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Models that Don't Show from MM
Had a model that I responded to an ad on Craigslist. We were scheduled to meet and she was a no call no show. She will not respond to emails. Now I see her photos on MM so she is relatively new, at least to MM. Question is, how to handle it? 1. Ignore it and let other photographers figure it out? 2. Tag her asking her what happened and asking if all is ok? 3. ?? Jun 29 06 05:55 pm Link I always think its best to take the high road. She changed her mind for whatever reason. Things happen. Jun 29 06 05:58 pm Link You should definately contact her via MM and say "Hey, I'm glad you made it over here because I was beggining to wonder how I was ever going to get ahold of you after you dissed our shoot....." tee hee ".....thank god you're on MM now so that we can discuss how professional you are in the forums...care to join me??" Yup....that should do the trick. How do I make one of those devil smilies?  Jun 29 06 06:02 pm Link GregoryJ Photography wrote: Saturday before last I had an art nude shoot scheduled with a model. We had talked twice on the phone, including the night before. We talked about the content, her limitations, use of photos, everything. This was not her first shoot, and we were to shoot mild compared to what she'd done in the past. I felt very comfortable and connected with her on a professional level. Saturday morning, nothing... no call, no email, no show. I've emailed her a few times with no reply. I've also called a few times and left messages, no reply. Jun 29 06 06:04 pm Link I always like taking the high road... I was just wondering if it is a kid playing around. I've seen more and more of that... just not here on MM and that's why I bring it up. I've had good experience with ALL the models here on MM. Jun 29 06 06:05 pm Link take the high road, i am running at 3 no-shows outta 4 on m/m now ,but have named, tagged, mentioned none, despite losing around 2k. Jun 29 06 06:05 pm Link Tony Lawrence wrote: True, perhaps... but the courteous thing to do would be for her to call or email and SAY so... Sure, things happen... but that's what phones are for. Jun 29 06 06:07 pm Link People need to be accountable for their actions. You can remain pragmatic and give her the benefit of doubt, but she should at least have the decency to respond to your emails. Honestly, aren't we adults here? There's a certain degree of intregrity expected of you regardless of whether you're shooting something high profile or tfp. At the very least, she should have given advance notice. Photographers and models should be held to the same standards of professionalism. Jun 29 06 06:16 pm Link GregoryJ Photography wrote: Problem is, you can't call her out publicly without making yourself look like a butthole, and getting bogged down in a bunch of "he said.. she said" crap. You pretty much have to just let it go. Jun 29 06 06:17 pm Link LarryB wrote: i have had this exact thing, it was indeed fun, model failed to show for a booked paid shoot in the biggest studio in vegas , no call , no email , zip, and then emailed me for work, i reminded her of her no-show and the 5 photographers i recommend models to, present on that day, result 5 published photographers she is not getting work from apart from myself in lv. woohoo Jun 29 06 06:21 pm Link question is, I feel I owe it to my fellow photographers to let them know. Why should someone go in the hole 2k, as another post wrote? What if I had known that model was always a no show and didn't tell anyone? I know I'd feel bad about that. It is a problem. Jun 29 06 06:23 pm Link GregoryJ Photography wrote: You should let your fellow photographers know. Its a system of checks and balances. I refer my reliable model friends to good photographers that I have worked with and vice versa. Jun 29 06 06:30 pm Link IGNORE AND GO ON WITH YOUR LIFE  SHIT HAPPENSJun 29 06 06:34 pm Link I SAY WE TAR AND FEATHER HER!!!! That'll teach her! Or email the other photographers in your area that you know and let them know what happen!! Jun 29 06 06:43 pm Link I haven't had that happen on MM yet, and just a few times on OMP. I listed them on my profile as such, and I've noticed they've had no new pictures since. If it happened here I wouldn't hesitate to do the same. Since even TFCD is a form of business, flaking for whatever reason is inexcuseable. Jun 29 06 07:59 pm Link Michael Kirst wrote: I like it. Jun 29 06 08:00 pm Link GregoryJ Photography wrote: Jun 29 06 08:02 pm Link Take the high road and move on. She just flaked - nothing happened to her and she's just fine. Jun 30 06 01:12 am Link I'm tired of the high road, besides the high road is the road of the normal people I'd much rather take the road of the fairies, the low road, wouldn't ye? oh yeeeeellll take the high road and I'll take the low road and I'll be in Scotland afore yeeeeeeee Jun 30 06 02:22 am Link In any other business would you really continue to work or do business with a person after making a definate appointment, that did not have the decency to at least call. I think that I could accept most