DigitalCMH wrote:

But I'm not talking about you.  Come on Melvin, you KNOW who I am talking about.  I'm certain you have seen the photos from "photographers" that no matter how much experience they gain, their photos still suck because they have no vision, imagination, OR skills.  The only thing they are able to present is a naked body and they manage to do it badly.  Yet, they will get comments like, "You rock man! That is a beautiful image!" or "dang, I wish I was right next to her.  I'd unh ungh uhhh her all night long."

By the same token, there are plenty of "fashion" photographers who do equally crappy shots just to get near pretty girls on the weekend too.  Honestly, if I see one more port of flat-lit samey looking blondes in hip-hugger jeans and belly shirts done by a "pro fashion photographer" I'll pull my hair out.  At least nude photographers are upfront about liking pretty girls...No matter what kind of "fine art nude" hogwash they spout, everyone knows where they stand.

Ami S wrote:
Backlash to nudes comes in various forms... from those who will. those who won't and those who wouldn't because someone else did!

I do nudes and enjoy it but I have found I am now hearing subtle dislike for it and not from my family or friends but from other photographer/artists.

One gentleman I have been working with has made comments about how I needed to be very careful who I associated myself with when shooting. After that comment he went on to tell me how with his position and his work he had to be very picky and cautious as to who he used in his projects because the models associations would reflect on his work also.

I might be wrong but I felt as if I was being given a gentle warning that if I continued doing not only artistic nudes but progressed into glamour or playboy style that he would no longr be able to use me due to my "associations" and choices.

To me, a "backlash" of this sort seems odd. I've shot nude figure with models who worked in other segments of the industry, including adult. If anyone can pick them out from my portfolio, and you can show how my working with them has damaged my port, I'll mail you a crisp $100 bill. Have at it.

I don't understand why whom a model chooses to be photographed by would have any effect on another photographer - why would my images of a model be a bother to someone else who shot the same model?

FWIW -

Bill Ballard
Blue Water Photography
Savannah, GA

Melvin Moten Jr wrote:
By the same token, there are plenty of "fashion" photographers who do equally crappy shots just to get near pretty girls on the weekend too.  Honestly, if I see one more port of flat-lit samey looking blondes in hip-hugger jeans and belly shirts done by a "pro fashion photographer" pull my hair outt least nude photographers are upfront about liking pretty girls...No matter what kind of "fine art nude" hogwash they spout, everyone knows where they stand.

I double dog dare you.

Blue Water Photography wrote:
To me, a "backlash" of this sort seems odd. I've shot nude figure with models who worked in other segments of the industry, including adult. If anyone can pick them out from my portfolio, and you can show how my working with them has damaged my port, I'll mail you a crisp $100 bill. Have at it.

I don't understand why whom a model chooses to be photographed by would have any effect on another photographer - why would my images of a model be a bother to someone else who shot the same model?

FWIW -

Bill Ballard
Blue Water Photography
Savannah, GA

It sounds odd to me too. Whenever I hear stories like this I can't help thinking it's just another one of those people that is more interested in drama and "controlling" models than photography.  On the other hand, maybe he has some well paying clients who are very conservative and sensitive to that sort of thing for some reason.  I guess all Ami can do is decide what is more important to her.

Personally I feel my work stands on it's own (for better or worse )

photopauluk wrote:
Maybe I've just been lucky but I've never had that from either a model or a client

You are in the UK. That is why

Glamour Boulevard wrote:

You are in the UK. That is why

I don't mean this in any disrespectful way to anybody but why are people so insular and repressed over there?

photopauluk wrote:

I don't mean this in any disrespectful way to anybody but why are people so insular and repressed over there?

We are not all that way.

luv2bfitt wrote:
Is it me, or has there been a recent surge in......for lack of a better word, resentment towards models and photogs whose work focuses (pun) or includes nudes? Seems like models are complaining they don't get views, comments, or opportunities for work because they are not interested in posing nude, and photogs are complaining because models are reluctant to pose for them because they have nudes in their port.
  I think nude imagery (done well) is a wonderful art form that should be celebrated and enjoyed by those who appreciate such things, but some complain MM has deteriorated into something second-rate because there are so many doing nudes and not much in the way of fashion, runway, or commercial work. Are they right, or over reacting...?

This is the internet, porn rules whether you like it or not. People who want to see nothing but non nude portfolios should go start a Fashion Mayhem or something or stick to agencys.

