How can I send someone to view my portfolio there knowing that they might look around and be shocked.

by having your own web site?

starmodels wrote:
Even if you could improve the image of 'Net Models, there are some individuals that are too close minded to ever change their mind.

Truth is only a person's perception of reality. You see the evidence to support what you want to believe.

Yes, it's true that some are closed minded to anything, but hopefully those who are open minded enough to at least "look" at the 'net as a tool can see that not all models are doing "porn" on it.  It's like "Internet model" is a dirty thing to be called!

aguynamededdy wrote:

by having your own web site?

Well yes, having a website is a good thing, but I'm talking about the attitude that "soccer moms" have before they even look at a models website.

Down_2_Earth wrote:
Most people are incredibly ignorant. I've stopped trying to expand the minds of others. Over time i've realized that some poeple are just way too content with misunderstanding the world.

I agree.  It's not worth the headache in most cases to try and change someones mind who is set in their ways.  If someone is not looking to find the truth, they will only see what they want to see.

Patrick Walberg wrote:
It seems we all have our opinions as to what is deemed "adult" or not.  However there are many people who have a preconceived idea that ALL models on the Internet are doing "porn!"  As professionals using the Internet, we know that the 'net can be a very useful "tool" for networking, and conducting business.  But that doesn't mean that everyone is going to understand what we do here!

I have worked out of a popular dance studio which has quite a mix of age and talent as far as dancing is concerned.  They have been working on building a website for years.  The owner of the dance studio introduced me to the woman in charge of creating the website.  This woman is tall, and beautiful with eyes that are stunning!  She also has a teenaged daughter who dances there who is just as beautiful.   

This woman who I will call Kate (not real name) was a former professional model and I figured that Kate would have a reasonable understanding of the industry being online.  So I started to tell her about OneModelPlace.com and how I work with models that I sometimes find on the 'net.  I could see it in her face that I made a terrible mistake when I mentioned models and the Internet in the same sentence!  Her reaction was
"I would NEVER let my daughter model on the Internet!" And I had NOT even said anything about photographing her daughter ... didn't even get to that topic!

Maybe it's because the porn industry has invested so much into the 'net, but the reputation of models who have non nude websites, or within the realm of commercial standards acceptable to all ages, plus those who are teenaged models trying to get decent exposure and make money ... the reputation for ALL models on the 'net is tarnished!  You try talking with anyone outside of this community ... and you have to be careful what you say about modeling online! 

When someone goes to your OMP profile ... it's pretty dang scary that they allow one year old babies to share the search engine with "porn star" babes!  How can I send someone to view my portfolio there knowing that they might look around and be shocked.  It's the mix of content that should not be happening there which makes me happy to see that Model Mayhem is at least trying to be sensible about the mix of models and content here.  It's exactly what I would want my own website to show that models don't have to be doing "porn" to be online!

Let's just say that the atmosphere at the dance studio has never felt completely comfortable as it was before I mentioned the Internet.  Are there any other ways to improve the image of models who use the Internet for anything from posting images here to running their own non nude paysite?  I wish I could educate people to the fact that not all models online are porn stars!

I do not show my MM and OMP profile to those I meet outside of those two locations. No need to. If I meet someone, say, at a dance studio like you did, or in public, I send them to my real website. This avoids them freaking out over seeing what they may consider porn. Some people, however, consider most glamour to be porn. You cant win `em all.

Alan from Aavian Prod wrote:
There is an unfortunate truth that many photographers and models don't understand, but Patrick is trying to point out, a lot of the mainstream and the uneducated public looks at the Internet with skepticism.

Alan, thanks.  That is just the point I wanted to make clear is that it's not only those who are uneducated, but even those who are a part of the industry.  I mentioned Kate because she is a woman who has been very much a part of the traditional modeling industry.  Not only that, she does know how to use a computer so it's not like she doesn't understand that the Internet isn't all porn. 

It is her distaste for anything beyond the "traditional" aspects of the industry.  She is still living in the World where models must be tall, ghastly thin and for the most part "all American looking" ... while I'm all for promoting beautiful women who may not fit the traditional role of "model" because they might be short, full figured, and/or ethnic in appearance. 

I doubt I can have much of a chance convincing this woman otherwise, but Kate would most likely expect that if her own daughter were to go into modeling, it would be through the same route that her own career took.  Even the legit agents think of models who have posted images online as a risk.  Yet the big agencies have websites!  It is this disdain the traditional industry has towards the 'net, along with the porn industry that has contributed to the "image" problem of models who happen to be "Internet models!"  It's rather sad!

