Model
Manko
Posts: 5
Oxford, England, United Kingdom
Let's separate between shit-stirring "managers" and general chaperones of the model. I always bring my assistant to the shoot (my boyfriend by the way). He runs around liting my ciggies whilst I'm stuck in makeup room, he makes coffees, he's the one I quietly vent to when someone on the crew pisses me off. His assistance is what tames the stress levels of 14 hour photosessions and makes it possible.
Photographer
American Glamour
Posts: 38813
Detroit, Michigan, US
studio36uk wrote:
Here are extracts from a "model manager's" contract with models that is actually photographic model related: Talent Management Contract [EXTRACTS]
* Talent agrees to pay Management a non-refundable fee of $250 for startup costs of this contract to cover setup and administrative costs.
* Clients: All clients are and remain the sole ownership of the Management. Once a Talent has worked a job through Management, Talent agrees that he or she will do no work for the client outside the realm of this contract for (3) three years with said client or representatives of said client.
* Marketing Point: Talent agrees to turn over control of One Model Place portfolio to Management or to allow Management to create a talent portfolio on One Model Place to which Management has control over.
* Term: This agreement shall take affect as of the first date set forth above, and remain in full force until mutually agreed upon, unless terminated as provided in termination clause below.
* Termination: This Agreement may be terminated by a paid offer to buy this Agreement from the Management with the consent of the Management in writing. If any concessions, residuals or fee arrangements are made prior to termination, Management shall continue to receive percentages. If any interest is generated through Managementâs efforts that cause the Talent to receive funds, Management shall also receive the percentage agreed upon in this agreement or a prenegotiated percentage thereafter.
* Commissions: The Management shall be entitled to 20% (percent) commission for work and all residuals income on contracts or arrangements obtained through Talent and Managementâs association and 10% (percent) commission on work found by talent on their own or through other resources such as talent agencies. This also includes designs and or creations for the term of any agreement in which the Managements and Talentâs efforts cause copyrighted material, shows, residuals, or any other form of income for the life of each agreement by or created by the Management or the Talentâs association and or associations referred or introduced to talent by Management or Managementâs lead getting work. For the record, this is not what the contract of a legitimate would look like.
Talent managers are an important part of the entertainment industry. There is a big difference between a legitimate manager and a net manager. Professional mangers have their own association and gaining membership requires credibility.
The contract you have posted is not something any respectable manager would use.
Photographer
Stephen Bodi
Posts: 848
East Northport, New York, US
There has to be a disctinction made between real agent/managers and wannabe's . There should also be a distinction between bad agent/managers and good ones (they do exist). There is one agent/manager I know here in NY who is one of the "good guys" so I will use him a as an example (not naming names). Also, 20% is somewhat standard, but a agent will have the client pay his fee if possible or at least half. In effect the model gets the full pay or only has to pay the agent 10% while the client pays the other 10%. It usually depends on the how much the job pays etc... This particular agent does not sign exclusive contracts with models. If a model gets a job on her own with a client who is not known by the agent thats her business. Generally if that happens the model might introduce the client to the agent and he would then have them as a lead for paid work for other models. The model who found the client might also get a finders fee at some point. The model can also continue their independant relationship with that client as well. With regard to TFPCD shoots etc... The only thing this agent will do is double and triple check the references of a new photographer who wants to arrange a TFP shoot with one of his models. The model may need pictures for her book etc... This agent I know might arrange for an escort for the model and/or will also have the model call in to make sure everything is ok. This particular agent has a pretty thorough screening process with regards keeping his models safe.
Here is a quick rundown:
Good Agent:
Is licensed and bonded. Actively seeks paid work for his/her models to their exact limits.In other words doesnt send a model who does not do nudes to a nude shoot, essentially a bait and switch . I have seen so called agent wannabes do that. Is generally non exclusive (will be encouraged to work harder to get work for their talent if they have people competing with them to do that). Uses connections and networking to find new clients etc... Checks backrounds of clients (safety, and if they have ever bounced checks etc...). Makes sure the model makes their appointments even if its a TFP shoot. A good agent will make sure the model doesnt flake out. Will make sure the models are not taken advantage of financially or or otherwise. Will treat their talent with respect. A good agent works hard for their talent and is always honest.
