Reverend D-Ray wrote:
Just one question though. Do you have potential wedding clients give you a deposit?

absolutely, and it's non refundable.

Richard Tallent wrote:

Unfortunately, about 60% in July and 75% in August.

TFCD in September, 3 out of 8 so far last-minute cancelled or flaked. All three had good reasons but have not communicated since to reschedule, so I'm calling BS and will require a deposit in the future from them if we reschedule for November.

Good grief! well, I owe you an apology on that score. I've only had a few flakes in my time.. that kind of record would make anyone cautious.

Looknsee Photography wrote:

Looknsee Photography wrote:
Man!  I just hate these photographer-model conflicts that are managed so poorly.  Some thoughts:

Deposits:  So, for a TFP/TFCD sitting, the photographer asks for a deposit to insure that the model doesn't flake & that she shows up on time.  So, I guess that means that when she shows up, she gets her deposit back.  Okay.  Since it is a TFP/TFCD agreement, is it then okay for the model to walk away from the sitting with a deposit from the photographer -- that deposit will be returned to the photographer when he delivers the agreed-upon number of images in the agreed-upon format?  Or more to the point:  for you photographers who ask for an anti-flake insurance policy:  how would you feel about giving the model a deposit that she'll hold until you deliver the images you promise her?

I spent $10,000 on photography equipment...  So what?  That's stuff you own and that you will continue to own after your sitting with the model.  If you are a professional photographer, you get to deduct the costs & can depreciate the equipment.  Meanwhile, the model, who is probably very young & hasn't accumulated much wealth yet, is not earning anything from her time with you (other than some images that may or may not be any good and that may or may not be delivered).  She has to find the time (away from a paying job or other obligations) to visit you.  She has wardrobe, make-up, transportation costs.  Further, you get to retain the copyright to the images you make with the model -- she can't make a dime off of those images, while you can.  So, I say, "so what?"  You both have expenses; yours might be higher than hers, but it is likely that you have more earning power than she does. 

Flakes Happen:  I believe that flakes happen, and that some individuals are just likely to flake.  But I wonder whether the photographer has done all he can to insure that the model is motivated to get there.  Some ideas:
   >>>  Is the model enthused & excited about the sitting?
   >>>  Has the photographer checked the model's references?
   >>>  Is the model happy about the compensation?
   >>>  Has the agreement been clearly articulated & documented?
In short, what (besides demanding a deposit) are you doing to improve your chances that the model will show up?

My bottom line:  do what you want, but in my book, any photographer who asks for a deposit is initiating a non-productive working relationship.  The deposit is an early impression, and it says "I don't trust you, and I am more important than you."  Good luck with that.

I rarely (almost never) do TFP/TFCD -- I think it is a raw deal for the model and is counterproductive to my objectives for the sitting.  I do mostly nude photography, and I'm happy to pay the model.  That way, I feel that I am in charge and that we are working on concepts that I want to work on.  Often, models enjoy the results & have often used the images we make together for their portfolio.  But since a) I'm trying to create new art (as opposed to boilerplate portraits), and b) I retain the copyright, I'd rather pay the model.  I typically earn enough money from the images to compensate me for her modeling fees. 

It is my objective from every sitting that the model leaves feeling appreciated & respected.  By paying her, she is better incented to show up, she feels appreciated, and she is less likely to flake.  If I were to ask her to pose for free and to give me a deposit to ensure that she shows up, she certainly won't feel respected or trusted (see the model's comments in the original post).

FWIW:  I have never experienced a flake.

I just don't have the time to do TFP or to be "hired" by models -- there's just so many hours in the day, and my creativity consumes enough already.

Here's the problem with your point of view here. You are only looking at it from one angle. If you are working on a personal or a project, then yes I can see you paying. But like photographers, models too are looking to add to thier portfolio. Tfcd or tfp isn't a raw deal when both aren't in the position to crank out some notes here, which is why this site and other areas have networking. This helps those to get from point A to point B. It's not a raw deal nor is it a complicated thing to comprehend.