Posted by Marcus J. Ranum: 

Posted by CameraSight: 
You could of gotten away with approching a stranger on the street many years ago when Pro photographers had their expensive Nikons, Canons or  Hasselblads and the rest had their poor quality amateur Kodak  Instamatics or 110 cameras but today everybody is a "photographer" using their $200  4 megapixel point and shoot digital camera.

You seem to be laboring under some weird impression that the cost of the camera has some kind of relationship to the skill or professionalism of the photographer?

mjr.

Correct me if I''m wrong, but I had the impression that Camerasight was referring to the impression the potenttial model would get when seeing somebody with fancy equipment.  I didn't feel that CameraSight was suggesting that the Camera cost reflected on the picture quality.  Am I right or wrong?

Posted by HenryS: 
Correct me if I''m wrong, but I had the impression that Camerasight was referring to the impression the potenttial model would get when seeing somebody with fancy equipment.  I didn't feel that CameraSight was suggesting that the Camera cost reflected on the picture quality.  Am I right or wrong?

I think you're right - but I didn't explain my response well. Sorry about that... Your typical prospective "girl on the street" isn't going to know the difference between a Hasselblad and a Sony DCS-25, either. The equipment is not what makes the impression - it's how you carry yourself, how you speak and act, your portfolio, and any "leave behind" collateral materials.

If I were serious about going pro and wanted to get models, I'd have a trifold brochure made up, which had 2 or 3 images, a tasteful and elegant (or what I interpret as tasteful and elegant, anyhow) image on the cover, a few sheets of paper including an FAQ ("what should you expect from a shoot with Marcus Ranum?"), a collage photo of my studio, and me working with a model under the lights, etc. Make it all look really tip-top notch. Resist the urge to print it on your own cheap printer. Resist the urge to print your own business cards on your laserjet.

I ran a software company for 4 years during the 90's - I was CEO of a business I grew from 4 employees to over 35 with millions of dollars/year in sales. When I started the company I was super concerned that we "LOOK LIKE A REAL COMPANY." It wasn't until a while into it that I realized that the difference between "real" and "fake" is largely
a) appearance
b) results
Which ties me back to this whole "talk to models" thing. Having $20,000 in cameras won't make you "real" to someone who's not into cameras. Having an elegant brochure, a top-notch portfolio, killer references, and 30 other models that she can talk to -- THAT makes you real.

If you want to look real, *be* real.

mjr.

Posted by George Butler: 
I think many will agree, your work only looks half as good as the subject or content.

Which is why I have to choose models that are twice as beautiful... This way my work looks good regardless :-P

Posted by Ty Simone: 

Posted by George Butler: 
I think many will agree, your work only looks half as good as the subject or content.

Which is why I have to choose models that are twice as beautiful... This way my work looks good regardless :-P

Wow, Ty agreed with me, let me go leave some more comments on his pics.

Posted by George Butler: 

Posted by Ty Simone: 

Posted by George Butler: 
I think many will agree, your work only looks half as good as the subject or content.

Which is why I have to choose models that are twice as beautiful... This way my work looks good regardless :-P

Wow, Ty agreed with me, let me go leave some more comments on his pics.

Please do, And create like 20+ other accounts with different names and leave a comment per account for me!

(c:

Posted by theda: 
Try "I'm a photographer and I'd like to photograph you. Here is my card."

Do not try "I am a world renowned photographer. I can make you famous. I'll have you on the cover of vogue.  Here is my number written on the back of a receipt from Juanita's Porn Shack." That only works for Erics.

Totally agree w/ Theda!  Just keep it simple!  Let your work speak for itself!

Posted by Kathy Grogan: 
What the hell is a GWC??

GWC = Guy With Camera. Condescending term for "photographers" who use photography just to meet hot chicks. (Could also be Girl With Camera for females with the same motives.)

CWS = Chick With Snapshots. Condescending term for "models" who ask for paid shoots and only have snapshots in their portfolios. (It's still "Chick With Snapshots" for guys because they are girly biatches. Heh, heh.)

