Nico Simon Princely wrote:
Actually it's horrible advice and a great way for a new model to never actually get to model for anyone that would be of any quality.

I have some safety tips on my page for models that are actually founded in logic and reason rather than fear mongering and paranoia.

Yes, I've been well corrected Nico. I should add that I thought some of the safety tips were good, but of course there are obviously parts that others take issue with. Serves me right for not reading more carefully. Appreciate your safety tips.

Nico Simon Princely wrote:

Actually it's horrible advice and a great way for a new model to never actually get to model for anyone that would be of any quality.

I have some safety tips on my page for models that are actually founded in logic and reason rather than fear mongering and paranoia.

I actually refer newer models to your page, Nico. Not only for your incredible work, but because you have some of the most sound advice I've seen.

M Day Photo and Retouch wrote:

Believe me I'm not embarrassed. I'm just not going to post opinions and the things I've dealt with as a photographer and then be attacked for expressing it from people behind a keyboard. They all could have been more "professional" if you could call it that and debate it however they chose to just attack. Ya I never usually get into the forums, this was on my mind today so I posted it figured it could have helped but as u can see only what 3 models posted and the rest were photogs just attacking. I thought this forum was a place to discuss things not post and be trampled by people who clearly think I'm a worthless pos. that's why I will never participate in the forums after today. It's not help it's a typical Internet forum where people want to be big and bad and tear people down for their entertainment so they can feel better about themselves.

Well you should be embarrassed.   First, most of the females here are adults and they can think for themselves.   Your 'advice' stinks of paternalism.   Second it just doesn't apply in many cases.   Agency models who do test shoots are usually forbade from signing releases nor do they bring escorts.    I've said this before but photographers are often their own worst enemy.   You are welcome to conduct your business as you choose but deciding your way is just how it should be done is wrong.    What's with the models complaining to you by the way.   Are you a agent of some sort?   Why are they discussing prior shoots with you?   I didn't see where anyone called you a POS.   They disagree.   Nobody is trying too big and bad and tear people down for their entertainment.   

There are members here who take this very seriously.   Posts like yours do real harm.

Tony Lawrence wrote:
I've said this before but photographers are often their own worst enemy.

+1

Greg Knoll wrote:

I actually refer newer models to your page, Nico. Not only for your incredible work, but because you have some of the most sound advice I've seen.

I did not know that Greg. Thanks for telling me that and the compliment. It's nice to know my page is helping someone.

MelissaAnn  wrote:


This is not good advice.  WTF to #3 & #5?!  LOL.

New models are better off finding a model mentor, or seeking advice from an experienced model rather than listening to a photographer that posts rambling crap like this directed at models in the newbie forum.

I love the train!

Naughty Ties wrote:
Exceptionally well put.

Thank you.  I only hope the OP cared to read it and considered the advice.

M Day Photo and Retouch wrote:
#2 - Be CAREFUL!!!!! Do a simple google search of the photog. A photog should work hard on gaining a good reputation. So check out the web and see if any previous models have complained. It's the internet so if there's only 1 thing out there about a photographer than whatever but if you search them and 10 pages of complaints come up and a failing BBB grade. Well common sense tells you it's prob not a good idea.

The BBB is not a very reliable source.  Ritz Carlton, Disney, and Wolfgang Puck all received failing grades from the BBB, while OFTEN scammers receive an A rating.  I've seen it for myself.  Don't believe me?  Will you believe ABC news?

Terror Group Gets 'A' Rating From Better Business Bureau?
http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/business- … d=12123843

Better Business Bureau Gives Itself an 'F' in Los Angeles
http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/business- … d=18706507

M Day Photo and Retouch wrote:
#3 - Protect yourself! Always sign a release! Make sure if you're doing a TF shoot that somewhere on the release it says you will be credited and that if any of these images are sold you get a percentage. Usually I give a model 20% but 15-20 is norm.....

Usually the amateurs that feel that this is the way of doing business say "percentage of profits" which never goes well.  Ironically you posted the message on Tax Day, the day where profit making multimillion dollar companies show the government how broke they really are because those profits went to paying all kinds of business expenses so they 'really' don't have any money and shouldn't pay any taxes.  The same methods could be used to show a model that there was no 'profit' in the photo so that she won't receive a dime.

A more appropriate term would be 'residuals', which I've never really seen in the modeling world but is common among the acting profession.  It's similar to what you've described above, but it's based on recurring usage and not 'profit'.

Omaroo wrote:
Thank you.  I only hope the OP cared to read it and considered the advice.

He may have read it but his insistance on playing the "picked on" person in this thread and his inability to see the error of his ways makes me dubious he'll pay it, or any advice given that people like yourself have taken the time to offer.