Josie Nutter wrote:
Heh, I have old school friends who are still completely scandalized by my modelling portfolio... even as 100% non-nude as it is.

Some people like to say that technology is driven by porn (Betamax being a prime example).  The 'net has always been filled with it.  It's part of the reason any internet model gets at least one "hey, I'm going to be in your town soon, can we hook up?" sort of message every now and then.  (Side note: asshats.)  Sucks, but there ya have it.

It's part of the reason I feel a constant, vague, unyielding pressure to be aggressively upfront with the non-nude aspect of any modelling I'll ever do.

Yes Josie, I understand where you're coming from.  Question for you.  Do you believe that even if the 'net were not being used for communication, these same "photographers" would still be pushing you to do nudes?

Patrick Walberg wrote:
Yes Josie, I understand where you're coming from.  Question for you.  Do you believe that even if the 'net were not being used for communication, these same "photographers" would still be pushing you to do nudes?

Not that this question was directed at me, but as long as there have been cameras there have been "photographers" trying to get models to do nudes. Of course, we could also go back farther and say that as long as there have inks, stains, chalks, and something to put an image on there have been "artists" trying to get models to do nudes.

The only difference now is that a "photographer" can fire off an email every 30 seconds from relative anonymity asking for modeling services.

Sascha wrote:
yea, just because we have a profile up here doesn't instantly make us a "Net model" (having paysites, making money off of net, only shooting with others on the Net)

True, but at what point is a model called an "Internet model?"  I have a friend who is a model.  She has an agent, and works quite a lot commercially doing advertisements and swimsuits, etc, BUT NO NUDITY.  She also profile on OMP, a very popular yahoo group, and her own website that she charges a small fee of $5 a month to be in.  Her name is Jessica Marie Jones, and if you google her, you'll find her all over the 'net!  Yet she is as busy with commercial work, if not more so than what any "traditional model" would be.

So how do you define a "model?"  Isn't it someone who "models" for pictures?  It should not matter if they have a paysite or not.  There are plenty of models I know who do have paysites, yet they do the traditional commercial work as well.

Patrick Walberg wrote:
It seems we all have our opinions as to what is deemed "adult" or not.  However there are many people who have a preconceived idea that ALL models on the Internet are doing "porn!"  As professionals using the Internet, we know that the 'net can be a very useful "tool" for networking, and conducting business.  But that doesn't mean that everyone is going to understand what we do here!

I have worked out of a popular dance studio which has quite a mix of age and talent as far as dancing is concerned.  They have been working on building a website for years.  The owner of the dance studio introduced me to the woman in charge of creating the website.  This woman is tall, and beautiful with eyes that are stunning!  She also has a teenaged daughter who dances there who is just as beautiful.   

This woman who I will call Kate (not real name) was a former professional model and I figured that Kate would have a reasonable understanding of the industry being online.  So I started to tell her about OneModelPlace.com and how I work with models that I sometimes find on the 'net.  I could see it in her face that I made a terrible mistake when I mentioned models and the Internet in the same sentence!  Her reaction was
"I would NEVER let my daughter model on the Internet!" And I had NOT even said anything about photographing her daughter ... didn't even get to that topic!

Maybe it's because the porn industry has invested so much into the 'net, but the reputation of models who have non nude websites, or within the realm of commercial standards acceptable to all ages, plus those who are teenaged models trying to get decent exposure and make money ... the reputation for ALL models on the 'net is tarnished!  You try talking with anyone outside of this community ... and you have to be careful what you say about modeling online! 

When someone goes to your OMP profile ... it's pretty dang scary that they allow one year old babies to share the search engine with "porn star" babes!  How can I send someone to view my portfolio there knowing that they might look around and be shocked.  It's the mix of content that should not be happening there which makes me happy to see that Model Mayhem is at least trying to be sensible about the mix of models and content here.  It's exactly what I would want my own website to show that models don't have to be doing "porn" to be online!

Let's just say that the atmosphere at the dance studio has never felt completely comfortable as it was before I mentioned the Internet.  Are there any other ways to improve the image of models who use the Internet for anything from posting images here to running their own non nude paysite?  I wish I could educate people to the fact that not all models online are porn stars!

Thank you for posting this. I think its a lot of ignorance, and a lot of times, older generation viewpoints based on ignorance.

Its like saying posing for playboy is the beginning of a career in Hustler and Pornographic movies.

Lady Bronze wrote:
Its like saying posing for playboy is the beginning of a career in Hustler and Pornographic movies.

It is??????  That sounds like a myth to me (haha).  Point well taken!

