About Faces wrote:

AMEN!!!

Silly stylists.

Learn how to read ALL of the posts.

Daniela V wrote:

Silly stylists.

Learn how to read ALL of the posts.

I know how to read all the posts.  I was agreeing with another poster!

About Faces wrote:
I know how to read all the posts.  I was agreeing with another poster!

Go back. Keep reading AFTER that post.

I'll wait.

edit: I lied. I'm going to bed. My online groceries were never delivered so I have no reason to stay up- g'nite all.

And yes, stylists deserved to be paid. the good ones at least. and yes, I pay mine. MMMk?

Daniela V wrote:

I think you misinterpreted my sentance. What happens if I add a comma?


Because I have yet to find a MUA as good as the one I use, for free.

I'll translate: I pay my MUA, and no one is as good as her and doesn't charge. Got it?

And she gets photos. Because that's the right thing to do.

And you're right. I'm getting what I pay for. She's an amazing MUA.

And the photographers I shoot with deserve every penny they charge.

It did read wrong.  Thanks for clearing that up. 

I do think there are some great photographers, makeup artists, stylists and models that do TFP just to build their portfolio.  There are exceptions to every rule.

Daniela V wrote:
I'd like to throw emphasis on the word: most.

The biggest piece of advice I can give you is to pay if you're comfortable paying. Don't, if you're not.

edit: if you choose to pay for a photographer (I'm not saying you should or shouldn't before I get crucified here...) make sure you have some TFP under your belt so you can practice. If the photographer is bringing his or her best to the table, you should do the same.

And always hire a MUA. ALWAYS.

I agree on this point, but even if you hire the most fabulous make up artist, if you are working with bad photographer we can not help you.
Good photographer is the most important ingridient of ones portfolio.

EmElle wrote:

If the information is sound, there's no point to knocking it or the giver.

Btw, how is a newbie model supposed to decide for herself if she's qualified to be a model?  There are plenty of deluded people out there.  I'm not saying the OP is deluded, but looking in the mirror isn't going to magically provide her with all the information necessary to judge herself - like what her market is, is she living in an area that matches her market, does she have the wherewithal to pursue this - even only as a hobby... that sort of thing.  Mirrors are not going to help her.  What she needs to do is to get educated, and talk to someone who is impartial and knows the business.  That person can discuss with her the realities of the type of model she can be in the location she lives in.

exactly, But I would start by looking in the mirror.

G_Makeup wrote:
As for hiring a make up artist and not a photographer I am an artist and I would say a great retoucher and hairstylist are more important then a make up artist,  and a good photographer is the most important aspect of the shoot, bad lighting will kill a shot.  Make up can be fixed in post as good retouchers can replace skin and change/add make up, and they can do it better than a make up artist can and often do even when a good make up job has been done.  Sorry I am saying this since, I do make up and love it but I also see what happens in the real world and realize hair is tougher to retouch and make up gets redone anyway.

G

That's very interesting coming from a MUA...

Hadyn Lassiter wrote:
exactly, But I would start by looking in the mirror.

And then what?  After she asks "Mirror mirror on the wall, whose the best model of them all?" and the mirror doesn't answer?  Maybe she already did that step, and that's why she's here.  Seems reasonable.  So then I don't get your post.

ChristianBehr wrote:
Most of the good photographers, make-up artists, and stylists won't trade at all.  If you want really strong images - be prepared to pay.  If you don't care as long as someone is clicking a camera at you... just wait, they'll find you.

I'd agree 50/50 with that, and I'll prob get ''trashed'' for my comments, but a lot of professional photographers, myself included, shoot vast quantities of prime editorial under our 'non MM persona's' and in an industry that is for ever looking for something different .. and working a year or more ahead with trends, sanity is often found in allocating a couple of days a month to either test away from the huge commercial pressure that is thrust on you, or to collaborate on a personal project.

Some seriously cutting edge campaigns have come from personal development by Ad's/Cd's and photographers.

Models get folio images, and on some occassions the images of them get seen by people in publishing that few get access too .. model agencies are for ever sending editorial execs and photographers the 'latest edge' model to consider, sometimes you can get 30+ a day, unrequested! A most you can't understand why they have been put in front of your eyes!

Sometimes you want to explore something different. I don't shoot portfolios so don't get paid for it, so if I work with a model away from client commission, it's tf .. I earn 100% of my income from editorial/advertising/corporate commission ... I also develop styles and the like on a personal basis with work in progress projects under my MM persona here etc...  there's no way I'm going to try something totally different on a shoot thats costing many many thousands of pounds (and I'm not talking just 2 or 3), per hour, with a client, Ad (Art director), Cd (Creative director not a disc..) and the rest who are blindly going around at the best of times in a creative mayhem trying to get the shoot in on time, in budget and ahead of the game. ...