situations, excuses etc. But not to CALL in my opinion is totally unacceptable. It's bad business, bad character, immature. Who ever does this, wrather it be photographer, model, MUA, whoever, Just have the common courtesy, decency, to take 1 second and CALL. Jun 30 06 02:42 am Link Doug Mackay DMP wrote: Hey man, we're not all bad. There are some of us that are genuinely trying to make something out of this, for whatever reason... Sorry for your loss but I wish we could post a list for "good models", ya know? (oh, and good photogs, not to mention) Jun 30 06 02:49 am Link I think the best thing to do would be to dwell on it for days and days, or I don't know, maybe move on and get better model? Jun 30 06 04:29 am Link GregoryJ Photography wrote: Jun 30 06 04:56 am Link At this point you no show or no call, I have no use for you. It's a small world and the PROFESSIONAL model/photography world is smaller. All you can do is stay your course and realize that that is a person you don't want to work with. I used to do the follow up emails and calls to find out if they were ok and such, not anymore. If you ever wonder why people in business become such hard cases, this is part of the reason why. It's not easy when you have a vision or trying to fulfill a contract and the people you are working with do not have the proper work ethic. Yeah, yeah I know "well they could have had an emergency". Enough of the excuses, Far too many people are going back on agreed upon arrangements and then showing up like nothing happened. Darque Jun 30 06 05:13 am Link This is an ongoing problem for many photographers... My suggestion is that MM, OMP, etc, adopt a feedback system similar to ebay, where these models who flake and no show can be weeded out. It would be a great time saver for all of us! Jun 30 06 06:50 am Link All modeling pages should have a rating "system", maybe a 1-10 scale, where you rate on whether the person was on time, ready to work, had proffessional demeanor, ... etc. She probably just flaked, and trying to do anything about it will just make you look like a jerk. Although the tag idea doesn't seem to bad. I can't say I agree with have a " good model/good photographer" list on MM, but even having a reference system like omp has would be helpful. They don't really have an option for " bad experience", but when you see "worked with" and nothing else, you know that on thier end at least the shoot wasn't spectacular, and can ask about it. eh, just my two cents, I suppose if I really wanted to see a change on MM I would send it in to a moderator or something. Jun 30 06 07:03 am Link I haven't had a problem with no-shows, but have considered drawing up a contract that would be sent to the model (or stylist for that matter) two to three weeks before the shoot. It would basically say, "I've got $xxxx wrapped up in this shoot, the accompanying release defines the scope of your role and your compensation, and if you no show with less than 48 hours notice you may be held responsible for xx% of the cost of the shoot. Sign both and mail it to me so that I have it a week prior to the shoot and we'll be in business." Now, if you're shooting TFP good luck getting anyone to sign it. I personally wouldn't sign it and assume that liability unless there was financial compensation coming my way. You also CAN be a nice guy if something happens that can't be avoided. Just because it says that you can seek expense repayment doesn't mean that you have to do so. Her kid gets sick, dog dies, whatever...you can take the high road. But if I've got more than $2,000 dedicated to a shoot you can be sure that it better be one damn good excuse. Jun 30 06 07:04 am Link Ebay has a feedback system, why can't we? Jun 30 06 07:35 am Link I agree with a feedback system, but at the same time, don't make yourself look bad by ripping her publicly. I think there's a middle road. Either post a "Hope you're OK - missed you at our scheduled shoot Saturday!" or go to www.theindustryblacklist.com and let folks know who she is. Jun 30 06 08:58 am Link eh, if they flake, they flake... unless you think she is worth the time and effort to chase down, then flame on, but there are plenty of other folks to network with and create with, ya know? my motto, SUCCESS IS THE BEST REVENGE (forgot where I read that) go find someone else to shoot with and create something better with someone better Jun 30 06 10:22 am Link I can't believe this many models no-show. That is so rude and unprofessional! Even if an emergency comes up on either end (model or photog), a phone call is the minimum common courtesy! There are many of us who would never think of no call/no showing and the rest give us a bad name. I'm sorry for anyone who has an experience like that, but hope you are able to work with someone more reliable and responsible next time.....like maybe me. Have a wonderful weekend, everyone! Jun 30 06 10:31 am Link Simple rule of thumb, "you get what you pay for" was this a TFP shoot? If so, no shows are a regular thing on model sites. Incase you haven't noticed the portfolio's, there is a ton of people that aren't even close to being a