Posted by Simply Sonya: 

Posted by theda: 
Try "I'm a photographer and I'd like to photograph you. Here is my card."

Do not try "I am a world renowned photographer. I can make you famous. I'll have you on the cover of vogue.  Here is my number written on the back of a receipt from Juanita's Porn Shack." That only works for Erics.

Totally agree w/ Theda!  Just keep it simple!  Let your work speak for itself!

Sonya, I'm a photographer and I'd love to photgraph you, here's my ... ooops, Out of cards!

Posted by JvR: 

...Anyway, though I carry photographer business cards with me, I actually have never used them. I most often see potential models at the mall or so, where they're with their boyfriend or girlfriends. Somehow, that holds me back. I'm assuming the boyfriend might not like me approaching his girlfriend or pissing off the girlfriends who aren't asked to model. Anybody have experience with these situations?

Thanks

Very simple, approach the guy. This solves two problems, first you aren't bruising the guys ego by passing over him. Second, it makes the young lady feel more comfortable that your intentions are honorable and you're serious.

Posted by Eric Muss-Barnes: 
GWC = Guy With Camera. Condescending term for "photographers" who use photography just to meet hot chicks.

DUDE! You totally wrong me!! I don't use photography just to meet hot chicks! I meet lots of hot chicks all the time at the Denny's where I bus tables for my day job!! I use photography to get hot chicks to take their clothes off - don't you know anything?!!!

You're just jealous because my camera's bigger than yours, or something like that, anyhow. Once I've gotten good with my camera and I'm the next Richard Avedon-Newton or whatever his name is, there's gonna be a line of hot chicks like Angelina Jolie begging to do TFP with me and you'll still be here on model mayhem trash-talkin' GWC!

GWC!

Posted by GWC: 

Posted by Eric Muss-Barnes: 
GWC = Guy With Camera. Condescending term for "photographers" who use photography just to meet hot chicks.

DUDE! You totally wrong me!! I don't use photography just to meet hot chicks! I meet lots of hot chicks all the time at the Denny's where I bus tables for my day job!! I use photography to get hot chicks to take their clothes off - don't you know anything?!!!

I stand corrected. Yes. To take their clothes off. I forgot that detail.

Posted by Eric Muss-Barnes: 

Posted by Kathy Grogan: 
What the hell is a GWC??

CWS = Chick With Snapshots. Condescending term for "models" who ask for paid shoots and only have snapshots in their portfolios. (It's still "Chick With Snapshots" for guys because they are girly biatches. Heh, heh.)

This is very sensitive to my heart. I loved my sprint pix. LOL. But now I had to take em off.

Oh, when I was a teen I would have guys approach me about modeling. I dont care how "tight" your game is...PLEASE..PLEASE have some REAL business cards. Not the crap you print off yourself from Microsoft word.

Posted by HenryS: 
This question only applies to legitimate photographers, be they professional, amateur, or somewhere in between. 

Photographers, when you see a woman in the supermarket, school, or any other area (not on the job) how do you introduce yourself as a photographer who is interested in photographing her, especially with photos that are revealing to a greater or lesser degree.  Have you done this? Any success stories?

Models, how would you react under such circumstances?  What would make you listen, and what would make you walk away?

First, I start off with a smile and a "Hello there" and wait for her body language. If it's positive and receptive, I apologize for being forward, give her a very brief intro about the hat I'm currently wearing (photographer), follow up with a comment about her looks that's unique to her, give her my card and close with something. Like, "if one day you feel compelled to try it out..."

Sometimes, I've had my kid(s) with me, other times, I was by myself. Both scenarios never made a difference. As accurate as I can be, the number of times I've approached a person in this manner, I can say that the success ratio was a 9 out of 10.

I've done this when I worked in downtown San Francisco and the people I approached where typically people dressed in business attire. There were times my attired wasn't business like. It never made a difference.

I've done this at the McDonald's line, at Church, Festivals, Family parties, etc. But the main key that helps is that I don't wait until she's alone in order to approach her. That's extremely shady to me. I do it right there in the middle of crowd, or her friends, or her significant other. That way, they can all see me and my actions for what it really is and not for what it really ain't -- an attempted pickup, or some kind of con.

