Looknsee Photography wrote:
Maybe she gets lots of offers to work for free.

Hahaha, beauitful wit.

Christopher Brady wrote:
...when I send a model a very nice email complimenting her work and wishing her well and asking her if she would consider some TFP work then I go back and see that she has read the message but does not have common courtesy to even respond with a simple "no thanks"!

Grrrrr!

I know how you feel, a simple "no thank you" would work

Alan from Aavian Prod wrote:
Maybe this is a good time to bring out the voodoo dolls.

And don't forget the pins... yes the pins... very important those sharp little pins. No voodoo doll should be without six or a dozen of them.

LOL

Studio36

area291 wrote:
This is how the real world works...

If you submit images to an agency and they don't like you, you won't hear a thing.  You can do one of two things.  You can wait by the phone and cry when it doesn't ring and call them unprofessional, or you can move on to the next.  Get over it, it means you aren't worth the effort and that goes to the reality of the modeling business that everyone faces...even in happy hobbyville.

Good point you have but this doesn't mean the agency is correct on the actions either. The industry would benift a great deal if agencies would send a simply no thank you or sorry not interested. So.....when its time to book a model for a paying gig, am I going to contact the same agency ( who thought I wasn't worth the time or effort to respond to)...hell no !
   If I was a model here on MM I would make it my duty to network, network and do even more networking! I don't just mean the well know establish photographers but also the ones that are on a rise or one that I found interesting.
   A simple "no thank you" or "not at this time"  means a great deal to me and it shows the model is serious and professional.

KARLOS MATTHEWS wrote:

Good point you have but this doesn't mean the agency is correct on the actions either. The industry would benift a great deal if agencies would send a simply no thank you or sorry not interested. So.....when its time to book a model for a paying gig, am I going to contact the same agency ( who thought I wasn't worth the time or effort to respond to)...hell no !
   If I was a model here on MM I would make it my duty to network, network and do even more networking! I don't just mean the well know establish photographers but also the ones that are on a rise or one that I found interesting.
   A simple "no thank you" or "not at this time"  means a great deal to me and it shows the model is serious and professional.

Totally agree.  Whether it's an agency (that should know better), a model or a photographer, not acknowledging a contact in an appropriate matter is unprofessional.  It's always good business, much less courteous, to acknowlege the contact.  That's why I always reply immediately as well....so the email doesnt' get lost in my inbox.

KARLOS MATTHEWS wrote:
Good point you have but this doesn't mean the agency is correct on the actions either. The industry would benift a great deal if agencies would send a simply no thank you or sorry not interested.

Actually that isn't true.  Agencies are usually woefully understaffed, most are underfunded to add staff and the time, effort and cost to respond to massive submissions doesn't make business sense. 

There certainly isn't anything wrong with those choosing to respond, but by the same token there is nothing wrong with those choosing not to respond.  Whether one is saying no thank you in silence or in reply, it means the same thing and I certainly don't look down upon those either way.

area291 wrote:

Actually that isn't true.  Agencies are usually woefully understaffed, most are underfunded to add staff and the time, effort and cost to respond to massive submissions doesn't make business sense. 

There certainly isn't anything wrong with those choosing to respond, but by the same token there is nothing wrong with those choosing not to respond.  Whether one is saying no thank you in silence or in reply, it means the same thing and I certainly don't look down upon those either way.

Agencies I understand but most of the models posting are promoting themselves.
How foolish and shortsighted to offend potential employers as in photographers.
We don't really know if they didn't see the e-mail if they don't have a internet
connection at the moment or are busy.  A simple response removes all doubt.

Tony Lawrence wrote:
How foolish and shortsighted to offend potential employers as in photographers.
We don't really know if they didn't see the e-mail if they don't have a internet
connection at the moment or are busy.  A simple response removes all doubt.

That's their problem, not mine.  No response simply removes them and I move on. 

But on that note, quite a few have left money on the table from projects I presented with no response.  Doesn't bother me, I've gone elsewhere.

Actually that isn't true.  Agencies are usually woefully understaffed, most are underfunded to add staff and the time, effort and cost to respond to massive submissions doesn't make business sense. 

