Forums > General Industry > No better way of ruining a great image than....

Photographer

artist

Posts: 294

Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, US

JNB Photography wrote:
I'm still on the fence about this topic--as I see both sides of the argument...it's kind of like seeing "Proof" written across a picture so that people have to pay for it...and yes, people could easily crop out my name...hmmm....

Stamping "proof" on the pictures was always a negative with me.  I worked for a portrait business, for a long time, and once they shifted to putting "proof" across the pictures, the costs of doing business went up, since there was no way to sell those images any more.  What that showed, was they didn't "cost" money, but actually helped the bottom line. 

With digital, it seems to easy to run a batch job, put proof, or something else across the images, and never bother to run an accounting of what was actually lost. 

I have years and loads of various experiences in print and brick/mortar to back up what happens on-line.  While it might be easier to steal an "image" and easier to stamp "proof" on them, you have no way to know what you are actually losing.

Since humans haven't changed much, I would still assume that it's a 10-15% "overhead", and maybe as much as a 20-30% loss in new business.

The reason is, people get a subtle message when you obscure, copy-protect, or otherwise take abnormal methods (eg: ruining a printed photo just to *maybe* get paid).  It's not a good message.  It's negative karma. 

Everyone talks about positive up-sell.  These boards, and most photographer boards, only talk about negative-downsell.  (and that's been for 10+years)

Scott
aka Bodyartist

Feb 08 06 04:36 pm Link

Photographer

Vance C McDaniel

Posts: 7609

Los Angeles, California, US

Hmmmm,

I am just not a big fan of anything over the image.So Iput mine unerneath. There are services you can use to track your images.

I havent had any problems that I know of yet. It's something to keep your eye on, thats for sure.

V

Feb 08 06 04:41 pm Link

Photographer

Beatbox Jeebus v2

Posts: 10046

Palatine, Illinois, US

I think a lot of people are missing the point... I have had several of my images stolen and then used without my permission only to find out someone else made money rather than the model and I. How is that right? I think its up to the photographer... if you personally dont like putting your watermark or "ego trip" as some would say on your images than dont. All i know is that  for the net I prefer to mark my images, but my real life book on the other hand doesnt.

Feb 08 06 04:49 pm Link

Photographer

Mann Made Imagery

Posts: 5281

Lubbock, Texas, US

Seriously, I have no complaint about photographers putting their name or logo all over the image where it's a bit obtrusive because I've had my images stolen already and someone has them in their port on like dbase or dpreview or something.  I haven't found it yet but another photographer has and has told me.  I'm not even professional yet and only just really starting and someone is doing this!

Feb 08 06 04:54 pm Link

Makeup Artist

Glamourpuss Make-UpHair

Posts: 475

Charlotte, North Carolina, US

My perspective is different, but I am not a photographer.  As a MUA, any photos I use have a photographer credit discreetly displayed in one of the lower corners.  I feel like it's the least I can do....in most cases, if any images I have gets them work, then I'll have work.  And creating a great image is a group effort.  I couldn't not give credit...my conscience wouldn't let me.  Now, I do have some images up from photographers who haved moved away and I have lost touch with.  I give them credit for the same reasons listed above and as a courtesy since I haven't cleared it with them.  If they were to ever have a problem, I'd have no issues about taking the image down.

Now, I have occasionally right-clicked images.  But I find it very frustrating when the images are used in their portfolios and I can't get a print to save my life!  Sometimes I feel like that's the only way I can get an image of my work.  Again, creating the image is a group effort.  When I think about some of the superior work I've done (better than what's in my port) and I have nothing to show for it (and believe me, it's not from a lack of trying)...it really upsets me. 

Bear in mind, any images I have right-clicked, I don't post them anywhere and I wouldn't without speaking to the photographer.  I just keep them as a record of my work.  I realize that it gets frustrating for photographers when their work is pirated and used without permission.  And I don't know what the solution is.  I can only refer to the wise words of Sly and the Family Stone..."Different strokes for different folks".  If it makes someone feel somewhat secure to have a watermark splashed over their pic, how does that hurt you?  And if someone doesn't have a watermark, are they going against some code among the brotherhood of photographers?

PS--To clarify for the literal sticklers...I don't see Sly and the Family Stone as a fountain of wisdom...I was simply being sarcastic.  I just want to get along! (to quote The Breeders from the cd Last Splash)

Feb 08 06 05:11 pm Link

Photographer

MikeyBoy

Posts: 633

Milltown, Wisconsin, US

here's an observation from the peanut gallery... smile

its not ego ? .. cmon now.. look in the announce section right now.. the photogs with the biggest names splattered across their pics are the ones who are in there every 20 minutes begging and pleading for comments and tags...  actually it's kinda sad.. sad

Feb 08 06 06:22 pm Link

Photographer

Brian Diaz

Posts: 65617

Danbury, Connecticut, US

As an art buyer, could you really not tell whether this would be the right image for you?

https://pro.corbis.com/images/42-15191552.jpg?size=67&uid={f4ecfc81-0460-485d-8de7-0c3cd31b40d5}

Or this?

https://www1.istockphoto.com/file_thumbview_approve/654378/2/istockphoto_654378_mysterious_green.jpg

Feb 08 06 06:32 pm Link

Photographer

Martini

Posts: 343

Greensboro, North Carolina, US

markEdwardPhoto wrote:
Having the photographer splash his/her name is big BOLD letters across the front of them.

