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Question about getting Agency level business
Okay. So, I 've spoken to one or two "established" photographer on here. I told them my long term interests: Fahion/Runway in NYC because there isn't a market for that sub-category in Philadelphia.....or much of one (if I'm wrong, I beg you to correct me). Here's what they're telling me: - Extremely competitive (no brainer) - Standard: 34-24-34 and 5'10" (1.778m) - Any work is better than no work - Fashion agencies typically won't want you to have a portfolio, just polaroids. Commercial agencies are more likely to want a portfolio, and are more forgiving about "the standards." - All agencies are local. A Philly agency won't get you NY work, and a NY agency won't want a Philly model. - How strict about mesurements they are is really up to the client on each job. But obviously, the closer to standard you are, the more jobs for which you'll be eligible. - TFCD is an Internet term. Agencies don't use it and may look down on you if you do. The Internet is a great place for hobbyists, beginners, artists, and those looking to experiment. Agencies deal with paying clients who are trying to sell products, so their standards are going to be much higher. I have a bunch of photographers that would like to work with me in NYC. Some have worked for agencies and designers, and the other are currently working with them. It's like a huge contradiction: "useless" TFCDs? Would they really be able to help get in the door if they liked how I look and work? Would I actually be able to make something of this? If anyone out there could give me an explaination for all of this confusion, a few tips and words of wisdom, it would really help.  Thank You, Jessica May 16 06 11:08 pm Link Baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaasically.... you got some very very legit information. Min is 5'8" in most places but NY likes em 5'10" or at least 5'9".... and on measurments... hips, MAX is 36. They dont go higher than that, but lots of girls go smaller. Other than that... Yes, it will be beneficial to you. The first thing your agency will have you do is test. If you have shot with very legitimate photographers, that are actually on their photographer list, it will do 2 things. 1. Show them how to photograph. Polaroids are the bare min. its to show the raw product.... 2. if one of their photographers thought you shoot worthy, they are more likely to take you seriously when you call them up to set an appointment, or when you walk into an open call. As a bonus... the photographer might even be able to set up an interview for you. Basically. If they offer, and you know that they shoot for the agencies you want to try to get in with... do it. May 17 06 01:17 am Link How you look and work is definitely experience-driven, so TFCD/TFP shoots not only provide portfolio images, they also provide valuable experience and confidence in front of the camera. Of course, you are likely to learn bad habits as well as good ones, especially if you shoot glamour for TFCD and then expect fashion/commercial work when you show up to the agency, but if you make the best of each TFCD opportunity, I can't imagine it hurting you when you show up at an agency. May 17 06 02:27 am Link I rather not do glamour. It's not my style. I only do shoots in general if they are fashion-oriented (as you have probably seen in my profile if you checked it out, as well as my stats, which according to what people are telling me I qualify for fashion...hopefully. Maybe some of you can give me some more insight on that). Yes, there are photographers with agency connections that are willing to test shoot me. Are you saying that fashion agencies WILL accept those instead of the polaroids they all ask for? The photographers that are in with the agencies would be willing to set up an interview with an agent for me to help me get my foot in the door? Really? (this is assuming he or she likes my work, work ethic, etc). Are there any other angles that I could try to get with a NYC fashion agent? May 17 06 07:29 pm Link Start here: www.newmodels.com May 17 06 07:36 pm Link Jessica822 wrote: Just go into the city for a day and hit all the open calls. Take simple polaroids with no makeup and a bathing suit with heels. Look here http://www.elitemodel.com/flash.html for polaroid guidlines. I wouldn't go with the pictures you have in your book, they can only hurt your chances. It really helps in the open calls to have an "I don't care" attitude. Don't smile very much either. You should wear something simple, like a tank top and jeans or a skirt. Always wear heels. I wear comfortable shoes and change into heels once I get to the building. May 17 06 08:32 pm Link Jessica, you've gotten some very good advice so far, both from the photographers you have talked to and in this thread. Let me add a little bit more to it. 1. Stats: Your measurements are crucial to what