Photographer
David L. Stevens
Posts: 1129
Jacksonville, Florida, US
Have they changed? I notice that several of the recent winners are much more revealing than photos I had blocked for being inappropriate. Did MM realize they were losing the small group of photographers they still had and stopped with their puritan ways?
Photographer
MTKelly
Posts: 241
Midland, Texas, US
These people are OUT OF THEIR minds. I posted an imaged to POTD and it was flagged and adult.
Anyway, I post images and before I can get them loaded I'm getting "this image has been flagged for mature audience". I flag ALL of my images for mature. Just give me a damn second to finish posting.
Yeah, I"m gonna have to bail on these folks. Just re-upped for another year and will be my last.
Too much drama.
Photographer
David L. Stevens
Posts: 1129
Jacksonville, Florida, US
MTKelly wrote:
These people are OUT OF THEIR minds. I posted an imaged to POTD and it was flagged and adult.
Anyway, I post images and before I can get them loaded I'm getting "this image has been flagged for mature audience". I flag ALL of my images for mature. Just give me a damn second to finish posting.
Yeah, I"m gonna have to bail on these folks. Just re-upped for another year and will be my last.
Too much drama. Exactly why I left.
Photographer
KenPhoto
Posts: 116
Indianapolis, Indiana, US
David L. Stevens wrote:
Have they changed? I notice that several of the recent winners are much more revealing than photos I had blocked for being inappropriate. Did MM realize they were losing the small group of photographers they still had and stopped with their puritan ways? To which photos are you referring? It's weird what they consider mature and what isn't, but they're going off of Apple's standards, I believe, because they wanted to get their app approved for iOS. So, pretty much any butt showing is considered mature, but you can show cleavage right up to the areola (as long as none of it is showing). You can show a woman with her shirt very open and showing a huge amount of cleavage, but if she uses her hands or another object other than an article of clothing to cover her breasts, it's considered mature (no hand bras, etc).
If you're ever unsure if an image is okay for the regular contest or not, just email it to [email protected] beforehand and ask. If they say it's not okay for the regular contest you won't get any points against you since you asked first.
Photographer
In The Wind Photography
Posts: 7
Beaverton, Oregon, US
Do subscribers actually drop MM because their stuff is "too adult" to be submitted for POTD consideration?
My take is completely different. The contest seems rigged to me and unless you are really lucky or part of "the contest cabal" you have no hope of winning.
Now this is not sour grapes and I know that I am not the greatest photographer. And maybe my stuff isn't good enough to compete with my peers here. But I mean, really.... it's not even a level playing field.
The "winners" usually post images that are 10, 15 and sometimes beyond that years old. $1,000/hr models shot in a studio with professional lighting. These highly photoshopped images look like they've been published in real newsstand magazines. And some are posted by retouchers who alter the image so much that it almost looks like a cartoon.
So I'm supposed to compete with these images when I don't have a studio and professional gear? Using an amateur model secured on MM?
IMHO, POTD submissions need to be recently shot images of models who are currently on MM. And the images submitted need to be taken by the photographer who actually took the image. Nothing older than a month or two.
Again, in my opinion, the 4-5 characters who have been gaming the MM POTD contest need to give it a frigging rest! If they continue to refuse to do so, MM should ban POTD winners from new submissions for at least a month so as to give others a crack at it.
And these bozos need to knock it off with the fake accounts used solely for voting.
It's one thing to seek out acknowledgement for the work you produce. It's another thing to be so narcissistic that you are out there every day, year after year, submitting ancient, magazine quality images just so you can monopolize the contest and accumulate hundreds of badges a year. Anyone that insecure is probably a pretty lousy photographer in real life and is most certainly a jerk.
Moderator
Mod 7 (Cust. Svc.)
Posts: 25869
El Segundo, California, US
KenPhoto wrote:
To which photos are you referring? It's weird what they consider mature and what isn't, but they're going off of Apple's standards, I believe, because they wanted to get their app approved for iOS. So, pretty much any butt showing is considered mature, but you can show cleavage right up to the areola (as long as none of it is showing). You can show a woman with her shirt very open and showing a huge amount of cleavage, but if she uses her hands or another object other than an article of clothing to cover her breasts, it's considered mature (no hand bras, etc).
