John Jebbia wrote:
Wondering if he was doing this to be spitefull or if you think it was just lack of good judgement on his part?

How did he know where you worked? You said you never shot with him, but that he took your photos at an event. Sounds like he knows a lot more info about you than he should.

Good assessment of the stated facts John. Alecia is referring to a networking event I host, where she met and shot with the photographer in question.
During the event’s, I remind everyone that is shooting to exchange contact information and for the models to fill out a TFCD model release form with any photographer they want images from.

We are a small and friendly group of about 25-35 people depending on the night. My guess is during normal conversation the topic of what do you do for work came up and given that the photographer and Alecia both live in the same city of Olympia, WA. it isn’t too hard to figure out exactly where one works.

To me, this is crossing the line and is not acceptable behavior for not following the agreed upon method of sending the photo disk to the model.

What Alecia asked help with was is there anything she can do to keep him from making further contact with her at home and work?

I say put the rope away and try to offer some realistic suggestions that may help her.

Magdalenka wrote:
Thanks, I just got an idea for the "100 signs you are an internet model" thread

#68 Make up a twisted story to get attention on the forum


It's so funny, you give someone your work adress and then you think he's creepy when he shows up there, haha.

What if this was you asking a question for help here?

He brought in a portfolio not a disc of her photos.
How many photographers do you know to have “questionableâ€? images posted in their books?

Read my reply to John Jebbia.

Thank you all for the support.

Alecia wrote:
Thank you Craig! Also, thank you to everyone else with something helpful to say.

Some of you though need to grow up and find a constructive way to interact with others. I was simply asking for advice, not for a bunch of self-appointed detectives to search for discrepencies in my post.

If a post is asking for advice, why waste a whole lot of your time (and everyone elses) by posting a drawn out reply that doesn't help anyone?

Maybe it’s just inherent for people to react in a cynical way.
I find it better to not try and defend yourself against what they say, but to over look their response in search for the best possible answer that can actually help you with your problem.

John Jebbia wrote:
Sorry Craig.. I wasn't trying to poke holes in her story. Just trying to clear up some confusion. Sorry if I came across as doubting her.

John, you were one of the good replies. You’re post was a pleasant one, thank you.

Alecia wrote:
Some of you though need to grow up and find a constructive way to interact with others. I was simply asking for advice, not for a bunch of self-appointed detectives to search for discrepencies in my post.

You're talking to an audience that's seen a hell of a lot of hokey stories posted on these forums.  Like it or not, discrepancies are pretty significant if you want people to believe you.  So you told your story, met with some skepticism, and now you're telling those people they should grow up?  I would say the people who don't question what they read on the web are probably the ones who need to grow up.

Alecia wrote:
I worked with this photographer once at a meet and greet, but no "questionable pictures" were taken.

Alecia wrote:
oh, and I didn't work with him, he took pictures of me at an event.

Alecia wrote:
Some of you though need to grow up and find a constructive way to interact with others. I was simply asking for advice, not for a bunch of self-appointed detectives to search for discrepencies in my post.

First you say you worked with him. Then you say you didn't. Your story is therefore untrustworthy and suspicious. That doesn't take a detective to figure out, Sherlock. Get your story straight - it's a constructive way to interact with others.

Alecia wrote:
If a post is asking for advice, why waste a whole lot of your time (and everyone elses) by posting a drawn out reply that doesn't help anyone?

Because in preschool, some of us learned not to help the Boy Who Cries Wolf.

Alecia wrote:
*He was NOT dropping off pictures, because he had none to drop off.
*He had come into my work before with a cd of images even though he had my mailing address and phone number. I expressly asked him to not come into my place of work when he can easily send the disc to me.

You "expressly asked him to not come into my place of work"?

That is the real issue.

