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no show models
I'm sitting here 11/2 hours after a MM model who had asked me to tfcd with her never showed, never called! Does this happen too often. It seems to be happening all too often, and has me at the point now that I nolonger want to waist my time doing tfcd's. Jun 15 06 06:00 pm Link I can tell you from personal experience that this is an unfortunate part of ALL photographer's experiences. Many models just are not that seriouis about this and have no problem blowing off a shoot for various reasons. I can also tell you that there are many photographers that cancel or blow off a shoot or, worse, present a model with sub-par images for their time and trouble. As your experience and talent levels increase, you will tend to attract a better and more professional following and your portfolio will speak for itself and allow you to shoot more. In the beginning, you need to be extremely self-critical over what you display in your port and realize that your portfolio is your best marketing tool. Display nice images that flatter your models and more models will want to work with you. If you display crappy images, most models will be less than eager to shoot with you, especially on a TFP/CD basis... Jun 15 06 06:07 pm Link Has happen to me several times. This is why for all of my shoots, especially early morning ones, I REQUIRE the "model" to call me an hour or less before the shoot to confirm. If I don't get the call I go about my business in doing something else. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. Good luck. Cordell Jun 15 06 06:14 pm Link I guess it's just part of it. I guess I will only do tfcd with people I really want to work with, not just for the fun of shooting. I hate that I said yes to someone askig me and then they don't even show, it would be something if I had asked them. Jun 15 06 07:21 pm Link I know we've covered this time and time again but this seems to be a serious problem with members of this web site. I still think we should have a page on this site where we can list all the model "no shows". If I spot a model that's listed more than a couple of times from different photogs, I know not to waste my time. That way, one way or another, we can start to seperate the more professional models as well as the photographers. Just a thought. Jun 15 06 07:30 pm Link emphotography wrote: The 'quality' of your work often has very little to do with models coming through Jun 15 06 07:32 pm Link Thanks! and I think a page on here somewhere to report no-show's is a great idea. I would definately check it. Jun 15 06 07:35 pm Link We all feel your pain. Jun 15 06 07:36 pm Link emphotography wrote: Do you normally measure time in half hours? Most people would call that 5 and a half hours. Jun 15 06 07:53 pm Link Yes where I'm from people say an hour and a half. Jun 15 06 08:59 pm Link Unfortunately it is not just models on this site, but also on OMP. I have had more models no show than actually show in the short time I have been shooting. It might be more of the area where I live, but it gets very frustrating. What I do now is schedule something else at the same time that I can drop if the model shows up. I have another shoot scheduled tomorrow morning...here's keeping my fingers crossed! Just keep plugging away, I am sure it will get better with time. Jun 15 06 09:07 pm Link Just look at as playing a lottery ticket. You buy your ticket(s) and you may have a winner or not. You take your chances. This past week two models agreed to shooting dates, and when I contacted them to confirm they did not respond. What bugs me , they do not have the courtesy to say hey I'm going to cancel. Lie, say something came up, your car broke down some lame ass excuse, can't make it relatives from other country are visiting. Well I guess that is why the no show models put in their bio, I dream of becoming a model. Cause it is just that, a dream. Jun 15 06 09:07 pm Link In the last 6 months, I've had 5 out of 6 flake, drop off the face of the earth, etc on me. Bothered me at first, then I remembered that special word. "Next". Yeah, it cost me a little cash and time I couldn't afford, but after reading some of the horror stories here figure it could be much worse. In the mean time, I'll keep improving my skills, my gear and my ideas, and sooner or later, will start getting my visions out there. Jun 16 06 12:43 am Link What happens when the model goes the extra mile...even finds a stylist/mua to work with both the photographer and model....and the model also agrees to pay a kit fee to the mua. Then, the photographer ends up calling half way through the day when he knows the model has to drive 1 1/2 hours to get there....the stylist already cancelled because it was getting to late in the day and she had another shoot. So would that be held against me like I was the one who didn't show up? Don't act like it doesn't happen to models too! Sometimes, like in my case, I think it was just lack of good communication and planning. Your case might be different. But it's not fair to think all models who work TFP are flakes...sometimes things really do happen or come up! Jun 16 06 12:51 am Link Cristina P wrote: Good communications seems to be the key here, that along with polite and professional courtesy and consideration. Anyone, model, MUP, stylist, photographer, etc who is willing to go that extra mile is golden in my opinion. I'd love to work with folks like that. Jun 16 06 12:59 am Link Well, its like this.. for every 50 models you express interest in working with... 20 may reply. Take the 20 left and send more shoot details and get time available, and maybe 8 will respond. Overtime, the eight will dwindle to four solid contacts. Two will back out, not call you or just vanish. The remaining two are keepers!!! Jun 16 06 01:30 am Link A good way to avoid this sort of thing is to check references... and maybe call a day or two before...  