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Giving credit where credit is due....?
Okay MMers... So there's this photog who I have noticed never credits the models used in photographs. At first I thought it was maybe b/c said models do not have profiles of their own (I didn't ask for references b/c I looked at this person's work, liked some of it, took it for what it was, and went with it!)... since this photog is kind of an "agent" for some of these models (or so I was led to believe) I figured that was their agreement. None of my business, right? But lately I have come across a few of them here and at that Other Model Place who DO have profiles! HUGE eye-opener for me.... Interestingly enough, most of them have not credited the aforementioned photographer either. I'm wondering... should I, or should I not, credit this photog in my port? They are by no means my agent, or anything even close. Ours was a TFP/TFCD arrangement (I was given all 200 or so raw images on a CD... *sigh*) and I did sign a release for the images, to be used for the betterment of both our portfolios as we see fit. The pictures this person uses that have me in them are not credited to me on their site... and I have not contacted any of the other models that have worked with this preson, but I can't help wondering--is there a rule about this type of thing? Am I being petty? Should I just get over it, credit the phtographer and move on, or should I take it as a lesson learned and drop the photog's credits from my port as the other models seem to have done? I don't mean to sound whiney, but I can't help thinking that there is something wrong with this picture... Thoughts? Comments? Suggestions? Thanks! Mar 26 06 05:13 pm Link I will only credit a photographer if I thought they we're ok for ppl to work with. There were several photographers lately that were fake or play that touchy feely bullshit game so I don't credit them so maybe no other models have to work w/ his lame ass... just my 10 cents though  Mar 26 06 05:16 pm Link elisabeth1986 wrote: It seems to me the best thing to do is leave when that happens, and no use those images at all....any association with them is bad. wasted time sucks but being creeped is worse. Mar 26 06 05:18 pm Link umm i did hints y none of his pics are up on my port and i didn't mention working w/ him either. Mar 26 06 05:21 pm Link Hey the you like the photographers work and appearently you must or it would not be posted then it's only right to give them credit. This goes for models too. The only time I mught not give a model credit is if they do not have a MM or OMP or what ever, profile on the site that I am posting them up. All of my images have a copyright watermark on all images . so I do get some credit anyways. Mar 26 06 05:34 pm Link I've never had a model ask me to credit her by name with photo use. Never, ever. I generally don't title pictures unless they're for sale, and I usually don't name the models. In the past I have never asked that models name me when showing their photos. Since the copies of photos that I give to models are not for commercial use I've never asked them to post a copyright notice either. Until recently. Upcoming changes in copyright law have caused me to add a notice about copyright credits to my modeling agreements, but just as a precaution. Mar 26 06 05:56 pm Link Juani_Vel wrote: No, there is no rule about this kind of thing. Mar 26 06 06:10 pm Link I always credit regardless. Mostly so people know who I've worked with and can get a sense of how professional I am, etc. Mar 26 06 06:16 pm Link Hmm... thanx for the responses so far guys! So I'm thinking that this is one of those grey areas where the phrase "different strokes for different folks" applies? That's cool, I guess... But since I'm neither a high fashion, commercial nor a print model (I lean more towards art) the way I normally do things is I see a model's port and think, "HEY! I really like that shot... I would LOVE to work with the photographer who shot it". From there, I contact the photographer and let him/her know what I loved about that particular shot, and that I would love to make some great images with them sometime. I guess it doesn't work that way for photographers? Do photogs ever look at another photog's port and think "Wow, I'd love to work with that model... let me check out her site/port/contact info" only to find that there is no link or info for that model? Again, not trying to whine... just trying to figure out a general idea on how this works for others. Thanks again for the input so far! Anyone else have an opinion on this? Mar 26 06 06:25 pm Link Juani_Vel wrote: Might be a minor oversight, dont get worked up over it. What with setting up the lights, getting the camera settings right, posing the model (assuming its not a model that requires it), the post production, the messages from others who want to work with the photographer...whew... Forgot to credit the photo...darn... Mar 26 06 06:29 pm Link I don't usually credit models in my port. My port is an advertisement for me, not them. If someone is looking at my port, they are looking for a photographer, not a model. I also don't expect models to credit me with pictures of mine that they use in their port, although I prefer they have some kind of generic copyright notice such as "All images are copyright by their respective photographers". As