Oh, so you've seen Israel Colon's photography.

I feel sorry for the models when somebody's stupid logo takes up a quarter of the page.

Feb 08 06 06:36 pm Link

Photographer

markEdwardPhoto

Posts: 1398

Trumbull, Connecticut, US

AMartin wrote:

Oh, so you've seen Israel Colon's photography.

I feel sorry for the models when somebody's stupid logo takes up a quarter of the page.

Yes...He is a friend of mine.

I still believe that if someone wants to use/steal your image that has a simple watermark or large 'mark' on it they will and edit to there needs.

The newer embedded digital security would be better suited if a photographer so worried.

Again, I am not talking about a small name or symbol, but a large symbol or large watermark or large name across the whole image ruins the image.

Mark

Feb 08 06 06:48 pm Link

Photographer

Gary Davis

Posts: 1829

San Diego, California, US

MikeyBoy wrote:
here's an observation from the peanut gallery... smile

its not ego ? .. cmon now.. look in the announce section right now.. the photogs with the biggest names splattered across their pics are the ones who are in there every 20 minutes begging and pleading for comments and tags...  actually it's kinda sad.. sad

I'm sure there's that too smile  But on the other hand, isn't self promotion and getting your name out there a big part of being a successful photographer?

Feb 08 06 07:00 pm Link

Photographer

markEdwardPhoto

Posts: 1398

Trumbull, Connecticut, US

Here is a place that will protect you work better than a watermark.


http://www.picscout.com/Photo/index.aspx



Mark

Feb 08 06 07:12 pm Link

Model

Megan Spring

Posts: 25

Los Alamitos, California, US

Or airbrushing the life out of it. That's always been a pet peeve of mine. Who ever gave anyone the idea that it's sexy to look like a wax figure?

I apologive for the off-topicness.

Feb 08 06 07:13 pm Link

Photographer

g2-new photographics

Posts: 2048

Boston, Massachusetts, US

Eric S. wrote:
Its our RIGHT to prevent the rampent THEFT of our hard work.
All I can say, is maybe one day you'll see your stolen images on another paysite somewhere in Bulgaria or Bangkok, where they snipped off your tiny little copyright in the corner and are making money with YOUR work. Until it happens to YOU, of course you people won't understand, and will ignorantly see it as "shameless advertising"
AND aside from that, when images are either hotlinked from my server or downloaded and used on another site, ie free smut sites, my copyright serves a couple purposes.

1. Many people see it and eventually someone sees it who knows me, contacts me and says, "I thought you should know but your images are on www.dirtynastychicks.com

2. Sometimes they end up on decent sites or forums, and I sure as hell want credit for my work, because at the end of the day, its all about PR.

3. I care about my models and don't want their image tarnished either by being on these disgusting websites. Mutual Respect. Same goes with my styling team.

4. Girls steal images of attractive girls and post them as their own likeness on MySpace, and other dating sites.

5. You would never believe it but "photographers" actually steal other photographer's work and pass it off as their own, sometimes from the same site.

No matter how much some of you Monday morning quarterbacks bitch and whine about copyrights on photos, mine will ALWAYS be on MY work.

here's a tiny list of sites where my images have shown up, usually hotlinked, causing my bandwidth to SOAR.

http://psv.netwerk.to/forums/HTML/forum48/658-3.php
http://www.pajilleros.com/showthread.php
http://forum2.mokkels.nl/cgi-bin/groups.pl
http://www.orgasmatrix.com/sexo/
http://section.blog.naver.com/
http://thinpics.freeservers.com/photo.html
http://www.dt125.de/Forum/
http://santacasa.blogspot.com/2004_04_1 … chive.html
http://forums.chasermag.com/forumdispla … rune=&f=46

And of course
www.templatemonster.com

Lighten up!

Feb 08 06 07:15 pm Link

Photographer

Morton Visuals

Posts: 1773

Hope, Idaho, US

markEdwardPhoto wrote:
Here is a place that will protect you work better than a watermark.
http://www.picscout.com/Photo/index.aspx
Mark

I like that service, and am contemplating signing up -- but that won't protect me from the misappropriation that I went through a few years ago with the company that put my pics in the 1-900 ads of the local weekly. That is my greater concern.

Wm

Feb 09 06 12:19 am Link