If you're ever unsure if an image is okay for the regular contest or not, just email it to [email protected] beforehand and ask. If they say it's not okay for the regular contest you won't get any points against you since you asked first. This.
Moderator
Mod 7 (Cust. Svc.)
Posts: 25869
El Segundo, California, US
In The Wind Photography wrote:
Do subscribers actually drop MM because their stuff is "too adult" to be submitted for POTD consideration?
My take is completely different. The contest seems rigged to me and unless you are really lucky or part of "the contest cabal" you have no hope of winning.
Now this is not sour grapes and I know that I am not the greatest photographer. And maybe my stuff isn't good enough to compete with my peers here. But I mean, really.... it's not even a level playing field.
The "winners" usually post images that are 10, 15 and sometimes beyond that years old. $1,000/hr models shot in a studio with professional lighting. These highly photoshopped images look like they've been published in real newsstand magazines. And some are posted by retouchers who alter the image so much that it almost looks like a cartoon.
So I'm supposed to compete with these images when I don't have a studio and professional gear? Using an amateur model secured on MM?
IMHO, POTD submissions need to be recently shot images of models who are currently on MM. And the images submitted need to be taken by the photographer who actually took the image. Nothing older than a month or two.
Again, in my opinion, the 4-5 characters who have been gaming the MM POTD contest need to give it a frigging rest! If they continue to refuse to do so, MM should ban POTD winners from new submissions for at least a month so as to give others a crack at it.
And these bozos need to knock it off with the fake accounts used solely for voting.
It's one thing to seek out acknowledgement for the work you produce. It's another thing to be so narcissistic that you are out there every day, year after year, submitting ancient, magazine quality images just so you can monopolize the contest and accumulate hundreds of badges a year. Anyone that insecure is probably a pretty lousy photographer in real life and is most certainly a jerk. I'm sorry to hear that the contests have been a disappointment for you.
If you have evidence of anyone "gaming" the contests, or "fake accounts", please report them to us by clicking on "help" and contacting the mods from there.
Thanks
Photographer
In The Wind Photography
Posts: 7
Beaverton, Oregon, US
Mod 7 (Cust. Svc.) wrote:
I'm sorry to hear that the contests have been a disappointment for you.
If you have evidence of anyone "gaming" the contests, or "fake accounts", please report them to us by clicking on "help" and contacting the mods from there.
Thanks As a professional systems engineer it appears blindingly obvious to me that the POTD contest is being gamed. If I had access to the server that hosts contest voting a simple review of the logs would confirm the fake accounts voting opinion. It's certainly more than interesting that these same cabal of characters always seem to have just enough votes to put each of them in the top tier for contention. e.g. if the winner gets 65 votes then all of these same dipsos also get around 60-ish votes. If the winner gets 35 votes then these same clods get around 30-ish votes.
Much better images submitted by non-cabal members typically run in the 20-odd vote range.
This doesn't pique anyone's curiosity down there?
Vote solicitation is against the rules but it happens all the time. I know this from personal experience being asked to vote a certain way.
That aside, I think MM should carefully consider the suggestions I made since the current policies do nothing to promote new and long term member excitement about being part of this forum. My vote means NOTHING on MM and I have ZERO chance of even competing much less winning.
The characters routinely submitting 15 year old images of magazine centerfold class images every single day for years clearly have some psychological problems. Not just one image every day, but one image every day of a set of a dozen or more. So don't any of these "photographers" produce any new work?
IMHO, POTD entries should only be allowed for photographers on MM and ideally paying subscribers. No photographer, retoucher or model entries of images that were not RECENTLY taken of current MM models.
I can't say if the criticism in this thread that photographers are leaving MM because the rules prohibit nude images is valid. I may or may not stay with MM over the long term but if I leave it will not be because the POTD is clearly rigged.
I'm simply saying that to be meaningful, the contest needs to be on a level playing field. These vote cabal members clearly have no life and may not even be active photographers. Yeah, I have centerfold images from my film days that could probably win in a fair contest but POTD ought to be about *RECENT* work done by MM photographers working with current MM models.
If the folks running MM see it another way, it's their site and they can do whatever they like. So long as they understand that POTD is not an actual contest at all except as a contest for a small number of guys with ego problems to see how well they can shut out the rest of the MM community from participating. These people need to give it a long rest. They are beyond annoying.