Tell the full story. You worked with him at a meet and greet. You gave him your contact information and were in touch with one another. He offered to drop off the photos at your work. You asked him not to do that and to mail them to you instead because you think this guy is creepy in some way. (If he was hot and cool and fun, you would be happy that he showed up at work and you'd hope he takes you to lunch.) But, he showed up where you work and it freaked you out because you already asked him not to. You're now pissed at yourself because you told him where you work and you wish you hadn't and you don't know what to do because this is a bit eerie. Right?

See, the truth is, you fucked up a little and you were too embarrassed to admit it, so you told only parts of the tale and looked like a liar. Just fess up and be honest. People on this forum are actually very nice and glad to help if you don't jerk them around with half-stories and bullshit.

That being said, I don't know what to tell you. Because the truth of your story is that he could be some harmless, socially-inept idiot ... or a dangerous stalker-type. YOU know that better than any of us. You've met him. We haven't.

I definitely think you need to call him and confront him on what happened. The way you handle it depends upon HIM. If you think he's creepy and harmless, be submissive. Tell him you got in big trouble and you're afraid you're gonna get fired and he really can't do that anymore. He'll feel awful if he's all obsessive over you and he won't do it again. If you think he may be dangerous and threatening, yell at him. Intimidate him back. Tell him how angry you are and how disrespectful he was and how you'll never work with him and you were going to (total lie) until he pulled this crap. Show that you're not an "easy target" for him.

If you don't get hacked to bits, let us know how it goes!

Craig Thomson wrote:

What if this was you asking a question for help here?

He brought in a portfolio not a disc of her photos.
How many photographers do you know to have “questionableâ€? images posted in their books?

Read my reply to John Jebbia.

Thank you all for the support.

OK so here is what I meant: She has created her own drama, and her story is either partly a lie or there is a big part of it missing.

She says that she has never worked with that person before and doesn't know him, but then he has her phone number and her working adress? Why does she give it out in first place? And she must obviously know him and had contact with him.
I would NEVER give out such private information to someone I don't know and to someone I don't want to know.
Another fact is, that he did no crime and did not threat anyone. What exactly is the problem? That he showed up at an adress she gave him, that her co-workers opinion was that he looked creepy and that he showed them pictures that in their opinion were not innocent???
I mean, she has seen him before and knows who he is and if he looks creepy then she knew that the moment she gave him her adress and her phone number and let him take pictures of her.
So that's it, I'm not going to respond to drama stories any more and I'll do my best to not create any of my own

Magdalenka wrote:
That he showed up at an adress she gave him, that her co-workers opinion was that he looked creepy and that he showed them pictures that in their opinion were not innocent???
I mean, she has seen him before and knows who he is and if he looks creepy then she knew that the moment she gave him her adress and her phone number and let him take pictures of her.
So that's it, I'm not going to respond to drama stories any more and I'll do my best to not create any of my own

Co-workers are now probably wondering what she REALLY does in her spare time when not at work.

Magdalenka wrote:
Thanks, I just got an idea for the "100 signs you are an internet model" thread

#68 Make up a twisted story to get attention on the forum


It's so funny, you give someone your work adress and then you think he's creepy when he shows up there, haha.

Creepy stories do get attention for models. I like the part about, "I went in to work to get my paycheck".  I think this is the norm at this time, instead of " I went in to work to work"

Alecia wrote:
If you are not planning on reading the whole story, there is no need to reply. This issue has been resolved and there is no more need for discussion. Thank you to the people who were helpful.

If you're not planning on telling the whole story, there is no need to ask for help.  It works both ways, Alecia.  You say that some people "need to grow up and find a constructive way to interact with others", yet your way of interacting was to tell people 1/2 the facts and let them jump to conclusions.  When I gave you what was sound advice, you jumped all over me.  You also say

Alecia wrote:
If a post is asking for advice, why waste a whole lot of your time (and everyone elses) by posting a drawn out reply that doesn't help anyone?

The flip side of this is "If a response is giving reasonable advice, why waste a lot of your time (and everyone elses) by jumping all over that person because he or she doesn't agree with you?"