you want to do. Your listed stats are wrong - I'd bet a substantial amount of money that at least one of them is wrong by three inches or more. A 27 inch waist will bother the fashion agencies - you need to confirm that. The 32 inch hips is very unlikely to be true. I've measured lots of hundreds of models, and only run across four with 32 inch hips. One of them was 5'11" tall (it's not impossible), but she didn't look like you. I'm betting yours (measured properly, across the fullest part of the butt) are at least 35, possibly larger. You need to check that. 2. Pictures: What you've been told so far is correct: the pictures you have now won't help you. It's much more likely that they will hurt you. Polaroids as described are a much better choice. 3. Working with NYC photographers: There is no point in doing this just to get an agency appointment. Appointments feel good, and you may get treated a little better than if you just go in on an open call, but they rarely change the outcome. If the answer is going to be yes, it will be yes no matter how you got in the door. (There is one exception to that: photographers who have a strong relationship with a booker. Once in a while the agency will take a person as a favor to the photographer. But that's it. Shortly after that you learn that "being signed" is not the point of the exercise - "getting work" is. And if you are only there as a favor, not because the booker believes in you, it's just an expensive waste of your time and money. Yes, you "have an agency" - but you would be better off if you didn't.) 4. Probable Outcome: I'll make a better prediction when I know verified stats, but my guess is that you will hear the famous "you are very commercial" line when you visit the agencies - at least most of the time. Please bear in mind, that (or anything else other than "we really are interested in you, please sign here") does NOT mean what it says. No matter what words are used, all it means is "we don't want you." Don't take the literal meaning of what they say to heart. 5. Pictures: You may end up being one of those who doesn't get picked up on the first pass through the open call circuit - to my eye it's not a slam dunk either way, and the shots you have now don't help me decide. If that happens, then and only then should you consider working with photographers to build a book to change "no" to "yes". If you get to that point, then would be a good time to come back and ask for more guidance. May 17 06 08:52 pm Link not for nothing, but for a texan, TX is a pretty smart guy everything he said, plus tax May 17 06 09:01 pm Link This probably isn't a good time for me to mention that I started my professional photography career in Ohio, huh? May 17 06 09:06 pm Link Wow, okay. I guess you were right about the hip measurement. I just redid it: 32-27-34. It's definitely 27. Why will that bother agents? Of course in the long run, I want to be getting jobs, but I also want to take this one step at a time. I'm not just looking for a agency "appointment." I'm looking for ACTUAL representation, so I can then build a REAL portfolio, do all of those other necessities (compcards, wardrobes, etc), casting calls, and get work. I need representation first, or one hell of a connected friend. Do you see what I'm saying. What I'm trying to do is get that far, first. May 17 06 09:34 pm Link TXPhotog wrote: wow, and he does comedy too! May 17 06 09:41 pm Link Jessica822 wrote: I still think 34" is unlikely, but it's at least not impossible. I knew 32" was wrong. May 17 06 11:05 pm Link So, despite my height and my dress size 4, fashion is not happening for me unless I can find a photographer that is REALLY interested in me who has direct connections to agencies and/or clients? May 17 06 11:24 pm Link Or any other "friend" or "connection" that's directly connected in the industry? May 17 06 11:24 pm Link The A word is not allowed in Mayhem May 18 06 03:59 am Link Jessica822 wrote: Where did you get that from? Nothing I said suggested any such thing. May 18 06 08:48 am Link Sorry, just putting some of these facts together were giving me the "hopeless" impression: "Your measurements are crucial to what you want to do." "Standard: 34-24-34 and 5'10" (1.778m) " "A waist of 27" will bother agents because they are looking for 24 inch waists. That's what the sample sizes assume (give or take an inch). A waist of 25" wouldn't bother them much if the rest were OK, but 27" will." "my guess is that you will hear the famous "you are very commercial" line when you visit the agencies - at least most of the time. Please bear in mind, that (or anything else other than "we really are interested in you, please sign here") does NOT mean what it says. No matter what words are used, all it means is "we don't want you." "You may end up being one of those who doesn't get picked up on the first pass through the open call circuit - to my eye it's not a slam dunk either way, and the shots you have now don't help me decide." "The first thing your agency will have you do is test. If you have shot with very legitimate photographers, that are actually on their photographer list, it will do 2 things. 