At the very least, MM ought to seriously consider a "one POTD win per month max" rule. Since the cabal refuses to give it a break, this rule would make gaming the system less productive for them.
I really hope that MM will look into this at some point but I am not optimistic that they will.
Photographer
David L. Stevens
Posts: 1129
Jacksonville, Florida, US
KenPhoto wrote:
To which photos are you referring? It's weird what they consider mature and what isn't, but they're going off of Apple's standards, I believe, because they wanted to get their app approved for iOS. So, pretty much any butt showing is considered mature, but you can show cleavage right up to the areola (as long as none of it is showing). You can show a woman with her shirt very open and showing a huge amount of cleavage, but if she uses her hands or another object other than an article of clothing to cover her breasts, it's considered mature (no hand bras, etc).
If you're ever unsure if an image is okay for the regular contest or not, just email it to [email protected] beforehand and ask. if they say it's not okay for the regular contest you won't get any points against you since you asked first. Thanks for the heads up Ken.
Photographer
Eric212Grapher
Posts: 3780
Saint Louis, Missouri, US
In The Wind Photography wrote:
IMHO, POTD entries should only be allowed for photographers on MM and ideally paying subscribers. No photographer, retoucher or model entries of images that were not RECENTLY taken of current MM models. This idea has merit (but I would prefer all members, not just paying ones). It would also force the submitter to add credit where credit is due.
Use the POTD contest to promote what MM has to offer - people. It would also encourage MM members to talk positive about MM to others rather than talking negative -- in order to get others to sign up for MM.
Photographer
sospix
Posts: 23775
Orlando, Florida, US
"Cleavage" has suddenly been deemed as nudity (at least in the mind of one of the misinformed Mods), it tends to become more than a little confusing when the person, or persons, tasked with administering the contests doesn't even know the difference, and disallows images that don't violate any of the stated rules for inclusion in particular contests . . . if the curvature of a model who is buxom (I probably shouldn't use that term, it may again be outside the Mod's level of understanding) as compared to a model who is less so, is grounds for exclusion, I wish they would state that so as to lessen potential entries from being submitted . . . I'm fairly sure that Twiggy and Sophia Loren (I know, I know, I'm dating myself again) would not fill out the same gown in the same way, based solely on body type and the cleavage that may be displayed whilst wearing it . . .
SOS
Moderator
Mod 7 (Cust. Svc.)
Posts: 25869
El Segundo, California, US
sospix wrote:
"Cleavage" has suddenly been deemed as nudity (at least in the mind of one of the misinformed Mods), it tends to become more than a little confusing when the person, or persons, tasked with administering the contests doesn't even know the difference, and disallows images that don't violate any of the stated rules for inclusion in particular contests . . . if the curvature of a model who is buxom (I probably shouldn't use that term, it may again be outside the Mod's level of understanding) as compared to a model who is less so, is grounds for exclusion, I wish they would state that so as to lessen potential entries from being submitted . . . I'm fairly sure that Twiggy and Sophia Loren (I know, I know, I'm dating myself again) would not fill out the same gown in the same way, based solely on body type and the cleavage that may be displayed whilst wearing it . . .
SOS As I already clearly told you, cleavage is not nudity nor is it a mature element. You are spreading misinformation. Please stop.
Photographer
sospix
Posts: 23775
Orlando, Florida, US
Mod 7 (Cust. Svc.) wrote:
As I already clearly told you, cleavage is not nudity nor is it a mature element. You are spreading misinformation. Please stop. You may want to keep this as a private conversation, as you've contradicted yourself several times already in your direct messages to me concerning this matter and the image in question . . . I'm attempting to have a civil "conversation" in an open forum with the rest of the MM inhabitants, please do us all a favour, and do not devolve it into something else by your interference!
SOS
Photographer
sospix
Posts: 23775
Orlando, Florida, US
It seems that the uneven administration of the POTD contests has basically killed off participation in them altogether, sad state of affairs!
SOS
Photographer
Fall River Photo
Posts: 51
Salinas, California, US
sospix wrote:
It seems that the uneven administration of the POTD contests has basically killed off participation in them altogether, sad state of affairs!