in all cases where models and photographers might differ, negotiate dteails like this before the shoot. Not after. Mar 26 06 06:37 pm Link I always give credit where credit is due but do sometimes feel I should get some too. but that doesnt always happen. Mar 26 06 07:57 pm Link i have no problem naming the models who have posed for pictures here. i would think the point of a networked site like this is to give people not only the chance to look at your work, but see who else was involved in it as well. if i see a photographer from my area, and the models he's worked with seem interesting based on their pictures, i'd like to contact them (directly from those pictures) as well to see if they'd be willing to work with me as well. and if someone poses for me, i'd hope she'd think the experience was good enough that she'd recommend me, via credits, to other models viewing her portfolio. i don't demand it or anything, but it's nice when they do it, so i do it too. it's not that difficult. Mar 26 06 08:08 pm Link I always give credit, and if the photographer isn't on MM or OMP or whatever site, I list their website. I do this because a) it's the right thing to do, and b) people often want to see more of what photographers I've worked with have done. I'm downright anal about it, and definitely suggest giving credit where it's due. It certainly won't hurt you to have done so, and you'll look classy. (Also, stylists in particular take careful note of which photographers and models give their teams due credit. I've known stylists to pass on working with photographers or models who don't consistently credit the people who work on a photo shoot.) I definitely look at the portfolios of models who are local to me, and check out the photographers they've worked with. If they have a link it saves me a lot of annoying Googling or e-mail queries, so I always appreciate it when they do that.  But I'm an art model who approaches my craft as a creative collaboration between me and the photographer (and any stylists involved), so my perspective is going to be very different than someone who shoots or models commercially. Mar 27 06 01:09 am Link On sites like this, geared toward networking, I always credit the model, the makeup artist, and anyone else invloved in the photo session. Because I work with TFCD arrangements I feel it's the least I can do, and it may allow the model or MUA to generate work from what's in my portfolio. I have no idea if that's ever happened, but I like to think that the images I create can be helpfull to the other people involved. I also like to get credit as the photographer, but I don't presume to control other peoples' portfolio pages or make expectations of them. I do think it's a goo dthing to do, especially if it can generate more work and contacts. And besides, it's so easy to do here on MM -- why not list the credits? -P- Mar 27 06 05:20 am Link I specifically ask that if the model feels my photo is good enough to show off that I get credit. In fact, I think it's in my MRF. I always give the model credit unless there's a good reason not to. For instance, if she doesn't have a profile. Or for instance, if there's an element of nudity in the shot that she didn't mind doing for my art purposes, but she'd rather not let the public know that it was her nipple, or whatever, in the shot. Really, if pictures are nice enough to be displayed by either party, it seems like common courtesy barring some overriding reason to the contrary. Mar 27 06 08:22 am Link Just an observation here... and someone asked if there is actually a "rule" for these things. Informally, such as here on MM, nearly anything can go as long as everyone agrees and no one complains, BUT, yes, there are some "rules" when someone might insist that they be applied. Under copyright law the creator of the image [usually the photographer] not only owns the copyright [as a general rule] they are also ENTITLED to a credit, unless they specifically waver that right. Certain other participants may also be likewise ENTITLED to a credit in SOME circumstances. Again, unless they specifically waver that right. The model, however, is nearly never ENTITLED to a credit. Bizarrely, in some print "advertorial" / "editorial" work [such as Sunday supplements and magazines] you will find the photographer credited along with the fashion stylist and MUA [sometimes a hair stylist, as well] and the fashion designer / fashion house... but occasionally NOT including the model(s) in those credits. To one extent or another ALL OF THEM are ENTITLED to the credit as a matter of law, unless they waver that right, EXCEPT THE MODEL. That is not to say that the model won't necessarily ever get a credit, and even their agency, too, but that is a matter of the contract arrangements rather than one of entitlement in law. Many times the model, and their agency, will forego some or all of their respective fees in exchange for a credit and getting the model to appear in a nice [non-advertising] fashion spread for the tear sheet. In general advertising it is usually the case where the client is buying the right, and paying for it, not to credit anyone. Virtually the only exception to that is "celebrity" faces that advertise... and again that is a matter of contract and "image rights" [state based law] agreements, rather than one of copyright law. Studio36 Mar 27 06 08:42 am Link |