1. Show them how to photograph. Polaroids are the bare min. its to show the raw product.... 2. if one of their photographers thought you shoot worthy, they are more likely to take you seriously when you call them up to set an appointment, or when you walk into an open call. As a bonus... the photographer might even be able to set up an interview for you. Basically. If they offer, and you know that they shoot for the agencies you want to try to get in with... do it."-Barnett I was just trying to put two and two together.......apparently I didn't quite get it. May 18 06 10:32 am Link Hon, You need to re read that Texans post, and take some time to digest it. Honestly I read a lot of crap on these sites about how models should go about things, but ALL the advice and comments given to you by TX is toally accurate, very sensible and true to how this industry works. I have been shooting fashion for well over 15 years, so you can trust me on that. a May 18 06 10:39 am Link No no no! I'm not discrediting what anyone is saying at all. I'm sorry if I came across that way. What I'm getting from his advice is that my chances are slim because of my stats, since they deviate from the standard, but that I should just send in the polaroids and go to open calls, and if I get rejected consider getting professional shots with someone who is really working in the industry, and that her are no "angles." May 18 06 10:57 am Link DID he say if you get rejected to get pro shots? ( sorry I just cant read through ALL that again) I don't remember that advice. Other wise, it is plain. If you want a "fashion" agent, send in a good set of polaroids with correct stats.. or take them to the open calls. Thats it, no mystery, no trying to find special connected friends. Either you will get in or not. Hope that helps May 18 06 11:18 am Link This post, I cannot believe.... is actually NOT full of BS. Thanks for the refreshing post TX... you basically know your ish. All wanna-bee fashion models would do well to look at this post. May 18 06 11:53 am Link Yea, thanks. That was straight forward. May 18 06 05:27 pm Link Jessica, I think you have gotten some solid responses, the only thing that I might disagree with is the local agency not working with another agency, that's not completely accurate. The agency that has you signed is your "mother agency" and if they are worth their salt, they have ongoing rapports with the big guns in NYC, with that said, you may want to check with your "mother agency" about placing you in various markets that you are agreeable to. The Polaroid thing is questionable, they say that is what they want to see, but, it's been my experience that they are quicker to decline on a model that sends in Polaroids unless he/she is exceptional and they can see the potential via a Polaroid. If you have some great fashion shots taken, it would definetely increase your odds, also, sometimes mentioning "Oh, I just spoke to so and so at Brand-X Agency" will push an agency over the top in an effort to snag you before their competitors, ( i have used this ploy a few times and actually had two agencies fly out from NYC and got into a bidding war over our model). You just have to be careful how you insert it into a conversation and have the "aw- shucks " type of demeanor. Good luck. Nick May 19 06 03:04 pm Link Hhhmmm.....I didn't even think of that. May 19 06 05:08 pm Link Jessica822 wrote: What did you not think about??? May 19 06 05:24 pm Link I never thought the idea of trying to make myself a "product" with which "the agencies" need to "compete for" so the competition doesn't get me. What you mentioned last post. See, that's what I've always been wary of myself. I've always felt like they're "just saying that," but really don't want it. I found some NY photographers working in the indutry that are willing to test shoot me. Hopefully, I can get something worth sending to them. J'espere...oh mon dieu... I hope they're nice enough to print me a 9x12 or two, lol. May 19 06 06:22 pm Link Jessica822 wrote: These are things that good managers just know, they are not all pimps, parasites and pond scum. May 19 06 08:03 pm Link Jessica822 wrote: This depends on the agency. There are, for example, agencies in the smaller markets, who have "Mother Agency" arrangments with agencies in larger cities & will help you find placement, if not straight out work amongst their nat'l level clients. Jessica822 wrote: Most times, if an agency is having an open-call or accepting new faces, they will be glad to look at even a handful of snapshots (preferably a nice, clean headshot and some kind of full-length. They are very good at visualizing whether a model can be found work in what they market. May 19 06 08:22 pm Link |