That's advice you can follow.  And I'm glad you resolved this situation.  Despite the fact that I think you presented this issue very poorly, I've never argued that him coming into your was anything other than unsettling.

Alecia wrote:
Thank you Craig! Also, thank you to everyone else with something helpful to say.

Some of you though need to grow up and find a constructive way to interact with others. I was simply asking for advice, not for a bunch of self-appointed detectives to search for discrepencies in my post.

If a post is asking for advice, why waste a whole lot of your time (and everyone elses) by posting a drawn out reply that doesn't help anyone?

Here's some advice:

1. Forget about it.  The guy will not be let back in the building.  Case closed.

2. Don't work with creepy guys at meets

3. Don't ask a MM forum for advice and expect not to get some flack

MM is a free site.  The advice you get here will be worth exactly what you've paid for it.

Alecia wrote:
Today I went into work to collect my paycheck and was informed that a "short, creepy older man" had come in earlier looking for me. He had apparently brought with him some "questionable pictures" and proceeded to show my coworkers. I worked with this photographer once at a meet and greet, but no "questionable pictures" were taken. I have no idea what the pictures are or why he would come into my workplace to show them. He was asked to leave and will not be allowed in the building again.  How socially inept is this? Has anyone ever had this happen to them?

What action can be taken against him?
Thank you.

let's clear a few things up (in response to some posts below):
*the "event" was a photographer/model networking event. There was nothing sexual about it and I was not nude or close to it.
*He was NOT dropping off pictures, because he had none to drop off.
*He had come into my work before with a cd of images even though he had my mailing address and phone number. I expressly asked him to not come into my place of work when he can easily send the disc to me.
*I am not "tweaking the story". Why would I start a thread asking for advice if there really was not a problem to begin with?
*I am not pretending to be a lawyer (which is obviously why I asked for advice) so stop the bs about "well, I'm going to take an attourney's advice over a 19 year olds". I never pretended to know about all of the laws.

The photographer was not professional in visiting your workplace. No matter what his intentions, he could have put your job at risk if your company does not allow visitors.
Have security escort him out next time he attemps to drop by, maybe he'll get the hint then...

Jay Dezelic wrote:
I am not sure what prompted the action by the photographer.  It just sounds like bad judgment on his part to not recognize the sensitivity of the situation.  I was at last night's meet and great and felt sorry for the poor fellow when he was publicly chastised and told to leave the group over the incident.  I did have a chance to see some of his work that he was leaving off for models. - It was quite good by the way. I just got the feeling that he may just have a lot of passion for his craft and may be over zealous in showing it.

The problem with these kinds of posts is the long-term effect they can have on other individuals beyond resolving the simple annoyance you may have encountered.  People make mistakes all the time - as I am sure you have.  You may find that some photogs will shy away from working with someone who is quick to make a public complaint.  I don't know you.  But through circumstance, I do know who you are talking about. So even though you did not mention a name, you triggered a situation in which it was made public to the local market.

My advice is to have some tolerance and accept that some people may not have the same social etiquette that you are accustom too.  Or that they may have misread a situation. If you were not in any danger, which I don't believe you were, it would have been better to have a private talk with: A.) The offending photographer, B.) The organizer of the Meet & Great, or C.) An MM moderator.

As far as going forward, be cautious about creating situations that can get out of control and wreak careers. - Even if you are in the right. You never know what kind of backlash you can create.

Everybody we encounter in this business is a human being. Human beings make mistakes. Human beings have feelings. Human beings can harbor ill-intentions or malice. Human beings can be filled with passion and creativity. Human beings can love, and can hate, can choose to prey on others, or want to help. And so on.

I don't always like all the things that people do, but I enjoy working with people. It's one of the reasons I'm a photographer of people. From your post, you sound like a people person.