I know we've covered this time and time again but this seems to be a serious problem with members of this web site. It's not just "this site"-- it's ALL SITES. Internet models are flaky. Yes, they are. It's up to you to check references and make sure the people you're scheduling things with are up to par, commitment-wise. Jun 16 06 02:42 am Link emphotography wrote: Double book TFPs. /tim Jun 16 06 03:41 am Link There are 1) shows; 2) no shows; and 3) who knows. I had a model contact me via email. I gave her my number and ask her to call. She continued with emails; no phone call. I again ask her to call or to at least give me her number so I could call. No call, more emails. Finally scheduled a date (21 emails later). Date was confirmed; MUA was confirmed for that date. Next email was to cancel the shoot because she was shooting with another photographer. She ask for another date. I contacted the MUA, arranged the other date. Emailed her back; no answer for a week. She confirmed the new date but said 'it would have to be short because she was moving both of the days I gave her that I could shoot." I emailed her back to say "shooting while trying to move is not the best way to get good images." I suggested another day after she's moved. Not heard back from her (she does check her website on MM almost daily). I've cancelled the MUA and wasted 33 emails back and forth to her/from her trying to set a date to shoot. Such is life. Either they show, they don't show, or they're a Who Knows show. /tim PS While I understand this probably happens to models, too, I'd venture to guess that it happens to us considerably more than it does to models. To date, I've only had to cancel at the very last minute once in all the years I've been shooting, and that was recently. PSS Two months ago I had a model not show up - only to read her Myspace blog a couple weeks later saying how she had been to a rave and got drunk on her butt and slept the next day (the day of our shoot). At least she had a good time. I did not rebook with her. Jun 16 06 03:51 am Link I didn't mean it to sound like all models do this. I have met a couple of great one's who show up and are fun to work with, and we all get good images for our book. But to not show, not call, even after she has confirmed, and even though she was the person to ask me to work with me. I had to cancell a shoot recently, and felt terrible, but I cancelled it a few days a head of time, becasue the MUA dissapeared, yes they do it too. But I told the model early enough so she could still do something that day and not waist it. I guess it kills me most, as I am a full time mother aswell, so to shoot tfcd is costing me, and I have to plan it so far in advance. But when I do, I plan everything, and have a verity of idea's, so hate that I don't get to then try then out, as I can't just do it the next day with someone else, it's weeks again before I can do another. Oh well, it's good to be able to talk here about this stuff. Jun 16 06 08:10 am Link It has happened to me twice no big deal, I checked the model's profile months later and they had nothing new so I guess no one else worked with them. Word does get around when they don't show  Jun 16 06 08:18 am Link I do not blow off any commitment, but that is just me. Jun 16 06 08:20 am Link Tim Baker wrote: Just because *you* don't noshow or cancel doesn't mean that other photographers don't. The last two shoots I had set up the photographers cancelled. One was due to lack of funding, which I can easily forgive, and the other one was due to freaking out over some bad experiences. The last shoot that I had, the photographer was 30 minutes late showing up to the location! Photographers can be JUST AS FLAKEY as models. There is no exclusivity to the types of people that will flake. A flake is a flake whether they are holding a camera or standing on the other side. Jun 16 06 08:25 am Link Ok, I've been at this a while, and I'm sure, I'm tempting fate by saying this but never had a no show. Noone has ever completely blown me off. Sure poeple have canceld a couple days before, but stuff comes up. I've been there my self. You just reschedule, and move on. Simple folks. Jun 16 06 08:28 am Link I'm new at this but have 11 last minute cancellations this year... 5 with the same model! I'll leave it at that for now... Jun 16 06 08:30 am Link It's happened to me a couple of times. What I do to minimize it is send them a note asking for specific information such as their name, city, zip (to give them directions), phone number, email, best way to contact them, and their stats. I send a reminder out a day or two ahead, and tell them if I don't hear from them on the day of the shoot - confirming that they will be here on time - the shoot will be cancelled (this might sound harsh, but I don't like to waste my time waiting for someone to show up). I give them my phone number and email address so there are no excuses -- I also tell them that if it gets close to the time of the shoot and they think they may be a little late, CALL ME. Jun 16 06 08:32 am Link To NC17, I didn't say it's just models, I imagine it's everyone. But that's who i was dealing with in this past