SOS I came to the forums after seeing today that there were only 16 entries in the POTD 18+ division - on a Sunday. Admittedly, I'm checking in less and less often, and entering even less. Lots of reasons. But a steady course.
Photographer
sospix
Posts: 23775
Orlando, Florida, US
Fall River Photo wrote:
I came to the forums after seeing today that there were only 16 entries in the POTD 18+ division - on a Sunday. Admittedly, I'm checking in less and less often, and entering even less. Lots of reasons. But a steady course. Even less today, truly sad . . . these contests were wonderful spaces to share work amongst members, and the participation level had always been brisk . . . not so anymore! Hopefully at some point those administering the contests can get their act together and reenergize participation and interest . . .
SOS
Photographer
sospix
Posts: 23775
Orlando, Florida, US
Nat the droid wrote:
So that's why this image is considered mature... Because I am blocking my large boobies with my arm, I guess no matter what position I make it will be a hand bra..... Lol
https://www.modelmayhem.com/portfolio/pic/47858457 Well ya got my "vote" Miss N . . . nicely done!
SOS
Model
Nat the droid
Posts: 95
Sacramento, California, US
sospix wrote:
Well ya got my "vote" Miss N . . . nicely done!
SOS Ooh glad to see you still kicking around these parts 😉
Photographer
sospix
Posts: 23775
Orlando, Florida, US
Nat the droid wrote:
Ooh glad to see you still kicking around these parts 😉 I try ta stay involved when possible Miss N, although I am currently banned from participatin' in the POTD contests, yet again . . . I seem ta spend more time in detention than anyone I know . . . 
SOS
Photographer
Fall River Photo
Posts: 51
Salinas, California, US
Either Mods are seeing what's not there, or I'm not seeing what IS there. Admittedly I AM very familiar with the areolas and pubic area of this particular model...aaannndd THAT sounds perfectly HORRIBLE, doesn't it? Let me rephrase. I know what's where, and that we have opaque fabric and body parts between all of them and the viewer. None of them are visible in this shot. But still, DSQ and 2 more pts toward detention. Paranoia, perhaps, but I suspect other factors influence our Mods' perceptions of acceptability. Still, with some nostalgia for what these contests once were...am I willing to put up with the inconsistencies in hopes that some consensus among the Mods may eventually settle into a comprehensible pattern? BTW, here's the "offending" image: https://www.modelmayhem.com/portfolio/pic/47960243. KenPhoto is right - currently the only answer is to submit everything to the Mods in advance (and at least avoid penalty points and detention when Mods disagree among themselves) and then keep track of what's been approved or disapproved in each contest...and gradually succumb to fatigue while asking whether it's really worth the trouble when other images (more acceptable for various reasons) that are outside the stated standards (i.e., they clearly portray nudity, even though specific parts are blocked, or they clearly show the specific parts behind a thin veneer of fabric)... Well, in short, I think I might be trying too hard to stay committed to the POTD contests, especially with AI now figuring in the process. Those of us "of a certain age" or more may remember when we heard the question, "What if they held a war, and nobody came?" The same seems a valid question regarding the POTD contests. Out of curiosity, and for the sake of tracking the trend... Last seven days' average: POTD: 24 entries; winner's votes: 38; POTD18+: 21 entries; winner's votes: 62. Average of a year ago: POTD: 25 entries; winner's votes: 40; POTD18+: 24 entries; winner's votes: 90. Does anyone have a suggestion for where folks are posting interesting images, preferably for some constructive criticism? Thanks in advance for any recommendations. Feel free to DM me. Yours, Bill
Photographer
Positive Photos
Posts: 1
Hartford, Connecticut, US
Congratulations, your arbitrary, non sensical determination of what is too revealing or not revealing enough will soon allow you to succeed in dropping your 18+ male POD contest for non participation which must be your ultimate goal. I've enjoyed playing the game to see how unreasonable you could be and now bid you good bye. Enjoy frustrating other future contributors. Positive Photos
Photographer
David L. Stevens
Posts: 1129
Jacksonville, Florida, US
In The Wind Photography wrote:
Do subscribers actually drop MM because their stuff is "too adult" to be submitted for POTD consideration?
My take is completely different. The contest seems rigged to me and unless you are really lucky or part of "the contest cabal" you have no hope of winning.
