Doug Lester wrote:

Depends. If it has been only 2 or 3 weeks since the shoot and something like that appeared, I would absolutely be pissed. But if it has been a month or more with no explanation from the photographer, then I have no problem with it at all. About three years ago I ended up in the hospital for close to three weeks. Obviously some CDs and prints were late, but the first day I was home and able to sit up straight, I emailed the ladies to let them know what was going on. All understood and none had a problem with the delay. All had their CDs and prints within 5 weeks of their shoot. No CD, no prints and more than a month without communication from the photographer, there is no excuse. There is no photographer's side of the story and I've no problem with your message.

In all honesty, if I saw it in your profile it would probably give me a chuckle.

you're right, if it's been 2-3 weeks I still have them listed in my "photographers I have worked with" after it's been too long with no explanation, I move them to the "hasn't fulfilled their end of the bargain" region.

Jessalyn_54 wrote:

that's very rude of the other models to be trashing you when they knew what happened. If this photographer had emailed me and said "hey, ___ is why I haven't gotten you a CD yet" I would be totally fine with that. it's understandable. but this one stopped replying to my emails and never offered an explanation.

Yeah... if they won't reply to you with an explanation that's not right.

I'm unsure how I feel about posting publicly on profiles about situations. Believe me, there's a name or two (or three) I'd like to list. But I don't.

Jessalyn_54 wrote:
thank you for the compliment on the tattoo and as long as you tell me it's gonna be 2.5 years then I'm fine with that! (lol....not really.)

It'll be that or longer before I can even think about going to Kansas anyway. Damn-it, Man.

Dredful Jaymz wrote:

It'll be that or longer before I can even think about going to Kansas anyway. Damn-it, Man.

lmao, I highly suggest not coming to Kansas. it sucks. unless you like wheat fields.

Looknsee Photography wrote:
Sorry, I disagree. 

Your profile paragraph is open to interpretation.  By putting that there, I get the impression that the CD is overdue, even though you didn't state that explicitly.  Why would you mention that you haven't yet received the CD if it wasn't yet overdue?

You may say you haven't received the CD.  How do we know that that is true?  What does the photographer say?  If he agrees that he hasn't sent it, well then I believe you.  What if he says that he did give you the CD?  What if he says that he mailed it two days after the sitting to the address you provided?  Perhaps you had a typo in the address you gave him, or perhaps he misread the address & sent it to the wrong place?  What if he told you that he was going to send it two weeks from now & he wonders why you are calling him out, giving others the impression that he's late?  What if he understands that he didn't promise you a CD -- instead he expected you to grab the images from his website? 

All I am saying is ...
   ...  it doesn't reflect well on you,
   ...  that part of your profile doesn't tell the whole story,
   ...  that the meaning of that part of your profile is ambiguous, and
   ...  it's not worth the grief.

I'm just saying that you are providing only one side of the story.  We haven't heard his side.  You expect us to take your word for it.  I'd like to believe you, but if I want to be fair-minded, I can't side with you if I haven't heard from the "accused".

Jessalyn_54 wrote:
lmao, I highly suggest not coming to Kansas. it sucks. unless you like wheat fields.

I'd say come out here, but I'm going to Oregon (hopefully soon). Not Damn-it.

Dredful Jaymz wrote:

I'd say come out here, but I'm going to Oregon (hopefully soon). Not Damn-it.

well I might be in Washington soon.....

Jessalyn_54 wrote:
On my profile I list photographers I have worked with, then I list photographers that I have worked with that have not provided me with my CD of images yet.

I didnt think it was a big deal. I had 2 purposes behind this:

1. so people knew that I had worked with others but I did not have their work displayed because I had not received it.

2. so models would know that it could take a while to receive their images from the photographer.