Bad Agent/agentwannabe:
Not licensed or bonded (unless you mean currently our on bail). Treats talent like meat. Tries to get work for them but often does not. Tries to sleep with models. When they get work they sit on their ass and collect their fee without doing any follow up work such as checking references etc... Sends models to bait and switch jobs and then acts shocked and swears up and down that the "client" told him/her it was just a bikini shoot and not a gangbang video involving 7 midgets. Pretty much the rest of this is whatever a good agent does, except its the exact opposite. You get the idea.
So far I have met only 1 agent/manager who fit all the criteria for being a good agent and one other who fit most of the criteria. Other than those 2 people pretty much every "manager/agent" who has ever introduced themselves to me has been some kind of lowlife or another.
Photographer
Torrence Williams
Posts: 247
Dallas, Texas, US
studio36uk wrote:
No it's NOT. Arranging shoots and "booking" models is an AGENT's job NOT a manager's.
So are you a manager or an agent? If you have "clients" other than the models themselves then you are an agent
EXACTLY a reason NOT to hire or shoot any of your talent! Duh!
Studio36 Ok Mr. Smarty....
First off Managers, can perform duties as an agent. As far as you not hiring any of my Talent...(oh no!!!. please don't shun us.. We will be hurt for life!!!!! NOT!!!!) If our operations DO NOT interfere with your way of functioning, then how would hiring, or shooting any of my talent be a problem??!!!.... I just think you are being pompass, due to your bad experience... BTW I have never had any complaints from anyone that has shot with, (a number of which have photog profiles on MM), nor hired ANY of my models, because of our operating practices...
Photographer
studio36uk
Posts: 22898
Tavai, Sigave, Wallis and Futuna
Alan from Aavian Prod wrote:
For the record, this is not what the contract of a legitimate would look like.
Talent managers are an important part of the entertainment industry. There is a big difference between a legitimate manager and a net manager. Professional mangers have their own association and gaining membership requires credibility.
The contract you have posted is not something any respectable manager would use. Exactly my point Alan. Exactly!
Studio36
Model
Suzi
Posts: 483
Toledo, Ohio, US
Stephen Bodi wrote:
There has to be a disctinction made between real agent/managers and wannabe's . There should also be a distinction between bad agent/managers and good ones (they do exist). There is one agent/manager I know here in NY who is one of the "good guys" so I will use him a as an example (not naming names). Also, 20% is somewhat standard, but a agent will have the client pay his fee if possible or at least half. In effect the model gets the full pay or only has to pay the agent 10% while the client pays the other 10%. It usually depends on the how much the job pays etc... This particular agent does not sign exclusive contracts with models. If a model gets a job on her own with a client who is not known by the agent thats her business. Generally if that happens the model might introduce the client to the agent and he would then have them as a lead for paid work for other models. The model who found the client might also get a finders fee at some point. The model can also continue their independant relationship with that client as well. With regard to TFPCD shoots etc... The only thing this agent will do is double and triple check the references of a new photographer who wants to arrange a TFP shoot with one of his models. The model may need pictures for her book etc... This agent I know might arrange for an escort for the model and/or will also have the model call in to make sure everything is ok. This particular agent has a pretty thorough screening process with regards keeping his models safe.