Alecia wrote:
I wish I were a lawyer. I am seriosuly considering one or more of those options. Thank you

This well wake him up
https://complaint.ic3.gov/Default.aspx

Alecia wrote:
Today I went into work to collect my paycheck and was informed that a "short, creepy older man" had come in earlier looking for me.

So if he had been younger and taller it would have been OK?

Here are some hints for you:

1.  Most photographers are a lot older than you.  Some of them are short.  Learn to live with it.

2.  How does the fact that the photographer is older or shorter in any way influence the situation?  This sounds like throwing in gratuitous insults when you are claiming to just be simply telling a story.  When you unfairly use loaded terminology to describe a person you are complaining about, it tends to call into question the rest of your story.

clones foxesphotog wrote:

This well wake him up
https://complaint.ic3.gov/Default.aspx

Oh, for god's sake!  You want her to turn him in to the gestapo? 

From what I read, the issue had nothing to do with the internet.  Are you suggesting she file a fraudulent report to get back at him?  Yeah, that'll teach them.  Never mind that you'll actually be committing a crime against him, but hey, the guy was creepy so it's OK, right?

Why are people so anxious to substitute attacks for communication.  Pick up the phone.  Dial his number.  Say "Hey, what you did really creeped me out.  Don't do it again, OK?" 

Wasn't there a thread on here about common sense?

TXPhotog wrote:

Alecia wrote:
Today I went into work to collect my paycheck and was informed that a "short, creepy older man" had come in earlier looking for me.

So if he had been younger and taller it would have been OK?

Here are some hints for you:

1.  Most photographers are a lot older than you.  Some of them are short.  Learn to live with it.

Well, FUCK!  I didn't even notice she called him short until you said that.  Now I'm REALLY pissed!

TXPhotog wrote:

So if he had been younger and taller it would have been OK?

Here are some hints for you:

1.  Most photographers are a lot older than you.  Some of them are short.  Learn to live with it.

2.  How does the fact that the photographer is older or shorter in any way influence the situation?  This sounds like throwing in gratuitous insults when you are claiming to just be simply telling a story.  When you unfairly use loaded terminology to describe a person you are complaining about, it tends to call into question the rest of your story.

No I think Eric nailed her on it when he pointed out that if this short creepy older man had in fact been a Brad Pitt look-a-like (paraphrasing Eric here) that she would have been happy rather than upset that she had showed up at her workspace.

TXPhotog wrote:

So if he had been younger and taller it would have been OK?

Here are some hints for you:

1.  Most photographers are a lot older than you.  Some of them are short.  Learn to live with it.

2.  How does the fact that the photographer is older or shorter in any way influence the situation?  This sounds like throwing in gratuitous insults when you are claiming to just be simply telling a story.  When you unfairly use loaded terminology to describe a person you are complaining about, it tends to call into question the rest of your story.

you make is sound like short and older are insulting, haha I resent that! lol

Dave Krueger wrote:
Well, FUCK!  I didn't even notice she called him short until you said that.  Now I'm REALLY pissed!

some one else called him short, not her... she was just telling us how he was described there is nothing wrong with being short, believe me it has worked to my advantage....

Kelly Kooper wrote:
I think I have a pretty good understanding of what happened. We have social Meet n Greets here in Australia too and they are good fun, there's always lots of different people to talk to. When I went to my first one in 2001, I made the mistake of telling one guy (incidently this photographer was tall and young) where I worked because it came up in conversation and I thought he was just being nice. To my surprise and dismay, he visited me at work a couple of times after that and it drove me crazy because he would usually come up with photos of other girls. Because he was an amateur and usually did nudes, the shots were definitely considered questionable by my workmates and I had to answer a lot of uncomfortable questions because of it. To the OP - I know it sucks babe, I hated it too but I don't really think it is worth the hassle a legal battle will involve. Chalk it up to experience, confront him and tell him it was inappropriate and move on!

Bingo. Thank you for the post