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wanting to start a fight :)
ok not really... but I had a fantastic "conversation" at the end of my last shoot, we had a full crew, me the make-up artist , a hair stylist, a photographer, a model, and a fashion stylist. We were discussing thing about the industry and I can not remeber who started the topic of "Who is the most important person " of course we all thought that "so and so " was the most important because with out "so and so " the shoot wouldnt look as good. It was a great conversation about why we thought that we were the most important part of a photo shoot. Now of course being the make-up artist I thought I was the most important, but I agreed that without a great photographer with a good eye and lighting skills, and a pritty model and nice clothing and good hair the whole thing wouldnt have been as sucsessfull. So why do some people think they are better, Why do some individually become "divas" and think the shoot is all about them? I belive that a photo shoot is a team job not really an individuall thing.even if the focus is on one particular thing like the eye make-up or product placement, or the model her self. All though I can make a not so beautiful model look stunning ,that can be done in phtoto shop too but lets say not photoshop. but a beautiful model still needs to be able to move and "pose" I have seen beautiful models who just bring nothing to the shoot. Also a brillian photographer might be amazing at "landscapes " but not with people. Or some photographers rely to heavily on photo shop, why is this becomming a normal thing? So yah what are your thoughts ? who is the Key player in a photoshoot? and why? Mar 05 06 01:18 am Link Deadly Design Make-up wrote: We called it "Photoshoot Survivor" and figured out who would get voted off the island. Mar 05 06 01:31 am Link I vote for the model, without a model. I'd be shooting plants or cars or buildings. We all revolve around the model Mar 05 06 01:32 am Link Craig Thomson wrote: But you'd still be shooting. A model just modeling with no camera is going to look pretty funny. Mar 05 06 01:36 am Link Deadly Design Make-up wrote: me. Mar 05 06 01:38 am Link Deadly Design Make-up wrote: The client Mar 05 06 01:39 am Link I second that! (for the model) I think everyone plays a vital role in making kick ass pictures. Without the make-up artist or stylist the pictures may be alright but they won't kick ass. Without the photographer well there's no pic! The model is what the blank canvas that everyone makes beautiful and without he/she everyone else couldn't do their job. So anyways I don't think one is more important than the other. Just important in different ways. ;^) Mar 05 06 01:40 am Link Dan Hood MM/Moderator wrote: Here here! :-) Mar 05 06 01:41 am Link James Jackson wrote: It's called a runway or live exibit where the models stand around the gallery or in a store window and pose. Mar 05 06 01:42 am Link wow that didnt take too long to get some dialogue going  now of course we all know that with out a brillant make-up Artist the model is just another girl or boy. may be I am a little bias because thats my job and I have been brought in to redo shoots becasue the model did her own make-up and my expertise was needed I do like good photog's who are both amazing at taking pictures and nice people too. Mar 05 06 01:50 am Link Craig Thomson wrote: But it's called runway or a live exhibit...not a photo shoot... Mar 05 06 01:51 am Link James Jackson wrote: I think the whole point of the op's post was to say that duh.. all the parts are important. :-) You can't drive a four wheeled car on three wheels can you? (no stunt drivers please!) Mar 05 06 01:54 am Link Brandon Smith wrote: Very true... Mar 05 06 01:56 am Link Craig Thomson wrote: James Jackson wrote: I'm sorry James, I didn't know what the rules were, I just answered who I feel is the most important at a photo shoot. Mar 05 06 01:57 am Link The most important person is the person who will be cutting the checkbook, weather it be the model or the photographer.. Bottom line-sooner or later,We all work for the mights buck ! Mar 05 06 02:09 am Link Impro wrote: What if it's a TFP shoot? Read the OP's post. There was no client. Deadly Design Make-up wrote: Mar 05 06 02:12 am Link yah what if its a tfp then who is the "king or queen" of the shoot?? Mar 05 06 02:13 am Link Key player? In my opinion, it's the photographer. It is their contribution to the shoot that "records" the event. You can still do a shoot without an MUA. You can still do a shoot without a wardrobe/stylist. You CAN'T do a shoot without the model (unless it's a product shoot, ha!) You CAN'T do a shoot without the photographer. so... 1. Photographer 2. Model 3. Everyone else Mar 05 06 02:14 am Link The photographer is the most important person the following shot sells for $181,000 and no one is buying it to see the make up or care who the model is it's all about the shot !  Mar 05 06 02:18 am Link KARLOS MATTHEWS wrote: Huh? no client Mar 05 06 02:20 am Link yah but what if the make-up artist was like Rick Baker of Dick Smith ( make-up Artist living Gods)( if you dont know who they are think,, think original and new Planet of the Apes and what not ,so many I can name them all.) ??? then wouldnt they be the most important person and the shoot would be about the make-up Mar 05 06 02:28 am Link Deadly Design Make-up wrote: Definently true, that's what my pic's are missing. Next weekend I'm doing a shoot with a MUA! YAY for MUA's! Mar 05 06 02:28 am Link Deadly Design Make-up wrote: yeah...sure I'll feed him steak and then make him walk the plank! Mar 05 06 02:33 am Link Well in my case the answer really is ME!!! WHY?!? Well, because i do hair. makeup AND photography AND I sometimes even bring/fabricate the clothes for the shoots... Mar 05 06 02:44 am Link Dee wrote: I think you can only pick one. Mar 05 06 02:48 am Link Craig Thomson wrote: Dont I wish!!! There isnt anyone around me that wants to do it so dammit I have to do it myself..LOL Mar 05 06 02:49 am Link