|
Forums >
General Industry >
Marketability After You Take your Clothing Off?
Was looking for thoughts/knowledge/experience of models/actresses with any contract problems for any sort of work if they have had nude, or even implied nude, photos taken and published. Anyone know if this is a "problem" or contract deterent for a general actress.... Oct 31 06 09:39 am Link Quite a few very famous, very established models/actresses have posed nude/semi nude/ implied nude at one point and time in their careers and they are still going. Cindy Crawford and Angelina Jolie just to name a couple. Oct 31 06 10:32 am Link i've heard there was an unwritten rule in hollywood that you don't til you are established, and that the few who make it are the exception.. of course if you are all the way on the other side of the coutry from hollywood, in a nice senic place like, say, west virginia.. Oct 31 06 10:39 am Link Location is everything, as is true of most modeling and acting. In New York or LA, doing nudes (not nekkids, nudes) is generally accepted as long as they are not the cheesy sort. In smaller cities that is less true, especially for conservative commercial clients, although there are some exceptions. Oct 31 06 11:13 am Link I find it depends on what market you are going for? For me this is 90% of my work and I stay quite busy, if I was a fashion model then it might hurt your career? Oct 31 06 11:17 am Link I think there has been a lot of crazyness surrounding nudes and who should and shouldnt be doing them, and if they are good or bad or what. The human body is a lovely thing and can make a great piece of art. Maybe it is the midwestern in me, but it just isnt something I feel like *I* need to do to create something beautiful, artistic and glamorous. For example, I did a shoot last weekend where I was wearing lace panties, a garter, and stockings, with nothing else but a fur coat, and I got some very lovely photos. It was more implied nudity than anything, and I felt comfortable doing it. Some people can show the entire world their bodies and be proud of it, and I say more power to them, that is great. I just personally feel like my own nude body is something special that I share with one person. That's just me. So far from what I have seen, the girls and guys who do actually do nude photos can get more paid work, as there arent as many willing to do it. Oct 31 06 11:20 am Link No high fashion agency will sign you if you have Maxim type or nude shots online. Check out Elite and the rest of the agencies criteria. Playboy frowns upon internet exposure prior to contract as well. Now, when you MAKE it to superstardom, THEN you can do whatever you want when your contract is over. Generally, if you have nude, bikini and/or fetish work online you are overexposed prior to contract. =CY MAGIC= wrote: Oct 31 06 11:22 am Link Face Arts wrote: Where do you get this information from? Oct 31 06 11:42 am Link I want to be a model - do I need a web site? by Joe Edelman Author: The Business of Modeling ABSOLUTELY NOT! NO! Let's break this down very simply, Any legitimate modeling agency works hard to market you and does not make a dime until they actually get you work. Why would an agency want to invest their time and money to market you if you are marketing yourself via the web and cutting them out of the transaction? A model needs only 2 marketing tools - period. A top notch comp card and portfolio. If you have ever seen a comp card or looked at the ones displayed on my web site - you would have noticed that they don't even contain the models phone number or email address. You will also notice that there is extra white space at the bottom of the back of the card. This is so that agencies can place a sticker with their name and contact information on the bottom. Legitimate mainstream marketing jobs are NOT cast via the web. And there is ONE very simple reason - ACCOUNTABILITY. If a company is about to invest thousands and often times millions of dollars on a new advertising campaign - do you really believe that they would risk going to the web to find a model? Even if they had the time to waste sifting through thousands of people who claim to be models, how do they know the person is who they say they are? How do they know that the person still looks the same as their photos and hasn't changed hair color or gained weight? How do they know that the person is capable of providing the personality needed for the shot? How do they know the person will show up on time or even at all? Modeling agencies not only provide the service of finding the right person for the job - they provide accountability that with tremendous amounts of money and resources on the line - the model who is selected will not only show up on time, but be able to carry out the job. The flip side of all of this is that as a model - the main reason you want to work with agencies and not the Internet is ACCOUNTABILITY! If you have a web site or post your pictures at some model listing web site, not only are you inviting every pervert and idiot to contact you, but how do you know if the people who have contacted you are legitimate? How do you know the job that they are allegedly hiring you for is legitimate? How do you know that the address you have been given is not some serial killers base of operations? Who do you go to when and if you are not paid? A modeling agency provides you the assurance that the job you are being sent to is legitimate and that you will get paid for it. The agency also negotiates the parameters of the job so that you are not asked to do something you are not comfortable with. So the moral to the story is: Keep your photos off the web unless they are being posted by