Here is a quick rundown:
Good Agent:
Is licensed and bonded. Actively seeks paid work for his/her models to their exact limits.In other words doesnt send a model who does not do nudes to a nude shoot, essentially a bait and switch . I have seen so called agent wannabes do that. Is generally non exclusive (will be encouraged to work harder to get work for their talent if they have people competing with them to do that). Uses connections and networking to find new clients etc... Checks backrounds of clients (safety, and if they have ever bounced checks etc...). Makes sure the model makes their appointments even if its a TFP shoot. A good agent will make sure the model doesnt flake out. Will make sure the models are not taken advantage of financially or or otherwise. Will treat their talent with respect. A good agent works hard for their talent and is always honest.
Bad Agent/agentwannabe:
Not licensed or bonded (unless you mean currently our on bail). Treats talent like meat. Tries to get work for them but often does not. Tries to sleep with models. When they get work they sit on their ass and collect their fee without doing any follow up work such as checking references etc... Sends models to bait and switch jobs and then acts shocked and swears up and down that the "client" told him/her it was just a bikini shoot and not a gangbang video involving 7 midgets. Pretty much the rest of this is whatever a good agent does, except its the exact opposite. You get the idea.
So far I have met only 1 agent/manager who fit all the criteria for being a good agent and one other who fit most of the criteria. Other than those 2 people pretty much every "manager/agent" who has ever introduced themselves to me has been some kind of lowlife or another. What he said.
Model
Tara Donancricchia
Posts: 363
Chicago, Illinois, US
D'Magi Visual Concepts wrote:
Okay, I've had it. Stick a fork in me... I'm DONE.
I've had it with models who want to shoot TFCD, but they must bring there managers. No More!!!!!
Models: A photo shoot is a time of creativity and flow. It is a time for you to express yourself in front of the camera, to be the best you can be so that the photographer can capture you in the best light (pun intended).
But when you bring your so-called manager, you are throwing a wrench in the works. You are constantly looking to them for approval or suggestions instead of relying on the photographers skill, expertise and creativity. Managers do not see what the camera sees.
Today was the straw that broke the camels back for me. I shot a TFCD with a model (with "manager" (lover) in tow. After the shoot, I gave the model a standard model release to sign, as well as a reciprical release so that she could also use the photos in any way she wanted (i.e. prints, media, websites, calendars, etc.).
Her manager decided she (the manager is female) would HAND-WRITE a reciprical release of her own, stating that the model had EQUAL rights to the images.
I explained that the release I was giving her already gave her the rights to print, reprint, use, modify and publish the images (with proper photo credit), but she demanded that I give equal rights (which implies shared copyright) to the image or her model would not sign my release.
Now, I paid for the studio and the make-up artist. I set-up the studio, did the shoot, tore down the studio, and am doing the post-production of the images, but she's demanding EQUAL rights to the images.
Of course, I did not, nor will I sign.
Have any other of you photogs come across insanity like this?
Models, what are your thoughts? I do not blame you a bit!! Stick to your guns and dont sign! BTW... I can see bringing someone to help with wardrobe, etc, but never bring a b/f, husband or lover or whatever... It tends to cause problems. You are working with the photographer, not the person you bring with you! Geez!! LOL!
Model
Tara Donancricchia
Posts: 363
Chicago, Illinois, US
D'Magi Visual Concepts wrote:
Okay, I've had it. Stick a fork in me... I'm DONE.
I've had it with models who want to shoot TFCD, but they must bring there managers. No More!!!!!
Models: A photo shoot is a time of creativity and flow. It is a time for you to express yourself in front of the camera, to be the best you can be so that the photographer can capture you in the best light (pun intended).
But when you bring your so-called manager, you are throwing a wrench in the works. You are constantly looking to them for approval or suggestions instead of relying on the photographers skill, expertise and creativity. Managers do not see what the camera sees.
Today was the straw that broke the camels back for me. I shot a TFCD with a model (with "manager" (lover) in tow. After the shoot, I gave the model a standard model release to sign, as well as a reciprical release so that she could also use the photos in any way she wanted (i.e. prints, media, websites, calendars, etc.).
Her manager decided she (the manager is female) would HAND-WRITE a reciprical release of her own, stating that the model had EQUAL rights to the images.