Patrick Walberg wrote:
....As professionals using the Internet, we know that the 'net can be a very useful "tool" for networking, and conducting business...

...or within the realm of commercial standards acceptable to all ages, plus those who are teenaged models trying to get decent exposure and make money ... the reputation for ALL models on the 'net is tarnished!  You try talking with anyone outside of this community ... and you have to be careful what you say about modeling online! 

I wish I could educate people to the fact that not all models online are porn stars!

Lot of confusion here on your part, Patrick.  The days of equating Internet model with porn are long gone for all those sans the least web savvy. 

The fact is, there is no litmus test on the 'net concerning qualification.  Anyone can throw up a few pictures and call themselves a model.  I would suggest it isn't so much about those equating porn with Internet modeling, but more about the "you too can be a model" atmosphere that most find as appealing as the same opportunity given when walking to the mailbox and finding oneself the Publisher's Clearinghouse Sweepstakes Winner.

It's a thing called credibility...

Lady Bronze wrote:
Thank you for posting this. I think its a lot of ignorance, and a lot of times, older generation viewpoints based on ignorance.

Its like saying posing for playboy is the beginning of a career in Hustler and Pornographic movies.

Sort of like that "pot leads to harder drugs" ... step by step, get on the internet as a model,  get profile on Model Mayhem, do first "nude" ... then start doing porn ...

LOL

Jenni L wrote:
Technically I am one of those soccer moms.  I know that if those other mom's knew I had a site online, they would totally get the wrong impression.  My close friends know, but it is not something that is talked about at my son's basketball practice or my daughter's gymnastics.  The stay at home mom's already talk bad about me just b/c I care how I look.  I honestly don't care what they think of me, but I would hate to have my kids hear talk like that about their mom.  I don't have anything to be ashamed of and I am actually very proud of my modeling.  The internet has just given everyone a bad rep which is really very sad.

Your work is very commercial!  I met with a 17 year old young lady and her mom, and they seemed more sensible about the whole Internet thing.  Well after all, she is listed on OneModelPlace, and her mom is a businesswoman who understands how pictures are absolutely necessary for commerce online.  I think that the attitude is changing towards models online since my experience a couple years ago with the "soccer mom" at the dance studio.  But not everyone "gets it" yet ... it takes time!

Reno Pittner wrote:
Unless there was more to this conversation, I think it is quite a leap equating
"I would NEVER let my daughter model on the Internet!" to internet models doing porn.  I would think I would worry about the kind of people she would meet on the Internet.  Same goes for a chat room.

No it's not a leap.  With MySpace.com and easy to use digital cameras, teenagers CAN get into trouble online if they want.  I'm starting to see that the problem isn't with the porn industry at all, it has more to do with the easy availability of ANYONE shooting pictures of themselves, posting on a ready made website like yahoo groups, and charging money though paypal until they get caught!  That is NOT a model! 

It is insulting to those true commercial models, and even those who model for their own paysites to be lumped into a label of "Internet model" with all the poor wanna be's and/or those who open their legs to do porn because no one would hire them otherwise!  The term "model" can mean so many things, just like "photographer"  but it is such a broad term that covers so many genera's!

As far as who your daughter meets online, I understand that fear, but it's not like some GWC is going to crawl out of the computer and start taking nudes of her!

area291 wrote:
Lot of confusion here on your part, Patrick.  The days of equating Internet model with porn are long gone for all those sans the least web savvy. 

The fact is, there is no litmus test on the 'net concerning qualification.  Anyone can throw up a few pictures and call themselves a model.  I would suggest it isn't so much about those equating porn with Internet modeling, but more about the "you too can be a model" atmosphere that most find as appealing as the same opportunity given when walking to the mailbox and finding oneself the Publisher's Clearinghouse Sweepstakes Winner.

It's a thing called credibility...

There is no litmus test, and therefore no standards in regards to what is "a model?"  You are certainly right about that!  Maybe it isn't so much an association of modeling with porn?  I suppose that can happen with any who is small minded enough to think that.  However, my niece is working in movies down in Hollywood, and my neighbor who is a middle aged woman will imply that my niece might be doing porn movies because she doesn't think she is talented enough to get legit roles. It's just plain mean!

But technology allows most anyone to "model" or be a "photographer!"  It is also true of the music industry!  You can be the most horrible musician in the World, yet if you have money and a nice Apple recording set up on your computer, you'll be able to record a CD that makes you sound pretty freaking good!  AND that is all by yourself, no help from anyone else!  Soon "models" will shoot themselves (some do already!) and what will "photographers" do?