Photographer
SD Photo
Posts: 286
New York, New York, US
I posted a casting for a photoshoot in Los Angeles on Oct 31 here on MM and was contacted by several models. One model asked for a deposit to lock in the date and since she was in her 30's with years of experience and a large portfolio I sent her a deposit on Zelle per her request.
The day of the shoot she doesn't show up. She reads my messages but doesn't respond.
How would you handle this situation?
Photographer
Certain Exposures
Posts: 181
Washington, District of Columbia, US
SD Photo wrote:
I posted a casting for a photoshoot in Los Angeles on Oct 31 here on MM and was contacted by several models. One model asked for a deposit to lock in the date and since she was in her 30's with years of experience and a large portfolio I sent her a deposit on Zelle per her request.
The day of the shoot she doesn't show up. She reads my messages but doesn't respond.
How would you handle this situation? I would take it as a (hopefully) cheap lesson and move on.
In my experience a model's reputation is no guarantee of the experience you can expect and deposits are rarely honored. I recommend you judge all advance requests for money with a healthy dose of skepticism. There are many models that do not require deposits to meet. I appreciate them for it and prioritize working with them.
Finally, I prefer to video chat models in general before a photoshoot because you can never be too sure who you're really communicating with on the web these days.
Model
Model MoRina
Posts: 6749
MacMurdo - permanent station of the US, Sector claimed by New Zealand, Antarctica
SD Photo wrote:
I posted a casting for a photoshoot in Los Angeles on Oct 31 here on MM and was contacted by several models. One model asked for a deposit to lock in the date and since she was in her 30's with years of experience and a large portfolio I sent her a deposit on Zelle per her request.
The day of the shoot she doesn't show up. She reads my messages but doesn't respond.
How would you handle this situation? That stinks. Too late for this one, but I would only send deposits with paypal, using the goods and services option, and have an email saved with the agreement so if the model doesn't show you can reverse the transaction.
Photographer
Certain Exposures
Posts: 181
Washington, District of Columbia, US
Model MoRina wrote:
That stinks. Too late for this one, but I would only send deposits with paypal, using the goods and services option, and have an email saved with the agreement so if the model doesn't show you can reverse the transaction. Do you know any photographers that have had this work for them before for a no-show? Just curious.
Model
Model MoRina
Posts: 6749
MacMurdo - permanent station of the US, Sector claimed by New Zealand, Antarctica
Certain Exposures wrote:
Do you know any photographers that have had this work for them before for a no-show? Just curious. Yes I do.
Photographer
Certain Exposures
Posts: 181
Washington, District of Columbia, US
Model MoRina wrote:
Yes I do. That's good to know, thank you.
Model
Jen B
Posts: 4486
Phoenix, Arizona, US
SD Photo wrote:
I posted a casting for a photoshoot in Los Angeles on Oct 31 here on MM and was contacted by several models. One model asked for a deposit to lock in the date and since she was in her 30's with years of experience and a large portfolio I sent her a deposit on Zelle per her request.
The day of the shoot she doesn't show up. She reads my messages but doesn't respond.
How would you handle this situation? Oh that totally sucks.
How I would handle it is totally move on and chalk it up as a costly mistake and not give this person another iota of my mental space and readily share the details or information with anyone in real life who asks if you can recommend this model.
As a photographer, (photo Jen B,) I won't pay deposits and as a model I will not ask for them but, I'm not in request or juggling multiple shoots or travelling either so that is a huge difference.
Shooting with someone unknown by me or anyone else that I know personally or someone without a huge referral list does seem like someone I'd pay a deposit too.
Model
Jen B
Posts: 4486
Phoenix, Arizona, US
Model MoRina wrote:
That stinks. Too late for this one, but I would only send deposits with paypal, using the goods and services option, and have an email saved with the agreement so if the model doesn't show you can reverse the transaction. Ooh, this is good info to know!
Photographer
MN Photography
Posts: 1435
Chicago, Illinois, US
Jen B wrote:
Oh that totally sucks.
How I would handle it is totally move on and chalk it up as a costly mistake and not give this person another iota of my mental space and readily share the details or information with anyone in real life who asks if you can recommend this model.
As a photographer, (photo Jen B,) I won't pay deposits and as a model I will not ask for them but, I'm not in request or juggling multiple shoots or travelling either so that is a huge difference.
Shooting with someone unknown by me or anyone else that I know personally or someone without a huge referral list does seem like someone I'd pay a deposit too. I don't recommend paying a deposit at all. For my own shoots, I never have. It's rare that I've had a model ask and I take it as an immediate deal killer when they have.
