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Photographic espionage?
About 4 months ago, I was contacted by a model who said she was interested in working with me. She wanted to know what kind of shots I would do with her. We e-mailed back and forth a few times, and she kept asking for more details and specifics to help her envision the shots, then, suddenly, she just quit responding. This morning I found the very images I had described, using the same model, on another photographer's web site. That leads me to a few questions 1. Models, when you say "be specific" about the images, how specific do you mean? 2. Photographers, how specific are you willing to be when describing your ideas? 3. Would anyone blame me if I called this particular model a theiving witch? Nov 18 06 02:50 pm Link It hppens a lot.... I talk about concepts... as a photog I have a few in my head I'm torn by asking for help with lighting them and help with getting then transfered from ideas in my head to a 24 by 30 print....or into a gallery show.... We all use each other for insperation...but theivign a whole consept is lame..but some are soo simple that...well just how may diffrent ways can a girl pull her thong up her but with her thumbs..... Discuse concepts not every little detail.... and keep dreaming up new great ideas... refuse to ever work with the theiving witch. Nov 18 06 06:51 pm Link hmmm...there are also Photographers who go as escorts with models, stylists or MUA with the intent of seeing how the other photographers work etc. Lame people don't get too far! Nov 22 06 01:15 am Link XposurePhoto wrote: There's another reason not to allow escorts. Nov 22 06 01:20 am Link Yeah, when a model whips out a tape measure and starts sketching out your lighting setups and asking about your power output is where I draw the line. Nov 22 06 01:23 am Link XposurePhoto wrote: There are also people who work for a photographer for years as an assistant, so of course they are going to learn from how the photographers work.....I can also thumb through magazines and images on the internet and copy an image just as easily if I so choose; the combination of the concept and its execution make the image; neither one nor the other are sufficient; a photographer can still take credit for having the skill to execute another person's idea; how many large production do you think don't have an Art Director whose job it is to create/organise the concept for the photographer to execute. Nov 22 06 01:26 am Link I've posted step-by-step post processing techniques before as explainations on how the image was post-processed to reach the final effect; there are also whole books of how-to's explaining/diagraming the lighting/studio set-up for many famous/historical photos...... Nov 22 06 01:28 am Link hey tim, it does happen a lot.... I had it happen to me just once. I am very protective over my ideas. When a model asks what ideas I have for her, I tell them... "Sorry I don't discuss specific ideas until you are sitting in my studio." I will review with them what limits they are comfortible with and what to bring. If they press further, I simply tell them... "My work revolves around the muses I work with, and so when we sit down together before the shoot I generate my ideas for you." That usually works well. Nov 22 06 05:00 am Link Wow Tim, Sorry to hear... that sucks... I am very protective over my ideas too... oddly other people get to copy right my ideas and concepts for shoots.... I have learned to not speak much about what I am into or who i am..... kindof a drag too as i am pretty open, I built a set and props and had some one steal the whole art direction of it and claim it as their own ... that's a huge drag.... Imitation is supposed to be the best form of flattery , but it sure is a pain in the ass..... Intellectual property "is" property though!!! If you have those e-mails and care ( for future reference) there is something that can be done about it .... but it aint easy. Nov 22 06 05:08 am Link espionage! code-rings! trench coats! secret spy cameras! whoo hoo! where do we sign up?!? F Nov 22 06 05:14 am Link Ideas are just ideas. I don't worry about them because I'm the only one that can execute mine the way I want  Nov 22 06 05:24 am Link BlindMike wrote: Agreed.... but conceptualizing a shoot , set design and having someone blatantly rip it off and tag it as theirs is pretty rude.... i do agree it is best to be above it.... Nov 22 06 05:28 am Link I hate to hear this. Ive learned to talk in concept about a shoot without giving away too much detail. It may take me 6 months to get back after a first meeting with a model and by then I may have found someone else and shot, or given up on the idea for something differnt. But....I dont want to see that model get impatient and go do the shot with someone else. Nov 22 06 04:19 pm Link Your title fooled me. My very first photography class ever was at the Army Counterintelligence Center and School at Ft. Huachuca, AZ back in 1974. Nikon F and Minox. Unfortunately they didn't teach very well and I wasn't paying attention, because I didn't learn anything. That said, nothing to add to the thread except the model's and photographer's actions were unethical. -Don Nov 22 06 11:54 pm Link The gathering of intelligence calls for developing counter-intelligence. When a model asks for details of a shoot, give her the wrong ones. Nov 23 06 01:41 pm Link Just an update: I e-mailed the photographer and asked him where he got the idea for that set. He said it was all the model's idea, that he really liked it and was happy with the results, but he couldn't take any credit for the idea. I sent him all the e-mails between the model and me. Haven't gotten a response yet, but the photos are no longer on his web site. Nov 23 06 02:23 pm Link Jason McKendricks wrote: And the day she shows up to the studio dressed up like Barney the dinosaur or in caution tape and clown makeup he can say to her, "you didn't actually think I was serious, did you?" Nov 23 06 02:42 pm Link Jason McKendricks wrote: Good Point. Nov 23 06 02:56 pm Link Miguel A wrote: Well there comes a point when wanting do take a particular photo is going to hedge onto someone else's idea they executed at some point in time. The young lady in my avatar and I are discussing a second photo shoot together. She happens to be the lead singer of her band and she plays electric guitar. It turns out we were both considering photos of her nude behind her guitar. Nov 23 06 03:05 pm Link My dad was not an inventor by occupation but he did invent many things. He found that if you took a lamp cord with a plug on one end and wrapped the other ends around a nail, you could put thenails into a hot dog and plug it in and cook the hot dog in less than a minute. Future versions were mounted onto a plastic base with a switch. He took 'em to work and sold about 50-60 of them until Presto came out with the same thing. He also made a tripod with a pulley and cable which held a round grill. He used it over campfires and sold his "adjustable height grill" to many people at his campground. One day, he saw someone taking pictures of it and now it's commonly available. He never made big bucks off his ideas, but other people did. His advice to me was, if you get a good idea, keep it to yourself and hold onto it until you can grab it and run like hell. If you don't, and it really is a good idea, somebody will steal it and teach you what you should have done. Nov 23 06 03:07 pm Link ok hear is my thing i really do not have a "conseped" for shoots i have places i like to shoot but i have no idea what i am going to shoot till i meet the person face to face Nov 23 06 03:14 pm Link nathan combs wrote: Hell, sometimes I have no idea what I'm going to do until the model is already in the outfit in front of my camera. There's one photo in the bottom row of my port where I asked a model to sit at the edge of a bed and wrap herself in the bedsheet. I was sitting there for a moment trying to decide on what kind of shot I wanted when she turned her head to the right and I really liked how that looked so I told her to be still for a moment while I snapped the photo. Nov 23 06 03:24 pm Link Tim Hammond wrote: Lame. Nov 23 06 03:28 pm Link How about... Every model will now have to sign a release AND a Non-Disclosure Agreament (NDA) ? Tape the whole session. And if she ever appears in another photo and makes her eyes the same way you asked her to - SUE THE BITCH, the photographer and the company that made all the equipment! Nov 23 06 06:29 pm Link |