So yes, tf exists, not all models do pay for their folio images, and not every photographer who shoots tf is a GWC! Not all tf work from even highly paid photographers is always stunning, that comes through finding out what won't work. Same goes for a models folio's.

Rhonda McLendon wrote:

That's very interesting coming from a MUA...

Its the reality, I am in the business and see what can and cannot be done and as much as I would like to think I am invaluable I realize what can be fixed and what cannot, and whats easy and whats more difficult and make up is easier than hair or styling which is just bad, and lighting is essential to all of it.  Yes Make up is important as is lighting and styling and hair and 6the models expression, and her look, its all important, but the reality is there is a hierarchy of importance that is generally true of most shots in terms of importanance, retouching is invaluable to any professional level shot more than make up in the end.

Hell, I am learning photoshop in general becuase one day I may be more valuable as a retoucher than an artist.

G

Taneia wrote:
OK so I guess I should question the reality of everyones opinion based on their professional opinions. So that being said what type of model based on my (still needed to be worked on) portfolio should I catergorize myself in? Or what features should I accentuate on to fit into that category more succesfully? I know there is obviously alot to learn but I do know this...I have learned that I need to fork out some dough to get what I need.....to get noticed at all....So please if I can get some feedback on the questions...I would highly appreciate everyones advice...afterall the point of view from involving industry professionals would benefit me more than my own intuition. Thank you

Should now be in critique....you might be better off posting this there.

However, I would lean towards commercial for you. You are too short for fashion. You have to drop some weight and tone up for swimwear...speaking of which....

This: https://www.modelmayhem.com/pic.php?pid=1581925 has to go. Immediately.

Try and do some location shoots. Studios are boring. Seamless is done all the time. Go outside. Find a stairwell. Sit in a tree.

Get a standard headshot. Very important.

-D

Daniela V wrote:

Silly stylists.

Learn how to read ALL of the posts.

We love DanielaV..but dont piss of someone with a sharpened eyelash pencil and PMS.

UnoMundo Photography wrote:

We love DanielaV..but dont piss of someone with a sharpened eyelash pencil and PMS.

Maybe you haven't seen the stripper heels I use for swimwear shots...the 6 inch heels? lol

Tim Baker wrote:
I shot a model last week who had only shot with GWCs.  All she would do was smile when she said she wanted edgy, sexy photographs. Took me an hour just to wipe that cute smile off her face and slowly get her into a sensual pose. It finally worked.  Also, she wanted implied - and the first thing she did was grab herself.  I worked with her for another 20 minutes on moves that would result in implied images but wouldn't look like she was into physically squeezing her boobs into unnatural lumps of flesh.  She didn't know about standing on her tip toes or why she should wear high heals. No one had told her; she had just been shot.  When I turned on the lights, she said "Gee, the last guy had twice as many lights as you do.  I said, and I bet your images were all flat and no dark shadow to them, huh? She said yes, but had never attributed the pose (she kept moving her face away from the side light) and the level of light with sensuality.

The list goes on.

Cheers, Tim

Maybe she just wasn't a very good model. Beautiful girls aren't always good models, as I'm sure you're aware!

Daniela V wrote:
Should now be in critique....you might be better off posting this there.

However, I would lean towards commercial for you. You are too short for fashion. You have to drop some weight and tone up for swimwear...speaking of which....

This: https://www.modelmayhem.com/pic.php?pid=1581925 has to go. Immediately.

Try and do some location shoots. Studios are boring. Seamless is done all the time. Go outside. Find a stairwell. Sit in a tree.

Get a standard headshot. Very important.

-D

If you would like to see the type of images the commercial market is looking for try here
http://gillaroos.com/talent_results.asp … it2=Search

I must credit TXPhotog for this link. I asked him a question and as opposed to giving me an answer he ran me all over the web until I had figured it out for myself.

Daniela V wrote:

Should now be in critique....you might be better off posting this there.

However, I would lean towards commercial for you. You are too short for fashion. You have to drop some weight and tone up for swimwear...speaking of which....

This: https://www.modelmayhem.com/pic.php?pid=1581925 has to go. Immediately.

Try and do some location shoots. Studios are boring. Seamless is done all the time. Go outside. Find a stairwell. Sit in a tree.

Get a standard headshot. Very important.

-D

Thank you....