I've been renting studio time by the hour to photographers for years, I've hosted hundreds of shoots. I'm sure models have stories of photographers canceling or no showing, but it's pretty rare that I've had rentals canceled because a photographer couldn't make it. Compared to shoots that get canceled because models cancel or no show and it's probably 30 or 40 to 1. And I'm sure I've never had a model show up at the studio and the photographer no shows.
It has happened several times that a photographer paid a deposit, and then doesn't get the deposit back when the model cancels or no shows. A lot of my renters are regulars and they will follow up on those stories. More often than not this happens with traveling models. They either stop answering messages or say something like they'll hold the deposit for the next time they are in town, which doesn't happen.
I can maybe see deposits in situations where the shoot location is a long distance from the model (and not an area that traveling models would visit) or if the photographer wants the model to fly out to them. If you want to pay a model for that, then don't be real surprised if they don't show. Take losing the deposit as a cost of doing business.
Photographer
All Yours Photography
Posts: 2741
Lawton, Oklahoma, US
Certain Exposures wrote:
Do you know any photographers that have had this work for them before for a no-show? Just curious. Not for this situation, but Paypal in general greatly favors the customer. Some vendors won't accept Paypal because they will make a refund on some very sketchy claims.
Photographer
Weldphoto
Posts: 859
Charleston, South Carolina, US
SD Photo wrote:
How would you handle this situation? This is a breach of contract, assuming you had some form of contract. I would take legal action or threaten it at least. Why would you let her get away with this? If this is a business deal run it as such and hold people accountable.
Photographer
Aisbarika
Posts: 221
Washington, District of Columbia, US
Expose the model for what she is. Make sure the community knows what she is. Turn the screws on her. Maybe she will refund the money. More than likely not. But you need some kind of Vengeance.
I pay at the end of the shoot.
Cash, or Paypal. I used to pay deposits, but the women who asked for deposits never showed up or were just downright sexist/racist, etc. , so I just sent chargebacks after them. I don't pay models to jump down my throat or renege on the agreements we came to. I am a firm believer in punishment when necessary, and in situations of business, like modeling, I find it necessary on both the model and photographer's part.
Nowadays, I don't pay Deposits. At all.
Photographer
JSouthworth
Posts: 2099
Kingston upon Hull, England, United Kingdom
Paying a deposit to someone is often a good way to ensure that they won't turn up for a shoot.
Photographer
Chris Macan
Posts: 13197
HAVERTOWN, Pennsylvania, US
JSouthworth wrote:
Paying a deposit to someone is often a good way to ensure that they won't turn up for a shoot. As is not paying a deposit....
Flaky people gonna flake.
find a better way to prequalify models. (and avoid drama and shady prone people)
Photographer
Flex Photography
Posts: 6487
Sudbury, Ontario, Canada
If the requested deposit is, for example, $200, take 2 $100 bills and cut them in half and send her 2 halves that don't match.
If she shows, either get her halves back, or give her your halves as part of the payment. She can tape the matching ones back together.
If she doesn't show, you are out $200 (which you would have been anyway) but she only has halves she cannot use!
Yes, she will have cost you money, but she doesn't have it either!
Photographer
Bob Helm Photography
Posts: 18974
Cherry Hill, New Jersey, US
Flex Photography wrote:
If the requested deposit is, for example, $200, take 2 $100 bills and cut them in half and send her 2 halves that don't match.
If she shows, either get her halves back, or give her your halves as part of the payment. She can tape the matching ones back together.
If she doesn't show, you are out $200 (which you would have been anyway) but she only has halves she cannot use!
Yes, she will have cost you money, but she doesn't have it either! Half of a bill is worthless so you both lose if she doesn't show. More than half is as good ad the whole bill at a bank
Photographer
Bob Helm Photography
Posts: 18974
Cherry Hill, New Jersey, US
Simple solution unless I know the model and have worked with her before I do not pay a deposit. Have only had one model stand firm on it and I could live with it. At the last minute she contacted me she had a time available on a day I told her I wasn't available. not sure what I would have done if I was
Photographer
samreevesphoto
Posts: 680
Santa Cruz, California, US
Honestly the models would save money by avoiding deposits and showing up to accept cash. Paypal takes a 3% comission on each transaction.
Photographer
Lallure Photographic
Posts: 2240
Taylors, South Carolina, US
I would NEVER have paid a deposit to a model. Period. the only recourse you have, is a lawsuit, and the model could be a total fraud, you cannot even find. Learn your lesson and never do that again. The scammers are everywhere. Especially in LA!
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