I explained that the release I was giving her already gave her the rights to print, reprint, use, modify and publish the images (with proper photo credit), but she demanded that I give equal rights (which implies shared copyright) to the image or her model would not sign my release.
Now, I paid for the studio and the make-up artist. I set-up the studio, did the shoot, tore down the studio, and am doing the post-production of the images, but she's demanding EQUAL rights to the images.
Of course, I did not, nor will I sign.
Have any other of you photogs come across insanity like this?
Models, what are your thoughts? BTW... You have just been stuck with a fork! 
Photographer
Halcyon 7174 NYC
Posts: 20109
New York, New York, US
I don't recommend lying very often, but in this case, I'd call it playing with their head.
Just tell the manager that you as the photographer inherrently posess the copyright (true), and if they want the rights then all six of you (you, manager, model, hair stylist, makeup artist, stylist) would need to go to a notary and then a US Post Office for a $100 "Library of Congress stamp" to alter that copyright (false).
Photographer
studio36uk
Posts: 22898
Tavai, Sigave, Wallis and Futuna
Torrence Williams wrote:
I just think you are being pompass, due to your bad experience... Nope, I am being smart in who I will and won't deal with... and I've been shooting for over 40 years [but am now semi-retired.]
What YOU claim is a manager's job is actually unlawful [for managers to be doing] in a least at handful of states - and has been much discussed here on MM.
To make the distinction again: A MANAGER has one fiduciary* "client" - the model(s) [and there indeed can be more than one model with a singular manager] - and may work for them and only them and only in their interests; but an AGENT has many clients and none of them is ever the model.
You, or any other "model manager," can not be both at the same time without a fundamental conflict of interest.
I don't play dat game!
Studio36
* noun (plural fi·du·ci·ar·ies)
Definitions: trustee: a manager entrusted to control property or to act on behalf of and for the benefit of another
Photographer
Eugene Breaux retired
Posts: 50
Saint James City, Florida, US
When you follow the industry standards of the business you donât have these kinds of problems. Obviously the so called manager was not a professional manager or she would have known better.
1. Always have the models sign the release before you start the shoot. (that way you canât forget).
2. If there is a manager involved and they are on the set, the photographer will be being paid for the shoot.
3. TFCDs (what pros call test shoots) are between the model and the photographer. Real managers just give the models permission to do test shoots.
4. Real managers are licensed and bonded by law in Florida.
Follow the standards and you wonât get burned.
Eugene
Photographer
500 Gigs of Desire
Posts: 3833
New York, New York, US
Web-model pimps are maggots.
Photographer
Wordman
Posts: 7
Select Models wrote:
You've nailed reason after reason why I dont associate with, invite or deal with ANY model who's connected to some parasitic manager in any way, shape or form. So listen up models!... your decision to use some (get a life of your own loser boyfriend) manager will end up breaking more deals for you... eliminating more paychecks and blocking more opportunities for you than you'll ever imagine. One hundred percent of all monies we pay out goes DIRECTLY to models, and NO ONE else! So managers... quit living vicariously thru your offspring or girlfriend... introduce her to an established agent... cut the ebilical cord and get a job ya suckup... Ebilical? Umbilical? Tomato? Tomotto?
Makeup Artist
Camera Ready Studios
Posts: 7191
Dallas, Texas, US
Eric S. wrote:
Web-model pimps are maggots. you took the words right out of mouth.
Photographer
Image-N-More LLC
Posts: 12
Hartford, Alabama, US
i'm a photographer and a "manager" (advisor) but i know the difference between professionalism and just being a jerk. Sorry to hear that most of your expereinces with a manager are sour but lets understand the other side. alot of models nowadays i heard get basically screwed with no lubrication from other photographers. even tho that dont explain why managers have to be an asshole. as a photograph i understand certain things and i had times where the model wanted to do something we both thought was cool but the freind trashed the whole idea with her speech of values. so when i "manage" a model. i only go if a photographer sounds suspect (GWC). but when i get there i usually do other work and i tell the model i "manage" (advise) to pay attention to the photographer cuz unless he is physically harming you i'm going to agree with the photographer and not be in his way. I'm only there to make sure contractual stuff is right since i'm in the business.