a legitimate licensed modeling agency or in the portfolio of the photographer who took the photos for your top notch portfolio. I recently began working with a young girl who asked me if a few glamour workshops that she had attended as a model could have a negative impact on her career. She told me she had only been to three of them. A quick search of Google turned up more than 15 websites by amateur photographers who had photographed her at these workshops as well as a marketing site for the workshop owner. All of the images by the amateurs were not very flattering and the workshop promotes nude glamour images (which this girl had not done) So the problem is number 1 - guilt by association and number 2 - lots of unflattering images. Any company with a name to protect is not going to want images like this circulating of a model that they are considering hiring to represent them and they WILL go to the web to look. SOURCE: http://www.joeedelman.com/model/modelin … site.shtml Oct 31 06 11:50 am Link TXPhotog wrote: What she is saying is true as far as my experience has been. Oct 31 06 12:04 pm Link Yes, even Playboy will question what you ahve online and who you shot with. If they find out later there is something else floating around you did not DISCLOSE, your contract will be questioned and your ACCOUNTABILITY will be null and void. Common sense, really. MelissaBaker wrote: Oct 31 06 12:09 pm Link Face Arts wrote: I asked for an authoritative source, not just someone else making the claim. Joe has a very poor understanding of the model industry, as some of the other articles on his site prove. Oct 31 06 12:10 pm Link Face Arts wrote: It's not common sense at all, it's simply understanding the demands of a particular client. Oct 31 06 12:11 pm Link Perhaps you should share your vast knowledge of the agencies you have worked for and THEIR criteria. Better yet, I encourage everyone to contact the agencies such as IMG, Elite, etc in NYC and email them directly regarding this issue. TXPhotog wrote: Oct 31 06 12:12 pm Link I can remember the name of ONE Miss America. Guess which one it was ? But seriously, my humble suggestion is if you think you're gonna be the next Meryl Streep, maybe stick to implied nudes with the best photographers you can find. Melissa is right to certain extent. But to play devil's advocate, there are a lot of agency models in NYC with nudes in their book. Granted they were shot by Bruce or Sante, and there's probably just 1 or 2. And those shots are just in her book, not on the web, so its almost impossible for those images to be circulating around the web. And as mentioned, its the nudie pics that start circulating around the internet that -may- affect the decisions of the casting directors and those who hire models at the huge comapnies like Target and Wal Mart. If you ladies want to shoot nude and think those images of you will be floating around the web and might affect your future career, make sure those images look like Herb Ritts shot them. Then at least the Folks at Paramount or Target, or William Morris, will say, "WOW" instead, of "Ewwwwww." Oct 31 06 12:13 pm Link Acting... I can't answer. However I have corporate clients who would not be pleased to find a model in their ads or at trade shows who has participated in anything more than tasteful nudity. Oct 31 06 12:15 pm Link I'd take the word of an A&F model over any online photographer anyday.  MelissaBaker wrote: Oct 31 06 12:15 pm Link Face Arts wrote: He's not just an online photographer. Oct 31 06 12:17 pm Link I think everyone should know about and remember "Marylin Chambers." She was the face/Girl on the Ivory Snow detergent box, who prior to the modeling/photo assignment had made a porn film, "Behind the Green Door." This was in the 70's and attitudes against women having sex with three men at once, in a porn film, was looked down upon. Today's attitudes haven't really changed because today's advertising, although more "in your face" sexy, it is still controlled by majority of Americans who are conserative. Anyway, Ivory Snow pulled the box. Her face was removed and I believe the agency who represented her was sued by the Ivory Snow people. Agencies have to know who they represent. Major companies/brands have a lot at stake. They cannot risk millons of dollars, on advertising campaign, only to have a models negative past surface and cause major PR reprecussions. They won't take the chance. This is why major companies/brands only deal with legimate modeling and talent agencies...period! Also to consider is the fact that companies use legitimate agencies because agencies can insure the the model will not appear in any other advertising from a competing brand/company/designer. What good is the "face" of Revlon if the "face" also appears on Judy's Homemade Natural Make-up! Ya see? If you look at MM and other sites like it, everyone is a model or photographer. But you have to ask, truthfully, how many of these people are acutually making money in the commercial arena? Honestly...very few, if any! In the real world (commercial modeling and photography) experience means "tear sheets" and or "tape" of actual jobs. It doesn't mean working with 100 GWC's. Now, it actually means getting paid by a company/brand/ad agency/etc. So to answer the question, if you want to do nudes then move to Europe where being nude is common place. You see it on TV and in Magazine Ads and editorials. Nudity in Europe (even Canada) is not that bid a deal. Only in America, where everything has to satisfy the "Religious Right," will you find nudity and those who deal in nudity (models and photographers) frowned upon. Oct 31 06 12:17 pm Link . Oct 31 06 12:19 pm Link Bingo! PAID