Photographer
BTHPhoto
Posts: 6985
Fairbanks, Alaska, US
Just received the following in an e-mail:
"I am an experienced commercial model. I will be in Alaska for a pleasure trip next month and thought I might be able to help you out. I reviewed your website and your MM portfolio. It shows some potential, but you really need to include some fashion and commercial work if you want to break into the industry. If you would like to improve your book let me know and I will send you my rates."
Why do mainstream models and photographers talk about "the industry" as if it's the only legitimate venue for photography? Does my portfolio really give the impression that I'm trying to "break into the industry?" Why the hell would you think I need some fashion and commercial work in my portfolio?
I'm sick of hearing about the f-ing industry. I'm a portrait and art photographer, and I'm happy with that.
Just once, I'd like to see a post by a commercial photographer or model that says "I know what I do is just one piece of the world of photography ..."
Model
Just AJ
Posts: 3478
Round Rock, Texas, US
It seems to me that she's an opportunist. You are probably one among many that she emailed offering to "help out." One of those fish she baited will bite and she's got a little money. What's wrong with her marketing herself? Mind you, I dislike the "method" but its all self advertising.
Photographer
Boho Hobo
Posts: 25351
Santa Barbara, California, US
Tim Hammond wrote:
Just received the following in an e-mail:
"I am an experienced commercial model. I will be in Alaska for a pleasure trip next month and thought I might be able to help you out. I reviewed your website and your MM portfolio. It shows some potential, but you really need to include some fashion and commercial work if you want to break into the industry. If you would like to improve your book let me know and I will send you my rates."
Why do mainstream models and photographers talk about "the industry" as if it's the only legitimate venue for photography? Does my portfolio really give the impression that I'm trying to "break into the industry?" Why the hell would you think I need some fashion and commercial work in my portfolio?
I'm sick of hearing about the f-ing industry. I'm a portrait and art photographer, and I'm happy with that.
Just once, I'd like to see a post by a commercial photographer or model that says "I know what I do is just one piece of the world of photography ..." I understand what you're saying.
I feel like Switzerland.
On one hand I have the utmost respect for talented commercial photographers who bring a creative eye and passion to working as a photographer for pay. I couldn't and wouldn't want to do what they do day in and day out.
And, on the other hand, I detest folks who use their cameras as shills to pick up babes or as an their excuse to spend expendable income rather than learn a craft.
And in between are folks like myself. I really like MM but there's a part of me that feels that it is a space for those in the "industry" and those who want to be in the "industry" and those that want to play like they're in the "industry."
If you go to the Stylist forum, it's pretty much no-mans land for those who don't produce commercial images. And amongst a few there seems to be a sneering contempt for non-commercial artists that don't have $800 in their pocket for a full day rate. The word "art" gets the rolling of eyes in the photographer's forum and at this point I feel very lucky to live back in Northern California where there is a multitude of models interested in producing images that are "artistic and conceptual" in nature--cause the models forum seems very much focused on getting into agencies/industry.
I wish there was, online, a place for photographers who though not working commercially, take their craft, and their expression seriously, and it was respected.
Photographer
Ransomaniac
Posts: 12588
Las Vegas, Nevada, US
KM von Seidl wrote:
I wish there was, online, a place for photographers who though not working commercially, take their craft, and their expression seriously, and it was respected. Deviantart.com
But let's be real, there are all those sects and subsects that you named, and then there is also the ever present "I'm an artist, I'm better than everybody because I "create art" you just take pictures!" crowd that makes it REALLLLLLL easy to thumb your nose at the artist community. Especially those who seem to think that art fits in some little box of do's and don'ts.
Photographer
Zunaphoto
Posts: 429
Hamilton, Ontario, Canada
Commercial photographers have always sought approval and acceptance by their peers. They are joiners, of associations and groups. They establish professional credentials and standards amongst themselves. Nothing wrong with that. It suits the fact that they are in business, or, the "industry." Artists are not so prone to grouping together. seems to go against the nature of creating art as a solitary pursuit. And in photography, it has always been a separate stream.
Photographer
Leonard Gee Photography
Posts: 18096
Sacramento, California, US
Tim Hammond wrote:
Just received the following in an e-mail:
"I am an experienced commercial model. I will be in Alaska for a pleasure trip next month and thought I might be able to help you out. I reviewed your website and your MM portfolio. It shows some potential, but you really need to include some fashion and commercial work if you want to break into the industry. If you would like to improve your book let me know and I will send you my rates." Reply:
Thank-you for your kind offer. However, if you're such a hot-shot model, you'd be making millions on contracts. Whereas, if you're a crap for brains, know nothing model you'd be trolling for stupid photographers to try to make money off them instead of working for an agency and "industry" clients that pay real money.
Don't call me, we'll call you,
photographer
Photographer
studio36uk
Posts: 22898
Tavai, Sigave, Wallis and Futuna
Well, I'm primarily a photojournalist by training and inclination... my ideal shot would be of a model getting mauled and eaten by a bear. Wonder if she would be up for that? Now, THAT would be helpful to MY portfolio. LOL
Studio36
Photographer
Done and Gone
Posts: 7650
Chiredzi, Masvingo, Zimbabwe
We have "the Industry" because of "the Market". I am sure one of the things you love about Alaska is that all of that sort of buzz and activity is virtually non-existant. But, you are on the internet and you cannot blame a girl for trying. She might have been just what you were looking for and how is she to know without giving you the opportunity? When I get these I politely tell them the truth. If they respond rudely, it simply shows a total lack of professionalism on their part. It is just all part of the fun of being here on the Mayhem!!
Model
Catriona
Posts: 3674
Portland, Oregon, US
It annoys me as well. I constantly see in the model forum that any time any model posts along the lines that they are looking for work, not getting as much work as they would like, etc., even if they do not state that they're looking to get paid or "make it big," even if they show no interest in fashion or commercial or have entirely the wrong look for those, they're still beseiged by photographers telling them that, well, if they want more work, they need to have a "better" portfolio, and they can provide that for $$$. After all, you need to "invest" in your "career"! Who cares if you never said anything about wanting a career?
I've also been lectured for doing too many art nudes, as they will, I was told, ruin my chance at a career in commercial. What if I get more pleasure from seeing a beautiful nude image of myself in a gallery than I would from being in ads, even if the ads would pay more and be more "glamourous"? Why is that incomprehensible?
Photographer
S
Posts: 21678
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, US
KM von Seidl wrote:
I wish there was, online, a place for photographers who though not working commercially, take their craft, and their expression seriously, and it was respected. Have you ever been to Community Zoe? I have found it to be pretty great that way.
Photographer
S
Posts: 21678
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, US
Catriona wrote:
I've also been lectured for doing too many art nudes, as they will, I was told, ruin my chance at a career in commercial. What if I get more pleasure from seeing a beautiful nude image of myself in a gallery than I would from being in ads, even if the ads would pay more and be more "glamourous"? Why is that incomprehensible? I will happily help ruin your career by shooting figure work with you when I'm in Oregon this fall. What can I say? I'm a giver.
Model
Catriona
Posts: 3674
Portland, Oregon, US
Sita Mae Edwards wrote:
I will happily help ruin your career by shooting figure work with you when I'm in Oregon this fall. What can I say? I'm a giver. And I'll happily accept your generosity, you career-wrecker, you! Just let me know when you'll be in town...
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