I got an email from one of the photographers I have listed, and he was not angry with me (so he says) but was surprised I would do such a thing. I worked with him in July and have not received my CD of images yet. We were supposed to work together a couple of times but he canceled everytime (once was 1 hour before our shoot). I emailed him a few times asking when he wanted to reschedule and he never replied to my emails. So I thought he had "dropped me" for whatever reason. I have spoken with another model he has worked with and she said it took this photographer 8 months to get her the CD she was owed.

My question is this: should I remove this from my profile? Is it considered rude? I didn't think so but someone seems offended by it...

EDIT: I also wanted to note that I did not give their MM numbers out. It would only mean something to models that want to work with those photographers and already know their names/MM #'s. Yea you could browse for these photographers but that would be out of the way. I don't make it easy to find them.

So you essentially called him out?  And he e-mailed you complaining about it.  Hmm, now, if he would actually SEND you a CD, you'd take him off that part of the list right?  Sounds like the ball is in his court and he has all the power to correct the issue.

I think you're in the right.  Sometimes I can get caught up with my own life and I encourage the girls to bug me.  Because if they don't, I might just forget that I owe them a CD.  But if they keep bugging me for it, then I know *I* need to get crackin.

Dredful Jaymz wrote:

There are pros and cons to every situation, and three sides to every story (in case you don't know "your's, their's and the truth).

Yup, there can be more than one side to an issue.  I suggest, at the end of the photo shoot, both parties agree (if not discussed beforehand) as when to expect the finished product (CD or prints).
The model may choose (after a reasonable time has passed, at her discression):
Worked with Joe Clicker (MM #1234)/ Prints/CD pending.
However, this puts the onerous on the model to update their profile about the photographer ASAP when said model recieves the final, agreed upon product within the agreed upon time.  Trust goes a long way in this business, and obligation is part of the routine.
I would recommend not making it too 'bitchy' because the other party may list you with some 'dings' of thier own (lateness, no make-up on, etc).
Simply remember: EVERYONE has a 'bad hair day' from time to time.  Communication is usualy the solution.

Looknsee Photography wrote:
Well, you didn't quote the first point I made -- what is the objective of your profile?  I'd say that it is to make a first impression for potential collaborators.  If you devote part of your profile to telling your side of an unsatisfactory experience, what impression are you making?

I think the purpose of her profile is to present herself as a person who acts in a professional manner and expects the same from those she works with.

She points out the some she has worked with appear not to behave this way.

You can choose to believe or disbelieve whatever someone writes in their portfolio.

90 days is simply way to long to wait for a Cd, especially if the photographer no longer answers emails. She does not recommend anyone not work with him, she just states the FACTS that she knows. You can choose to believe her or not.

I wouldn't have a problen booking work with her.

mikell wrote:
has long as you not getting your images in the time promised was there fault not yours no it wasn't rude
you worked for them as compensation and deserved to get them I think it was a good way to prod them

I mean it DID work. The photographer in the original post said "hey, i'll put it in the mail asap"

dgold wrote:
...not rude at all.
It's never rude to allow the truth to be told.

indeed
)

Jessalyn_54 wrote:

lmao, I highly suggest not coming to Kansas. it sucks. unless you like wheat fields.

In that case, I can recommend an excellant place to where you could relocate... {hint} {wink} LOL!!!

David Blewett wrote:
Very interesting thread, lots of great points made.

I see that you have already modified your profile page as someone suggested. Here's text taken from another models profile, which I think is perfect.

"-I strongly recommend the following photographers as I have had exceptional experiences working with them, multiple times:"

And she lists several photographers by name and mm# and a brief comment. The she says...

"-I have also worked with the following photographers on MM. Some have been great, some have been not so great, if you want referrals for any of them, I'll be dead honest."

And again, she lists names and mm# but no further comments.

I think that's a pretty effective way of handling the pros and cons of those she has worked with. I think the key is that whatever you do, present information in a professional and honest manner. I think you've done that...

David

hmm i like that as well....

Jessalyn_54 wrote:
I want to thank everyone who posted their informed and polite opinions. After weighing both sides, I have decided to put the following note (thanks to CEA, but modified):

"This is not my full body of work. I have more images that I just haven't receive as of yet. If you are a model looking to work with any of the photographers in my list, please message me and I will let you know if I have received my CD yet from them. I have nothing but good references for all of the photographers listed."