no show no call, even though she had confirmed case. Jun 16 06 08:34 am Link it's happened to me a lot over the last 30 years. Not just models, both TFP and paid, but also clients who were paying me. I solved the problem re paying clients: before I agree to pick up a camera, I have a deposit of cash money in hand. It's happened exactly once in the 20 years since I started doing that, a male senior portrait, and his mom was FURIOUS with him. Haven't figured out yet how to apply that to the models situation, but you can bet when I do, I'll let everyone know what the solution is. Jun 16 06 08:37 am Link Taurus Artworks wrote: Five with the same model? Good grief... there comes a point where its not worth trying... Jun 16 06 08:38 am Link Just remember all the models who do turn up on time and do the job without any problems. Jun 16 06 08:39 am Link emphotography wrote: No, you didn't. I was responding to the other photographer that was talking about how little he had cancelled. Jun 16 06 08:39 am Link Kendall Carr #411 is a genius... here's why. He writes: I will require a deposit of $50.00 for all bookings whether itâs paid or TFCD/TFP. Iâm terribly sorry to have to implement this rule and inconvenience those of you who are professionals and keep your appointments but unfortunately Iâve had too many no shows and last minute cancellations! which not only wastes my time but causes me to lose money! Iâve talked to several other photographers and Iâve found out that itâs not the professional models who are more likely to succeed in this industry who will have a problem with that rule but rather the ones who know they are likely or no show or last minute cancel that will complain! Which are you? When you show up the $50 is credited towards the cost of the shoot and if itâs TFP/TFCD it will be refunded immediately in cash! Any cancellations within 72 hours of shoot time will result in a loss of deposit. AND the rest of his requirements are genius too! Jun 16 06 08:49 am Link emphotography wrote: I am sorry to say no shows should not be part of shooting TFP,or any part of setting up shoots it just shows that those people are rude, crude and have no manors or show no class at all. Jun 16 06 08:57 am Link No shows -- whether they be model or photographer -- are just unprofessional and display a complete lack of respect for time. I also had a model get hammered the night before a shoot and sleep through the entire next day... no call, eventhough she did check her messages. The no show displays a lack of serious on the model's part.... the no show just shows a lack of respect for my time. But then you have a model that blows you away.... you get great images and all is right with the world again. Jun 16 06 09:09 am Link I am glad we only start 3 or 4 threads on this per day. Otherewise we'd be spending all of our free time disucssing models who don't show and listening to models remind us that photographers can be unreliable as well. I am not sure it is necessary to have the same discussion repeatedly. It certainly doesn't add to our professionalism. Jun 16 06 09:19 am Link I've said it many times already: a full one half of my shoots flake. And I don't do TFP--I pay for every shoot. And yet still they flake. Even the ones who have done bondage before flake on me. Jun 16 06 09:33 am Link Some thoughts: Read the past threads on this very same topic. The "no-show" list, posted either on a separate page or on your own profile, is a bad, bad idea. By posting such an item anywhere, you force us to take your word for it without hearing the model's side of the story -- how do we know it's the model's fault? It is a vindictive & (in my opinion) unprofessional act. Don't do it; it reflects badly on you. Did you check references for this model? I don't understand why people don't check references more often. While I'm sure that much of any alleged flakiness can be blamed on the model, do take a little time to ensure that the model is sufficiently incented & enthused about the sitting. A little energy to get her excited about the session might improve your odds. Jun 16 06 09:41 am Link I've seen posts like this many times, but I'm responding to this one as it just also recently happened to me, only she was going to hire me to update her port instead of TFCD. Luckily, I've been burned before, so I have a fail/safe method - I always meet with the model at a location before the shoot to go over ideas and such. This helps to filter out the serious models from the "ooh look I'm so cool I have a *insert model website port* with a couple of cellphone shots just to get attention" models. I had just talked to her on the phone the night before and had also called her an hour before we were meeting just to confirm - no answer. I left a message and then tried calling her a half hour later - no answer. It's been 3 days now and I haven't received an email, phone call, or any other method of communication from her.....oh and she wants to move to LA to become a "serious model"..... Jun 16 06 09:41 am Link Yep, I've learned the unfortunate lesson that "no shows" are a bigger part of photography than I imagined. Some people...sheesh! Do what you say, say what you mean. Bondo Jun 16 06 09:58 am Link It's very frustrating and, on occasion, expensive. I had it happen to me this week with an MM model that will remain anonymous. I had rented some lighting gear for the shoot as well. The worst part is when they do not even bother to call afterwards and do not return your e-mails inquiring why they didn't show up. Jun 16 06 10:03 am Link |