models, they just like the attention and want to think there a somebody. I shoot at a professional level and DO NOT SHOOT TFP unless she is experienced and has something VERY unique to offer. If you think your good enough, quit shooting for free and put up a couple great photos and start charging for what you shoot best and the rest will fallow through your paid shoots. I only use model sites to find models to hire for events that are paying gigs. Good luck getting a model off of this site to pay you to shoot, LOL Seriously not trying to bash anyone here but the models are here to get paying jobs and further their careers and so are the photographers. Jun 30 06 10:34 am Link the thing that people forget is that flakey people don't last in the industry very long and profile sites like this have kind of taught people bad behaviors. if somebody bails on you, they will probably do it to somebody else and get a reputation. i am guessing that it was a free shoot, and with those there is a higher likelihood (sp?) of a flake. but with that kind of beavior, i can guarantee that she will not make a career out of modeling if she flakes on every photographer she schedules a shoot with. however, i do agree with taking the high road, if she like seriously screwed you over warn your friends (trust me, this industry is like high school and they will tell all their friends...and so on....). Like if you for some reason paid her before the shoot and she then flaked or she stole your make-up artists e/s palettes or your camera. Or if you got scammed in some way. because that is more like protecting people than playing the power trip game. Jun 30 06 10:40 am Link Photos By JDS wrote: That doesn't make it right. Just because Cash wasn't involved doesnt mean it wasn't professional, and even so, TFP ends up costing someone a little bit, props, styling, not to mention Time. Jun 30 06 10:42 am Link stuff!!! happen..... i wanted to shoot this gal where i am find her on MM set up the date and all she even wanted reference..... so i gave her the number of one of my regular who is also my friend.. i chose not to give her the name of my customers and stuff as i run a studio and i want to keep it away from my MM life....... so lets say after thats its all set up for saturday...... now i get a reply on friday saying she cant do sat cuz she had to shoot with someone else.... now i gave her the choice... of the day making it convenient.. 4 her.... now somehow she double book me with some dude.. telling me she was hopping i was gonna cancel..... fair it did not turn out like yours up here where its a no show no call.... but DOG GONE IT... but i kind of waisted my time...... bottom line.. its no big deal..... the world is still turning... will i work with people from MM yea but i will not take it as seriously as a paid gig Jun 30 06 10:57 am Link GregoryJ Photography wrote: send her a pm. ask her what happened. if she doesn't respond either let it go or post a tag about it. Jun 30 06 11:01 am Link let it go let it go. Even if she did respond (which is unlikely) it'll be some lame bs excuse, so there's really no point. If she was serious about what she's doing she would have contacted you by now. if you really wanted to be spiteful you tell other people who've tagged her that she's a flake lol. Jun 30 06 11:05 am Link I wouldn't post tags, comments or anything. If you are genuinely concerned about why she didn't show, send her a message. If she does not reply, chalk it up to experience. Nothing says unprofessional more than a model who won't show....and a photographer who wants to rub it in by posting public tags or comments and starting threads about it calling out the model and vice versa. I am on both sides, so I can make this statement. Jun 30 06 11:25 am Link quote] Saturday before last I had an art nude shoot scheduled with a model. We had talked twice on the phone, including the night before. We talked about the content, her limitations, use of photos, everything. This was not her first shoot, and we were to shoot mild compared to what she'd done in the past. I felt very comfortable and connected with her on a professional level. Saturday morning, nothing... no call, no email, no show. I've emailed her a few times with no reply. I've also called a few times and left messages, no reply. It irks the shit of me, but hey... what can you do... My gut tells me she just flaked out, for whatever reason. But there's a part of me too that worries she fell off a bridge or worse on the ride over. I wish at the very least she'd email me and tell me to go piss up a rope. At least then I would stop worrying that something bad happened. But hey, that's just me... David Not as strange as it sounds.... same deal last weekend. I had every confidence she'd be there as arranged. No show and no call. Sent an email, and learned from a room mate that she had been in a traffic accident while on the way to the shoot, and her car was totalled. The model wrote the next day and apologized for missing the shoot... Jun 30 06 11:29 am Link Doug Mackay DMP wrote: Just curious, did you get a response? Jun 30 06 11:39 am Link |