Miles Chandler wrote:
BTW, reading the above comments about "crappy internet nudes" has me nervous, so if anyone feels like looking at my portfolio (or even my site, which has 350 images) and commenting on anything, I'd be very interested to hear. Despite these communities, we do so much of our work isolated. Don't mean to hijack the thread, I mean comment at my page, not here! In contrast to DigitalCMH I'm often not sure what to do with a clothed model..

Miles you have mail..

Awesome work.Nice to see EBB influence on you..as he has influenced adn inspired many

photopauluk wrote:

I don't mean this in any disrespectful way to anybody but why are people so insular and repressed over there?

Left Wing Christian Coalition..Victorian baggage..call it what you want.But it's enough to make many of us move overseas..

luv2bfitt wrote:
Is it me, or has there been a recent surge in......for lack of a better word, resentment towards models and photogs whose work focuses (pun) or includes nudes? Seems like models are complaining they don't get views, comments, or opportunities for work because they are not interested in posing nude, and photogs are complaining because models are reluctant to pose for them because they have nudes in their port.
  I think nude imagery (done well) is a wonderful art form that should be celebrated and enjoyed by those who appreciate such things, but some complain MM has deteriorated into something second-rate because there are so many doing nudes and not much in the way of fashion, runway, or commercial work. Are they right, or over reacting...?

It's a question of the square peg trying to ram itself into a round hole.  There are so-called "models" out there who are under 5ft7ins tall and yet expect to get work in fashion.  If you're shorter than your competition, then you have to make up for it with an exceedingly beautiful face - in which case you can do beauty modeling.  But if you're short and aren't singularly and stunningly beautiful, the only steady modeling work you can expect and still keep your clothes on is handing out samples at car shows and such. 

The Market is the cruelest reality check of all.

JAY carreon
PHOTOGRAPHER

photopauluk wrote:
I don't mean this in any disrespectful way to anybody but why are people so insular and repressed over there?

we're puritans... strap me in a bonnet and stick me on the mayflower.

MadamePsychosis wrote:

we're puritans... strap me in a bonnet and stick me on the mayflower.

I am sure one of us could manage to turn that into a hot image
LOL

Glamour Boulevard wrote:

I am sure one of us could manage to turn that into a hot image
LOL

I would like to announce the official start of the HOT AMISH CHICKS CALENDAR Competition!

JAY carreon
PHOTOGRAPHER

JAY carreon wrote:
I would like to announce the official start of the HOT AMISH CHICKS CALENDAR Competition!

JAY carreon
PHOTOGRAPHER

I could make it work!
Sell it in countries and cities where clothes are more rare than nudity, thus making clothing more taboo....."Put it on, put it allll on baby!"

J Merrill Images wrote:
Does this mean we have to tell Amish drive by shooting jokes?

They don`t use guns. Drive by buggy whippings, now thats another story
heh, now thats some funny stuff right there no matter who ya are!
Getterdunnnnnnnnnnnnnn!

Ransom J wrote:
I've never asked a model to pose nude/ topless, they've all requested it from me.  My expectations and requests never exceed lingerie.

I've requested it but only from models I KNOW do nudity up front.  If a models profile states "I don't do nudity" then she doesn't do nudity.  The only time I wouldn't hire a model who doesn't do nudes is if I NEED a model who does.  I shoot a lot of nudes (Okay, maybe I don't shoot them WELL but I'm still learning) but it's not ALL I do.  Of course, lately, it's been the bulk of what I do and my portfolio is very nude heavy.  Going to be changing that soon.

I don't understand why people get so testy and defensive over the matter myself.  It's just plain silly in my opinion.

Glamour Boulevard wrote:

I am sure one of us could manage to turn that into a hot image
LOL

Most definately, but you'll have to come over to the UK otherwise nobody will be able to view it.

MadamePsychosis wrote:

we're puritans... strap me in a bonnet and stick me on the mayflower.

How about if I strap you to a bonnet( car hood) holding a Mayflower......do you reckon we'd get away with that??lol.

Phoenix E wrote:
honestly? i think it is really difficult to do nudes well. and yes, the internet is flooded with nudes that are not executed very well. and let me tell you....it gets really really boring seeing poorly done nudes over and over and over.....and so, unfortunately, the good get lumped in with the bad....just like all models are considered flakey and all photographers are considered sleazy.......

yup.