There certainly isn't anything wrong with those choosing to respond, but by the same token there is nothing wrong with those choosing not to respond.  Whether one is saying no thank you in silence or in reply, it means the same thing and I certainly don't look down upon those either way.

I like your stand but also you can send out an auto reponse. I often submit work to magazines who are on a tight buget and/or short staff. If they are not looking at portfolios send out a auto response I'll try again later and as far as portfolio drop off let photographers know if your actually going to look at their work! What a waste of time and money to drop of your book and you look to see if someone reviewed it and find out they haven't.
As for MM models and photographer we should repond to every e-mail what a compliment that someone ( besides mom ) likes the work you created over the years!
I not complaining but it's wishfull thinking in the meantime I just accept this practice as norm even though I don't agree with it.  life serves you a bag of lemons what do you do? make lemonade !

Christopher Brady wrote:
Judging from her portfolio i'm sure she does, however that does not give her reason to be unprofessional.

I mean come on, how hard is it to type "no thanks" and click SEND?

You may be confused in thinking that just because she has nice images she is a professional??

Professional behavior is measured by much more than her images which are probably 90% the photographers profesional input.

So you see, you are probably dealing with someone that is only 10% something at best.

And as far as that bullshit about people reading a message but not having the time to respond,,,,,,,,,Hockey! Take five seconds and at least tell the person that you will get back to them later when you have more time to elaborate.

Looknsee Photography wrote:
Maybe she gets lots of offers to work for free.

probably what it is.. just have to accept it...

Christopher Brady wrote:
...when I send a model a very nice email complimenting her work and wishing her well and asking her if she would consider some TFP work then I go back and see that she has read the message but does not have common courtesy to even respond with a simple "no thanks"!

Grrrrr!

Please remember though this is a networking site, there are still a LOT more men than women that are active in their memberships.  What this also means is that women very likely get flooded with e-mails.  It wouldn't surprise me if it would just take too long and too much effort to respond to all of them.  Also consider that MM can at times move very very slowly which adds to the lack of motivation to respond to all e-mails.

And finally, one of the best girls I've worked with, Trisha, took about 3 or 4 weeks before she finally responded and agreed to a shoot with me.

IsabelAurora wrote:
don't let that bother you Maybe they haven't had the time to respond? I know I often open all my emails and am in a rush or whatever and have to get back to them later. And it does happen, to me at least, that I will read an email, decide to respond later, and it either slips my mind, or it gets lost in my inbox if it is a bust email day. 

I was wondering about that.

Tony Lawrence wrote:
Good manners are always in style.  Sadly too many people today lack them.
In another thread someone mentioned that models often get so many replies
and offers that they are often overwhemed.  Well boo, hoo.  Take the time
to say no thanks if you're not intrested.  That photographer you were rude
today or ignored may be a future star.

But even if that photog is a future star...why would they want to work with someone who said no to them? I dont understand the logic in that...

Christopher Brady wrote:
...when I send a model a very nice email complimenting her work and wishing her well and asking her if she would consider some TFP work then I go back and see that she has read the message but does not have common courtesy to even respond with a simple "no thanks"!

Grrrrr!

Perhaps there could be some sort of system rigged up for the emails here. All emails would have something for each of us to click on for, say,,,,,if we want to see if a model will shoot tfp your email would say I am seeking models for such and such and this and that and the email writer can put a mark by each. Then when the model receives the email,,,,,in HIS/HER email that she receives would be something along the lines of a check box for yes or no, or I will reply to this as soon as time permits.

Josie Nutter wrote:
When photographers do that to me, I give them a few additional days to respond, then send them another if they don't-- something along the lines of: "If you're not interested, then please at least say so so I won't keep waiting for an answer from you, thanks."

Not that my reply fits into this thread but I have to say you of all models have always seemed to reply to me in a very reasonable time with your answer and you have written me some of the most polite replies I have ever gotten

area291 wrote:
This is how the real world works...

If you submit images to an agency and they don't like you, you won't hear a thing.  You can do one of two things.  You can wait by the phone and cry when it doesn't ring and call them unprofessional, or you can move on to the next.