Makeup Artist
Camera Ready Studios
Posts: 7191
Dallas, Texas, US
Image-N-More LLC wrote:
i'm a photographer and a "manager" (advisor) but i know the difference between professionalism and just being a jerk. Sorry to hear that most of your expereinces with a manager are sour but lets understand the other side. alot of models nowadays i heard get basically screwed with no lubrication from other photographers. even tho that dont explain why managers have to be an asshole. as a photograph i understand certain things and i had times where the model wanted to do something we both thought was cool but the freind trashed the whole idea with her speech of values. so when i "manage" a model. i only go if a photographer sounds suspect (GWC). but when i get there i usually do other work and i tell the model i "manage" (advise) to pay attention to the photographer cuz unless he is physically harming you i'm going to agree with the photographer and not be in his way. I'm only there to make sure contractual stuff is right since i'm in the business. quick question....are the girls in your portfolio the ones you manage? I'm just curious about what kind of models need managers....and why do they need managers?
Photographer
SolraK Studios
Posts: 1213
Atlanta, Georgia, US
Eric S. wrote:
Web-model pimps are maggots. LOL.........
Photographer
Flashforward Photo
Posts: 10
Colorado Springs, Colorado, US
Managers suck!!!! I accidentally had an encounter of this kind about ten years ago, and I promised myself, never again! I now discuss EVERYTHING before the shoot. I feel for you, nothing is worse than having the creative force sucked out of you by some jerk! and the manager!
Photographer
SolraK Studios
Posts: 1213
Atlanta, Georgia, US
Manko wrote:
Let's separate between shit-stirring "managers" and general chaperones of the model. I always bring my assistant to the shoot (my boyfriend by the way). He runs around liting my ciggies whilst I'm stuck in makeup room, he makes coffees, he's the one I quietly vent to when someone on the crew pisses me off. His assistance is what tames the stress levels of 14 hour photosessions and makes it possible. this is exactly why I don't allow escorts.......
how much coffee can one person make and how many ciggies can he light? If someone pisses you off you should address it to the photographer right.....come on your a big girl start acting like one!
Photographer
Gems of Nature in N Atl
Posts: 1334
North Atlanta, Georgia, US
I've always thought web models who have managers are just tooo dumb to know better, especially those who pick a photographer. As for the escorts, well I used to let them sit in the lobby, but after a few too snoopy types, I now tell them to make sure they have plenty of gas in their car as they will be sitting outside.
Life is tooo short for doing tfp's or whatever and to have to put up with some model who has a body and a boyfriend...
Photographer
Gems of Nature in N Atl
Posts: 1334
North Atlanta, Georgia, US
wow, just read my post... i need to chill a bit.. sorry ya'll
Photographer
Image-N-More LLC
Posts: 12
Hartford, Alabama, US
Mary wrote:
quick question....are the girls in your portfolio the ones you manage? I'm just curious about what kind of models need managers....and why do they need managers? not all of them and i only manage models that just started off and didnt know how to go about things so kinda called manage but i really just advise them. when you new you dont know nothing just like when i started other photographers and and models advised me on what i need to do. so i kind of return the favor toward models who are truly genuine and trying to start off. now if you a stripper turned model and asking for money off the rip i wont help you.
Photographer
SolraK Studios
Posts: 1213
Atlanta, Georgia, US
Image-N-More LLC wrote:
not all of them and i only manage models that just started off and didnt know how to go about things so kinda called manage but i really just advise them. when you new you dont know nothing just like when i started other photographers and and models advised me on what i need to do. so i kind of return the favor toward models who are truly genuine and trying to start off. now if you a stripper turned model and asking for money off the rip i wont help you. which means your not a manager...... the blind leading the blind. so how can you advise a model when you really don't know how??