Glamour Boulevard wrote:

This may be true about you but you aren`t the "lounge lizard" type guy about it.

That's my beef. Photographer who shoot nudes yet treats his models with the utmost respect gets a far harsher rap than the fashion photographer who's a grab ass pig. It's not so surprising, as disappointing.

photopauluk wrote:
Just out of interest, how many of you with your own websites that are hosted in the States have had problems with this FBI porn thing that's happening over there.

The sites that take the most flack are the ones that combine bondage with things like insertion/sex.  Those are the sites that they are cracking down on more and a lot of them have shut down.  Mainly because they had crappy record keeping to begin with.  Others are shutting down and then readding content as they match model IDs with release forms.

Ami S wrote:
I might be wrong but I felt as if I was being given a gentle warning that if I continued doing not only artistic nudes but progressed into glamour or playboy style that he would no longr be able to use me due to my "associations" and choices.

One door closes and another opens- he may not work with ya anymore- I would.

:-)

Split Images Studio wrote:
Ami, guess I would have to inform him that our association is terminated. That you too are cautious and picky as to whom you associate with and his attitude does not fall in with yours!!!

 
Backlash to nudes comes in various forms... from those who will. those who won't and those who wouldn't because someone else did!

I do nudes and enjoy it but I have found I am now hearing subtle dislike for it and not from my family or friends but from other photographer/artists.

One gentleman I have been working with has made comments about how I needed to be very careful who I associated myself with when shooting. After that comment he went on to tell me how with his position and his work he had to be very picky and cautious as to who he used in his projects because the models associations would reflect on his work also.

I might be wrong but I felt as if I was being given a gentle warning that if I continued doing not only artistic nudes but progressed into glamour or playboy style that he would no longr be able to use me due to my "associations" and choices.

Personally I'd just stop associating with "him".  And if he asked me why I'd tell him flat out I didn't associate with people who stick their nose where it don't belong, and veiled threats tend to put me off my day.

Ami S wrote:
Backlash to nudes comes in various forms... from those who will. those who won't and those who wouldn't because someone else did!

I do nudes and enjoy it but I have found I am now hearing subtle dislike for it and not from my family or friends but from other photographer/artists.

One gentleman I have been working with has made comments about how I needed to be very careful who I associated myself with when shooting. After that comment he went on to tell me how with his position and his work he had to be very picky and cautious as to who he used in his projects because the models associations would reflect on his work also.

I might be wrong but I felt as if I was being given a gentle warning that if I continued doing not only artistic nudes but progressed into glamour or playboy style that he would no longr be able to use me due to my "associations" and choices.

I would not let his remarks bother me if I were you.

I shoot a lot of nudes, but I also shoot landscapes, both aerial, and from the ground. I love shooting around water. I even like photographing baby farm animals.
The bottom line is that I like being a photographer, and have for over forty five years.

Glamour Boulevard wrote:

I think this is mainly because commercial images and fashion photography seen in the magazines, on billboards and such are done mainly by photographers who do it solely for money. I wish I had the old chinese writing I once saw about how if you do something solely for profit, you are headed for disaster.
  They do it in a cookie cutter way they way the designers and advertisers want it. And what they want, although it sells , is not necessarily done with a technique that makes a good photograph. But it is not meant to be a good photograph, it is meant to sell what the model is wearing.

You cant get on the billboards if you do it soley for money. The photographers that are that good are that good for a reason. You HAVE to have the eye.

JAY carreon wrote:

It's a question of the square peg trying to ram itself into a round hole.  There are so-called "models" out there who are under 5ft7ins tall and yet expect to get work in fashion.  If you're shorter than your competition, then you have to make up for it with an exceedingly beautiful face - in which case you can do beauty modeling.  But if you're short and aren't singularly and stunningly beautiful, the only steady modeling work you can expect and still keep your clothes on is handing out samples at car shows and such. 

The Market is the cruelest reality check of all.

JAY carreon
PHOTOGRAPHER

AMEN!

D. Brian Nelson wrote:
Haven't noticed a backlash.  More models are contacting me to shoot and more photographers are reading my blog and it's all going pretty well.  But then again, I haven't been hanging around here much because the conversations, generally, have gotten so purile they aren't fun anymore.

-Don

I want you around more to protect me from the amount of purile conversations with your witty banter.