I would still like to hear other peoples opinions on this matter though

I actually think that is much better -- it's a little wordy, but it communicates a few key points:

   >>>  These are the photographers with whom you have worked,
   >>>  Some images are pending,
   >>>  You are happy to provide references for any photographer with whom
           worked.

I'd just suggest that you don't need to tell potential models to e-mail you to determine whether the photographer in question has been late in providing you your images -- wouldn't you just include that as part of your reference?  Wouldn't you be happy to communicate to the models about those photographers who were prompt in their CD delivery?

For example:  "I have more images that I just haven't received yet. If you are a model looking to work with any of the photographers in my list, please message me and I will be happy to provide you a reference."

Gary Melton wrote:
I don't think it's rude at all.  The photographer should deliver on his/her commitments.  I think it's a service to models to know when they don't.  No excuse for not delivering a CD within 30 days at the outside - should mostly be within 7-14, but certainly within the time span the photographer gives the model.

Just my 2 cents worth.

Ummm, by looking at the profile, how do we know...

   ...  how long the CD is overdue?
   ...  did the photographer in fact promise a CD?
   ...  is the profile up to date?
   ...  etc.?

Greg Knapp wrote:
I have the opposite problem. I have a CD full of images and the model is flaking to come pick them up, I'm about to ship them to the address I have on her licence photocopy.

Heh

LOL! I haven't heard of THAT problem!

Greg Knapp wrote:
I have the opposite problem. I have a CD full of images and the model is flaking to come pick them up, I'm about to ship them to the address I have on her licence photocopy.

Heh

Jessalyn_54 wrote:
LOL! I haven't heard of THAT problem!

I have a similar problem -- I promised to make one model some prints & a few dozen business cards.  She loves the images (she's seen scans), but they have been sitting on my desk for nearly two years.  She's moved, she's changed her phone, she's still on OMP & I hear from her once in a while, but she just doesn't have her life together enough to stop by & pick them up.

It happens.

dgold wrote:
It's never rude to allow the truth to be told.

I hope you don't really live by these words.

Crazy-Evil Angelus wrote:
"This is not my full body of work. I have more images that I just haven't receive as of yet."

Or a similar variation.

Oh!  Good!  Good!  (putting shorthand to use today)

Jessalyn_54 wrote:
I want to thank everyone who posted their informed and polite opinions. After weighing both sides, I have decided to put the following note (thanks to CEA, but modified):

"This is not my full body of work. I have more images that I just haven't receive as of yet. If you are a model looking to work with any of the photographers in my list, please message me and I will let you know if I have received my CD yet from them. I have nothing but good references for all of the photographers listed."

I would still like to hear other peoples opinions on this matter though

Having read through the thread, I have to say that I am glad that you have changed your wording some. However, my personal opinion is that it could still be better. I honestly don't see any reason to mention the time it took to recieve your CD's. That can be clarified if someone wants a refrence. I think you could shorten it up to "If you would like refrences on any of the photographers listed, I would be happy to provide honest accounts of our interactions." Its short, and to the point and entirely neutral. If they contact you, you can provide your comments, and let them know about the length of time it took to get the CD, plus any reason that the photographer might have had for taking so long.

The trouble with putting any sort of reference to the photographer about the seemingly belated prints or CD's is that it doesn't allow for any validation from the photographer - did his computer crash? was there a problem loading images? was his house flooded? did his mother die? etc, etc, etc... While the comment in and of itself is neutral, people (being people) are likely to interpret it in a negative light. And I don't think thats very fair to the photographers or to people that are interested in working with them. Taking a long time to recieve CD's is not the end of the world. Crap happens. I know that if for whatever reason I took a long time to get a product to someone, I would be grateful if they were kind enough to have the patience with me and the time frame that it took me to get it turned around.