Honestly, your not going to like what I have to say but unless a celebrity type of thing it is the photographer who runs the show. Normally for most jobs it is the shooter who is hired 1st and they in turn bring in their crew. The photographer gets the praise when a shoot goes well and takes the blame when it doesn't. It's like this if you crewed on my team and jacked the makeup up who's fault is it.... mine! I'm the one who brought you in. I take responsibility for everything at that shoot. Including the jacking up of the makeup. Now if a art director brings in a patchwork crew and things go bad they will take blame but the photographer is still expected to pull it out with a ad hock crew if it doesn't, the photographer is the one who will take the fall. In the chain of command all production answers to the shooter and the photographer answers to the client or AD or clients rep. Put it this way does your liability insurance have fucked up photographer coverage? I bet not. However my liability coverage has jacked up makeup coverage. Say your makeup causes a severe reaction to the model. I get named in the lawsuit. Why? the shooter is the ringleader. Say the lab kills the film. You don't get named but I do. The wardrobe person burns the model with a steamer I get sued, you don't. In every instance the photographer is a liable party. Why? Chain of command. There is more I should say but it's late. In my years of doing commercial work I have never seen a client hire the MUA then bring a crew around them. Not saying it has never happened but it's not normally how it is done. I know you keep saying it's just tfp but in reality tfp's need to be run just like a real job, if they are not, you have found yourself in the middle of gwc land. Mar 05 06 03:24 am Link To me the answer is "everyone involved". Everyone that does their part to make it turn into a great shoot or show or project, what ever the goal is. Also, everyones fault if it doesn't, even tho it would probably be pointed at someone other then themselves lol There is always something new to learn and new ideas which comes from working with a group with skills. New techniques that maybe we didn't think of for looks, shots, make-up, locations, etc. If not we'd all be doing the exact same thing and not exploring new avenues. When a shoot turns out great or a show it's all the work everyone put in that made it turn out. It's like a painting.. A model is just one color, the photographer another, the mua another, an so on. When all is said and done and you mix all the colors together you've created art. An image of what you wanted others to see. We're like a major motion picture.. at the end of the movie everyone is mentioned including the caterer and animals. Each persons part is important to become sucessful in their trade. Just in this business not all names are mentioned on the photograph, yet we hope through word of mouth (which we hope is done at the end of the day) names are mentioned to others, which I know I recommend people I worked with. Mar 05 06 03:26 am Link Every shoot is different. I would go by who gets paid the most is probably the most important. Key person on most real client shoots that I have seen is the art director. - They represent the client and are in charge of hiring the right "team" to do the job. They are also usually the highest paid (Other than supermodels and superphotogs). Sans art director, then the photog is usually the lead person and therefore is most important. Question is, who does the client assign as most valuable player? Mar 05 06 03:53 am Link The client is the most important party. Whether it be a firm, an agency, the model, the MUA, or the photographer. We are all in the service industry, even if an object (photograph) is "manufactured" from our services. The object has a purpose, to serve the needs of the client. Those who fail to put their clients first - to treat this as any other business - will pay a certain price for that decision. Ergo, if you want to be the most important person, just haul out your checkbook. You'll be amazed at how important you just became . . . Mar 05 06 07:48 am Link Craig Thomson wrote: you can always shoot yourself! Mar 05 06 07:54 am Link AshleyDanielle wrote: I like what you said and I agree. I think its more of a "we" than a "me " situation Mar 05 06 02:11 pm Link James Jackson wrote: LOL, that would seem funny! Mar 05 06 02:24 pm Link bex wrote: Amen! hehehe..I am seriously thinking about that LOL.... Mar 05 06 02:25 pm Link Craig Thomson wrote: I have only seen one live exhibit in a mall before where models were standing in a store window and posing. If I were to shoot them over the glass, do I need a model release from them LOL , half-serious question there Mar 05 06 02:28 pm Link James Jackson wrote: yea but if you vote off the makeup artist youre stuck with a model you may rather not shoot Mar 05 06 08:20 pm Link Okay... let's make a comparison, take a ship... Everybody is important... but who has the most responsibility and is getting paid to keep it all working together? It's the captain! Same thing on a photoshoot... all parts work together, but who is the one PUTTING it all together? It's the photographer. If you don't belief me, then take a look at the payscale... The one who is getting paid the most, probably more than all the other ones COMBINED is the photographer. Even the model is not getting THAT much paid... unless, it's one of the few supermodels, only the supermodel is getting more paid than anybody else. So, I am not wanting to start a fight, and the final product is what counts... but to get there... the photographer is usually asked to put the team together and bills the client for the time and work of the participants. Just a few thoughts... UdoR Mar 05 06 08:28 pm Link Deadly Design Make-up wrote: I'm a pritty model. Mar 05 06 08:29 pm Link Mary wrote:
Mar 05 06 08:30 pm Link Brandon Smith wrote: Yes you can it's called an older pre 80's Peugeot. It was designed that way. It can run on any three wheels at any given time. Mar 05 06 08:32 pm Link |