Posted by George Butler: 

Posted by JvR: 

...Anyway, though I carry photographer business cards with me, I actually have never used them. I most often see potential models at the mall or so, where they're with their boyfriend or girlfriends. Somehow, that holds me back. I'm assuming the boyfriend might not like me approaching his girlfriend or pissing off the girlfriends who aren't asked to model. Anybody have experience with these situations?

Thanks

Very simple, approach the guy. This solves two problems, first you aren't bruising the guys ego by passing over him. Second, it makes the young lady feel more comfortable that your intentions are honorable and you're serious.

I know there's been some controversy on MM threads before about boyfriends/husbands or other to accompany the model, but I think it always shows good intent.

Posted by Josue Pena: 
hey.... well I think is not a big deal just say:

I'm a photographer, Here is my card and I'd like to take your portait.

if you do photography for living sure you have with you a potfolio or at least printed examples, you show them and thats it.....
if they want to be photographed they will say yes, it happends all the time, no?
by the way.... is not just if you see a hot girl, coule be a family an old man or old woman, a fancy dog.... just a thougth.......

Off the topic a bit, but I've a great little story about that.  I was on a professional tour in Romania, when we stopped at a museum in a small little town.  It was late on a Sunday when a tiny lady dressed in black crossed our path going to church.  There were about eight of us.  She looked so haggered and quaint that we all asked if we could photograph her.  She agreed and posed for a minute or two.  We all pressed the equivalent of two or three dollars into her hand anfd this lady just started to cry in such gratitude.  Imagine!  We made an old lady cry and we felt so good about it! 

Posted by theda: 

Posted by Joe K. Perez: 
I really hate it when people use "Joe" in their stupid euphemisms.

Edited.

Lol. You hit the 10 mark on the Sweety charts for that one Theda

Posted by HenryS: 

Posted by George Butler: 

Posted by JvR: 

...Anyway, though I carry photographer business cards with me, I actually have never used them. I most often see potential models at the mall or so, where they're with their boyfriend or girlfriends. Somehow, that holds me back. I'm assuming the boyfriend might not like me approaching his girlfriend or pissing off the girlfriends who aren't asked to model. Anybody have experience with these situations?

Thanks

Very simple, approach the guy. This solves two problems, first you aren't bruising the guys ego by passing over him. Second, it makes the young lady feel more comfortable that your intentions are honorable and you're serious.

I know there's been some controversy on MM threads before about boyfriends/husbands or other to accompany the model, but I think it always shows good intent.

One should always show good intent. I doubt if it will work because most men are too posessive.

One of my Wife's best friends came by one day and she just looked stunning that day and it happened to be her birthday. So, of course I convinced her to do some quick shots. She absolutely adored the results, was more than ecstatic about shootong again. That was a year ago, everytime we schedule something we have to cancel because her husband doesn't feel comfortable. Might I add my family has been in their home several times and vice versa. Just about everytime he sees me he is saying yeah I need to do some more pictures with his Wife because she really liked it. I don't even bother anymore to ask about her modeling, but everytime he comes over I take a few quick pictures of him.

Posted by HenryS: 

Posted by Monsante Bey: 
I normally snatch their purse, run 5 blocks and dump it in a post office box with my card in it.

I don't think I'll try or recommend that one!

Aw c'mon, you need the adventure in your life. lol

No but seriously. I just introduce myself, hand them my 4x6 business card (it's big so it will leave an impression) and tell them to check out my work online, because most times I don't have my land based portfolio with me, though I need to put it in the trunk of my car. Anyway, I let the chips fall where they may from there. In Atlanta, I had MAD business from that. In Ohio... HAHAHA!!!! Yea, right!

Posted by CameraSight: 
You could of gotten away with approching a stranger on the street many years ago when Pro photographers had their expensive Nikons, Canons or  Hasselblads and the rest had their poor quality amateur Kodak  Instamatics or 110 cameras but today everybody is a "photographer" using their $200  4 megapixel point and shoot digital camera.  I am in the process of putting a web address on by business card so models can see my work.