Photographer
Frank Tammen
Posts: 203
Sacramento, California, US
Here's a paragraph from my OMP site; works perfect and weeds out the garbage, leaving me with top professionals who are incredibly fun to work with.
"However, if you need control or approval from an agent or significant-other, well, then, HighPoint will have to take a pass on you. From our end, we are The Decision-Maker, and expect to deal only with The Decision-Maker (you) on your end. You must possess the confidence and intelligence to call your own shots. Please, no victims, no defenseless waifs, no suckers...we don't have time for it."
Photographer
Jeffrey Rich Creative
Posts: 100
Brighton, New York, US
By Intellectual Property law, the photographer owns the images, period. Your release outlines your use of the images and acknowledges the models understands this. The model will never own the rights to the images unless you are willing to sign over the rights. The problem here could have been avoided by having the discussion and release signing before the shoot. I had a discussion like this one time, the only time I waited until the end of the shoot to get the release signed, and I was a heartbeat away from formatting the memory card. Case closed when the model stepped in and agreed.
Photographer
Image-N-More LLC
Posts: 12
Hartford, Alabama, US
KARLOS MATTHEWS wrote:
Image-N-More LLC wrote:
Mary wrote:
quick question....are the girls in your portfolio the ones you manage? I'm just curious about what kind of models need managers....and why do they need managers? not all of them and i only manage models that just started off and didnt know how to go about things so kinda called manage but i really just advise them. when you new you dont know nothing just like when i started other photographers and and models advised me on what i need to do. so i kind of return the favor toward models who are truly genuine and trying to start off. now if you a stripper turned model and asking for money off the rip i wont help you. which means your not a manager...... the blind leading the blind. so how can you advise a model when you really don't know how?? so quick question for you? where in that statement would you that i'm blind and who said i didnt know how? maybe you didnt fully read what i said and understood it. when i started other photographers and models helped me. in turn i help other models.
Photographer
Frank Tammen
Posts: 203
Sacramento, California, US
Jeffrey Rich wrote:
By Intellectual Property law, the photographer owns the images, period. Your release outlines your use of the images and acknowledges the models understands this. The model will never own the rights to the images unless you are willing to sign over the rights. The problem here could have been avoided by having the discussion and release signing before the shoot. I had a discussion like this one time, the only time I waited until the end of the shoot to get the release signed, and I was a heartbeat away from formatting the memory card. Case closed when the model stepped in and agreed. Never got close to that, but love the angle! Tougher than a hickory nut!
Photographer
artist
Posts: 294
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, US
D'Magi Visual Concepts wrote:
Okay, I've had it. Stick a fork in me... I'm DONE.
I've had it with models who want to shoot TFCD, but they must bring there managers. No More!!!!! Why was the manager at the shoot? They *MANAGE* the paper work, the bookings, *not* the shoots. Once booked, the manager's job is *OVER*. A real manager wouldn't have time to be at the shoot. That's not their job.
This is an "escort" disguised as a "manager" and they have no business on the set.
As suggested, sign all releases, liability waivers, and such FIRST.
And, to prevent this sort of thing, book more than one model at a time, when one flakes like this, boot them, and you still have another to work with. I've almost stopped booking one model at a time. Even *good* models will have an emergency that day, or on the way to the shoot. If I have a stylist or MUA, I make sure they are also models, or willing to, so as a last resort, the day isn't wasted. I can't count the number of times in school when my "helper" became the model, to salvage both our necks. Some had to really bite the bullet, other felt like it was a great opportunity. But I learned -- MULTIPLE MODELS. You can never have too many. Once you get used to that, it makes life easy. (some girls were quick on the phone to get a girl friend to come over and save them School was a very different experience.)
