hire the model that fits their vision EXACTLY. Why should they be required to pay someone who DOESN'T fit that vision? I'm only hiring someone for my company that is what I want and need - not some who feels like I owe them that position. You don't hire a secretary that can't type, becuase you ned a typist. You don't hire a doctor who can't read a thermometer - they wouldn't meet your need. Why give good money to someone who isn't what you need? I seriously doubt most togs are turning you don't if you're willing to pay them. So, maybe, if there is someone you want to shoot with, but who doesn't do TFP or doesn't need to pay for your services, you should consider paying THEM to shoot you. Afterall, THIS IS A BUSINESS. We're not out to be voted "most congenial" (though that would be nice) - we're trying to build our businesses and be successful and secure. It's like any other industry. Most mechanics don't fix your car for free, a restaurant won't give you your food for free, why should a photographer be required to give you his or her services for free? If you want to work with them, make an offer. Who knows, maybe you can work out a deal. Good luck.  Aug 15 06 11:09 pm Link |