is the key...everything else is fun and fine too, but careful who you shoot, WHERE YOU SHOOT (hidden cameras, hello) and what you post... X West Media wrote: EDITED for space. Oct 31 06 12:21 pm Link Oct 31 06 12:22 pm Link MelissaBaker wrote: Melissa, I don't mean to discount your experience, which I am sure is real. However, it is counter to mine, and I have had lots of conversations on these subjects with bookers at fashion agencies. Having shot nudes is not the problem. It's shooting cheesy (or worse) nudes. The part you leave out is what their response is if you answer "yes". It's not to immediately disqualify you, but to do more inquiry to find out the nature of what you have done. MelissaBaker wrote: You shifted subjects on us. MelissaBaker wrote: No, not a great example. Target is on my client list. So are a very large number of Fortune 500 companies. I've dealt with over 5,000 commercial castings in NYC, and not one time in all of those castings did the issue of whether or not a model had done nudes get mentioned. MelissaBaker wrote: I'm sorry, this is simply not true. They frequently have their models do nudes. Some of the major agencies require it shortly upon signing - not when "the time is right" in their careers. And fashion test photographers, not just "big photographers", routinely do nudes of fashion models with the active acceptance of the agencies. Oct 31 06 12:22 pm Link What agencies require this? What ones have you worked for? TXPhotog wrote: MelissaBaker wrote: Melissa, I don't mean to discount your experience, which I am sure is real. However, it is counter to mine, and I have had lots of conversations on these subjects with bookers at fashion agencies. Having shot nudes is not the problem. It's shooting cheesy (or worse) nudes. The part you leave out is what their response is if you answer "yes". It's not to immediately disqualify you, but to do more inquiry to find out the nature of what you have done. MelissaBaker wrote: You shifted subjects on us. MelissaBaker wrote: No, not a great example. Target is on my client list. So are a very large number of Fortune 500 companies. I've dealt with over 5,000 commercial castings in NYC, and not one time in all of those castings did the issue of whether or not a model had done nudes get mentioned. Oct 31 06 12:24 pm Link Face Arts wrote: In other words, you have no authoritative source for your claims, you just want to find out what agencies will tell unknown people with out-of-the-blue queries, to see if any of them happen to back your claim. Oct 31 06 12:24 pm Link Just asked a question. You don't name an agency you work for in your credits. You're the authority here on this tread, apparently. Curious as to what agencies you refer to - perhaps these online models could contact them instead of wasting their time on the agencies that don't use online models. TXPhotog wrote: Oct 31 06 12:26 pm Link Face Arts wrote: Now this is humorous since - Oct 31 06 12:26 pm Link Face Arts wrote: Several, but I'm not going to embarrass them by pointing the finger on an emotionally charged issue so some right-wing extremist can make a big deal about it. They don't need, nor deserve, that hassle. Oct 31 06 12:27 pm Link Eric S. wrote: I would listen to Eric which is basically what the makeup girl here said as well. Oct 31 06 12:27 pm Link Face Arts wrote: Huh? Oct 31 06 12:28 pm Link I'm a "right wing extremist" now? Where do you get that? That is amazingly triangulated from thin air! TXPhotog wrote: Oct 31 06 12:29 pm Link Bruce Talbot wrote: Bruce...glad to see you are still at it. This is Don Williams, from the ill fated "Model & Talent News" in Phoenix. Remember Me? Oct 31 06 12:30 pm Link SecondFocus wrote: Bingo! Oct 31 06 12:32 pm Link ( ANT ) Mgaphoto wrote: I wouldn't listen to me; I haven't posed nude, then tried to audition for a Hollywood blockbuster Oct 31 06 12:33 pm Link Face Arts wrote: That's not what I said. Are you under the illusion that you are the only person who reads these posts? Oct 31 06 12:33 pm Link TX Like I said, I was only answering from my experience with the agencys. Take or leave it - just sharing what has actually been shared in those meetings to try to help others from that experience. Gotta run, going to work again! Oct 31 06 12:35 pm Link Lol. this is fun. ::: reclines back to my office chair and clicks reload::: Oct 31 06 12:35 pm Link Dont do it until you are famous and more respected. It wont just affect you. It will be hell on wheels if pictures surface of the congressman's daughter nude...lol Oct 31 06 12:37 pm Link TXPhotog wrote: Oh, thank you for posting this; I do hope that it gets read and understood. Oct 31 06 12:39 pm Link Here's something funny, but will still prove there are no black and white answers on this perennially ambiguous topic. About 4 years ago, a good friend of mine, a model with a major NYC agency, had some really sexy racy topless stuff in her book. I mean it was full out, boobs in your face stuff. When I saw her book, I blushed. 5 weeks later, Sisley hired her for like 5 campaigns, and she made tons of money with them. It was probably over $150k. Because Sisley does a lot of that sexy erotic stuff, and Terry LOVES that look. BUT, I heard recently that a successful model on MM recently shot for Sisley, but she didn't have any nudes in her book, and I don't think she ever did anything past swimsuit. (I won't mention who it is here, but she can pipe in if she wants to)  So in the end, we are left with the same grey area; There are no clean cut answers. And by no means should anyone base an important decision like this on the advice from folks on the web, including me. Good luck everyone Oct 31 06 12:40 pm Link |