This applies to creative TFP, commercial bookings, and almost any sort of situation.
I realize it's not always practical, and many photographers are starting out,and feel one model may be all they can handle, but it's all about hedging bets, maximizing time, and all that other happy horse shit. Even while one model is on set, the other can be getting ready, or even helping guide (especially if one model is one who has worked with you before, and the other is new). Sometimes they see things you don't. But, even if your style is not to want anyone to interfere, they can still be getting ready, and you have your camera working all the time, as they change out scenes.
Scott
aka Bodyartist
Photographer
artist
Posts: 294
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, US
Select Models wrote:
Well Mr. Bigler... by stating their names (John/Nikki Christian)... they are NO LONGER unnamed. Nikki has attended several of our events with 'her friend' John never being a problem. He's more of a 'distant escort' than any kind of annoying manager could ever be. And when it comes time to shell out the cash... it's NIKKI who collects the green. If she ends up giving any of it to John... well... that's between him and her. Sometimes, the models/managers grow up. But that doesn't fix the problems they've caused to people in the past.
It's a closed industry, and the smaller your area, (outside NY, CA, and a few others) the more good relations are important.
Something that worked for you, cost someone else a lot of time and money. That's not someone I'd want to take a risk on.
FWIW. IMHO.
Scott
aka Bodyartist
Photographer
SolraK Studios
Posts: 1213
Atlanta, Georgia, US
Image-N-More LLC wrote:
not all of them and i only manage models that just started off and didnt know how to go about things so kinda called manage but i really just advise them. Image-N-More LLC wrote:
i'm a photographer and a "manager" (advisor) but i know the difference between professionalism and just being a jerk. ......................................................................................... so when i "manage" a model. i only go if a photographer sounds suspect (GWC). but when i get there i usually do other work and i tell the model i "manage" (advise) to pay attention to the photographer cuz unless he is physically harming you i'm going to agree with the photographer and not be in his way. I'm only there to make sure contractual stuff is right since i'm in the business. hmm....
advisor AKA manager with out a licence
Photographer
Jeffrey Rich Creative
Posts: 100
Brighton, New York, US
Frank Tammen wrote:
Never got close to that, but love the angle! Tougher than a hickory nut! I actually "manage" several models, and my role is unpaid. I do it for models that I really like, think have potential, and may be taken advantage of. I don't go to shoots, but review the photo requests to put in my opinion of the photographer and share my knowledge of their reputation. I'll also share info on jobs with the models and recommend them for acting and modeling jobs. Only rarely do I even talk with the photographer.
Photographer
Nihilus
Posts: 10888
Nashville, Tennessee, US
Eric S. wrote:
Web-model pimps are maggots. 
Photographer
RonSmithPhotography
Posts: 61
Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, US
Cut through the bullshit,Elite Imaging said it all just as it should have been said,don`t listen to anything else......
Photographer
Olaf S
Posts: 1625
Allentown, Pennsylvania, US
I'm listed as a "manager" for 6 models on OMP. the only reason I'm listed as such, is because that's the only option. I am not really a "manager" at all. I get copied on emails...2 sets of eyes being better than one. If I see something "improper" I get involved, but it's rare. I only "manage" those models who ask me to, and I NEVER go to shoots with those models. I am also not sleeping with any of the models I manage(!)
But I do hear you...maybe it should be a "no jealous lovers" policy?
Model
CristinaLex
Posts: 1970
Silver Spring, Maryland, US
Well my models opinion says that you did the right thing...because your work is awesome and 50% of photographers that shoot as good as you do usually dont let the model have such privilages or even have all the pictures for that matter...it was good for her to have manager but then again i dont think her "manager" has that much experience to be knowing what is to be held as Equal rights for the phtotographs....unless they paid for them thats different...but when you do a tfp with an awesome photographer...then it is a privilage to the model that he is working with you because he doesn't neccessarily have to....soo kudos to u 
Model
CristinaLex
Posts: 1970
Silver Spring, Maryland, US
in rebuttal to what i wrote before...i do believe that every model should have some one who is EXPERIENCED in the business...whether a close friend...a lover....or a legit businessperson...to guide them through the process and give good advice as to what to ask for, what needs to be discussed and signed and so on and so forth....