You mean photographers spend as much as $200 for their camera?!  No wonder I can't get any work.

Posted by larsomatic: 


You mean photographers spend as much as $200 for their camera?!  No wonder I can't get any work.

lol, that's $200 on a digital, not on a film SLR, which are pretty inexpensive now-a-days (says the film SLR guy).

Posted by SindelChaos: 
Hehehe, I have a fun story about this. 

When I was 14 visiting Ft.Lauderdale, FL on vaction, I had this happen.  It was Independence Day and I was in a sour mood because I left sunblock in the car.  I walked back to where we were parked and this guy just runs up to me.

He has a business card with a bunch of X's and scribbles on it and then on the back has his information.  He tells me he wants to make a website for me and blah blah. 

I had a feeling his motives were for adult modeling, but I went ahead and sent him an email telling him I was 14 when I got back home.  He decided to make me a site anyway, which was generous, but turned out being a waste of time.  He only updated it once when I turned 15 after I made another trip down there to shoot with him and his friend.  I actually sent him photos and stuff I wanted uploaded as time went by, and he would come up with some excuse to not do it. 

I later found out he was an owner of an adult modeling agency, but made a different agency name and posted it on my site, so there would be no suspicion to child pornography(which none of that went on anyway).  He never returned my phone calls and he never got me any jobs.  He was my "manager" for awhile.  I basically just blew him off and did freelance stuff which was more productive than his "site management"  I finally called him up and told him to take the site down.

So, now I'm a lot more cautious if someone comes up to me with some kind of offer, until I get a professional business card and a background check.

That's another of my problems. Living in the Fort Lauderdale/Miami area. Tons of scam artists and porn producers down here. I'm sure every pretty girl in the area has been approached by "managers/agents/photographers" telling them how gorgeous they are and that they can help them in their modeling career, etc. So I don't even bother anymore. I figure eventually, if I'm out with my camera enough, someone may come up to me and ask to shoot them. If not, I'll just continue my career as a stealth/guerilla candid street photographer.

Posted by Monsante Bey: 

Posted by larsomatic: 


You mean photographers spend as much as $200 for their camera?!  No wonder I can't get any work.

lol, that's $200 on a digital, not on a film SLR, which are pretty inexpensive now-a-days (says the film SLR guy).

I'm glad my sarcasm translated into print.

Posted by DRowan: 
Have some professional cards printed, carry your cards (& book) everywhere you go & keep on the alert for good model prospects. (My daughter will often spot them before I will & she provides the perfect "this-guy-isn't-a-weirdo" defense when approaching strangers).

That right there is one of the best ways to really get a positive response from my experience. Have soemone else keeping an eye out for you and having them point the person in your direction. You don't need a daughter even though I can't think of anyone that would know how you treat women better, but a buffer of some sort works great.

Friends are good, but best way is someone you have worked with. If they trust and respect you after working with you, even better after they have got the photos, they can be the perfect walking billboard. Like the saying goes the best advertisement is a satisfied client.

Posted by Nealean: 


There are sooooo many guys out here that claim they are photographers, but when you show up all they have is a Kodak disposible camera... 

So if a guy has a great big expensive looking camera, then he's a photographer?  Score one for the GWC's.  Do you have any idea how many guys look at my inexpensive/vintage/toy gear and say "you'll get more chicks with a big camera like mine -- it works!"

In my work I use disposable cameras, toycameras, antique cameras, the lot.  I'm not saying you have to go off with every guy who says he's a photographer, but the camera does NOT make the images, the person holding it does.

Posted by Melvin Moten Jr: 
Do you have any idea how many guys look at my inexpensive/vintage/toy gear and say "you'll get more chicks with a big camera like mine -- it works!"

In my work I use disposable cameras, toycameras, antique cameras, the lot.  I'm not saying you have to go off with every guy who says he's a photographer, but the camera does NOT make the images, the person holding it does.

I agree,  people who disagree should look up the photographer Terry Richardson.  There are others.