I have always read in various books, and in some comments from people who work at agencies that it is perfectly acceptable to call and see if they at least got your submission, and to even ask them" If you are not interested in what I have, could you tell me who might be, or what you are looking for". Not everything has to be as negative as you seem to make it.

AndreBelmont wrote:
If you don't hear back it means no

Not always.

Christopher Brady wrote:
...when I send a model a very nice email complimenting her work and wishing her well and asking her if she would consider some TFP work then I go back and see that she has read the message but does not have common courtesy to even respond with a simple "no thanks"!

Grrrrr!

Hey Chris,
   No need to be burned up about this.  Too many models have a hyperactive rudeness gland which leads to a condition known as chronic unprofessionalism.  The only known cures are maturity and good examples.  (And even they don't always work.)

   Fortunately the models that are most worth working with have immunity and will write back with at least a "Thanks, but no thanks".

Best wishes to you and good luck!

Henry

HenryS wrote:

Hey Chris,
   No need to be burned up about this.  Too many models have a hyperactive rudeness gland which leads to a condition known as chronic unprofessionalism.  The only known cures are maturity and good examples.  (And even they don't always work.)

   Fortunately the models that are most worth working with have immunity and will write back with at least a "Thanks, but no thanks".

Best wishes to you and good luck!

Henry

Oh Yeah!  Some photographers do have the same disease.  It is neither gender or profession specific.

H

Glamour Boulevard wrote:
I have always read in various books, and in some comments from people who work at agencies that it is perfectly acceptable to call and see if they at least got your submission, and to even ask them" If you are not interested in what I have, could you tell me who might be, or what you are looking for". Not everything has to be as negative as you seem to make it.

Not to sound negative, but that isn't what my response said.  Most agencies won't reply if there is no interest.  That doesn't mean one can't call as you suggest. 

However, for those calling it shouldn't come as a surprise when told the photos aren't remembered.  Submissions are reviewed and tossed aside without further thought if there is no interest (unless the modeling photo was of me, then it would land in the Christmas file). 

You can take that as negative, but it's the reality.

Christopher Brady wrote:
...when I send a model a very nice email complimenting her work and wishing her well and asking her if she would consider some TFP work then I go back and see that she has read the message but does not have common courtesy to even respond with a simple "no thanks"!

Grrrrr!

I hate to say get over it...but get over it.

They might be asses, they might not check their mail, they might have other things going on in their lives, they might be travelling, or too busy working, or having non-stop sex, or having a baby, or in Iraq, or they hate you, or they love you but can't find the words to tell you, or they don't speak English, or they've run off and joined a cult.   There are so many reasons why, and to get even slightly bent over it will make the hair drop out of your head prematurely early.

area291 wrote:

Not to sound negative, but that isn't what my response said.  Most agencies won't reply if there is no interest.  That doesn't mean one can't call as you suggest. 

However, for those calling it shouldn't come as a surprise when told the photos aren't remembered.  Submissions are reviewed and tossed aside without further thought if there is no interest (unless the modeling photo was of me, then it would land in the Christmas file). 

You can take that as negative, but it's the reality.

I went back and reread it and you are right and I apologize
I think my brain skipped passed a couple words making me think you said something else. No more coffee,lol.

Tati wrote:

But even if that photog is a future star...why would they want to work with someone who said no to them? I dont understand the logic in that...

The ideal is to respond.  Take the time to acknowledge you got their message.
Say something.  Maybe the photographer won't want to work with you maybe
he will but take that time.  If it means you set aside a hour or two a week to
respond to messages but do so.  If you want to be taken serious then be
serious about not wasting people's time, repond to messages, show for shoots,
in short act like you want to be successfull.

Glamour Boulevard wrote:
I think my brain skipped passed a couple words...

I was just going to respond by listing magazines I've been published in (joking...from a response to another thread)!!!

Christopher Brady wrote:
Too bad models and photographers both can't be given feedback like on Ebay, I bet they would be more cordial!

PHEW! Boy am I glad I always respond!LOL
Just kidding...

(That is as long as the message is on the level and not creepy! Then my Mom replies..lol)
Mr. Brady's message was very professional and just, well, nice.