Photographer
Ty Simone
Posts: 2885
Edison, New Jersey, US
Let's get the terminology straight, and maybe this can turn into an Intelligent discussion.
1. AGENT - An agent is someone that acts on behalf of another.
2. Talent Agent - Talent Agent works on behalf of a person that is a performing Artist (for our discussion here)
3. Manager - someone that manages the Business aspect of a performer (for our purposes)
4. Booking Agent - Someone that schedules appointments for a performer. (for our purposes)
5. Sluggo - Everyone else!
Now, IF you have anything to do with the first four in that list, You MUST be licensed and Bonded in the State of NJ, and in MOST states in the US.
I can tell you the laws and regulations here, and exactly how things work here. but they may be different in your area.
A Manager has absolutely NOTHING TO DO with finding work.
A Manager schedules appointments, coordinates transportation, buys clothes, answers the phones, and even reviews contracts (although he should refer that to legal people)
A Talent Agent Negotiates on behalf of the talent. (think Jerry McGuire!)
Show me the money!!!
A Booking Agent actually goes out and finds work for the Talent.
Now, Managers on the web think they are all of the above!
I am a person that "manages" 4 models on OMP.
In reality all I do is screen their emails for them, and do some basic research of the photographer on their behalf.
I do NOT collect any fees from them.
I will also look over contracts if they ask me to, and most are standard release forms, so i can simply say yep, it's fine.
BUT, make no mistake, If you are in the state of NJ and you do any of the 4 above (and charge a fee only as a manager) You must be licensed and Bonded.
Now, How agencies tend to work around here is also different than most people seem to think.
You never pay the model. You always pay the agency. The Agency pays the model her share.
The Agency must maintain exacting records with amounts received and amounts paid per model, which are subject to audit by the state.
The Agency can not do any of the following.
1. Withhold more thanthe amount agreed to at the time of employment.
2. "Take" from the model for work she finds / does on her own (however, if the model has signed an exclusive contract, and is in violation, they can sue the model for breach.) By Take I mean Withhold it from another job. So if model went out on her own and made $1000 and the agency wants it's $200 The Model either has to give it to them willingly, or they have to sue. They can not simply take it out of her next check.
3. Charge fees that are not in the Schedule submitted at the time of licensing.
4. Force the model to participate in any financial arrangement with any particular company as a condition of employment. (in other words, you can not say that in order to work for us, you must go shoot with them every month for free etc...)
Model
KatieK
Posts: 619
Lawrence, Kansas, US
I'm linked to a "manager" on OMP just because he is the only person I know who will give me honest feedback on photos, jobs, etc. He doesn't book my jobs, go to photoshoots or interfere in any way. However, if he has an off-the-wall idea for a shoot, I'm usually the first person he calls. And, if he hears of something cool or makes a contact, he lets me know and provides the contact information. Then he steps out and I take it from there. He's a great source of information and feedback. So I don't think that all "net" managers are bad. And I don't think you should not work with someone just because they're linked to a "manager" on a site.
Model
Stephanie 15not allowed
Posts: 42
Oshawa, Ontario, Canada
i think ur absolitly right.. be as a model agree that if ur doing all the work to produce these images then u have more rights to them.. even well us models should have them as well.. i agree with everyone else.. everything should have been dealt with at the starting.. but everything is a lesson right???
good luck in the future
Photographer
Worlds Of Water
Posts: 37732
Rancho Cucamonga, California, US
Wordman wrote:
Ebilical? Umbilical? Tomato? Tomotto? Yeah... whatever dude... you got the message... I'll take a tomotto...
|