Now this is not sour grapes and I know that I am not the greatest photographer. And maybe my stuff isn't good enough to compete with my peers here. But I mean, really.... it's not even a level playing field.
The "winners" usually post images that are 10, 15 and sometimes beyond that years old. $1,000/hr models shot in a studio with professional lighting. These highly photoshopped images look like they've been published in real newsstand magazines. And some are posted by retouchers who alter the image so much that it almost looks like a cartoon.
So I'm supposed to compete with these images when I don't have a studio and professional gear? Using an amateur model secured on MM?
I have been extremely frustrated with MM's decisions on which photos to allow and which to remove. I no longer enter these contest to win but only to draw attention to my page with quality images. I recently had an image removed because the nipple and pubic area were visible according to the moderator. I'm throwing the BS flag on both because the model was wearing lingerie and the public are was covered by panties and was darkened. The whole nipple thing threw me because look at July 12th's winner and tell me you can't see her nipples!
I don't believe in suspending anyone for any length of time for winning but I do agree with you that there is definitely voter manipulation going on. Must be sad to need recognition that badly.
IMHO, POTD submissions need to be recently shot images of models who are currently on MM. And the images submitted need to be taken by the photographer who actually took the image. Nothing older than a month or two.
Again, in my opinion, the 4-5 characters who have been gaming the MM POTD contest need to give it a frigging rest! If they continue to refuse to do so, MM should ban POTD winners from new submissions for at least a month so as to give others a crack at it.
And these bozos need to knock it off with the fake accounts used solely for voting.
It's one thing to seek out acknowledgement for the work you produce. It's another thing to be so narcissistic that you are out there every day, year after year, submitting ancient, magazine quality images just so you can monopolize the contest and accumulate hundreds of badges a year. Anyone that insecure is probably a pretty lousy photographer in real life and is most certainly a jerk.
Photographer
David L. Stevens
Posts: 1129
Jacksonville, Florida, US
Positive Photos wrote:
Congratulations, your arbitrary, non sensical determination of what is too revealing or not revealing enough will soon allow you to succeed in dropping your 18+ male POD contest for non participation which must be your ultimate goal. I've enjoyed playing the game to see how unreasonable you could be and now bid you good bye. Enjoy frustrating other future contributors. Positive Photos This image was removed as too revealing but July 14th's winner has very obvious nipples pokiing your eyes out..just be consistent!
https://photos.modelmayhem.com/potd/ent … 30711/potd
Photographer
David L. Stevens
Posts: 1129
Jacksonville, Florida, US
David L. Stevens wrote:
Positive Photos wrote:
Congratulations, your arbitrary, non sensical determination of what is too revealing or not revealing enough will soon allow you to succeed in dropping your 18+ male POD contest for non participation which must be your ultimate goal. I've enjoyed playing the game to see how unreasonable you could be and now bid you good bye. Enjoy frustrating other future contributors. Positive Photos This image was removed as too revealing but July 14th's winner has very obvious nipples pokiing your eyes out..just be consistent!
https://photos.modelmayhem.com/potd/ent … 1677584440
Photographer
Eric212Grapher
Posts: 3780
Saint Louis, Missouri, US
The guidelines are simple: Whatever you do, it will be wrong. What we see is not important. It is what the mods think they see that decides the outcome.
Submit an image to POTD, and it may get flagged for being mature. Everlasting accumulating points will eventually prevent you from submitting again. Just takes time to get to that threshold.
Asking adults to get permission before submitting is rather silly. MM should just treat the submission as a simple request whether the image meets all guidelines. No everlasting points need to be assign. that would be a sane system for adults to have.
Photographer
David L. Stevens
Posts: 1129
Jacksonville, Florida, US
Eric212Grapher wrote:
The guidelines are simple: Whatever you do, it will be wrong. What we see is not important. It is what the mods think they see that decides the outcome.
Submit an image to POTD, and it may get flagged for being mature. Everlasting accumulating points will eventually prevent you from submitting again. Just takes time to get to that threshold.
Asking adults to get permission before submitting is rather silly. MM should just treat the submission as a simple request whether the image meets all guidelines. No everlasting points need to be assign. that would be a sane system for adults to have. I agree-isn't it the job of the mods to determine if a photo meets qualifications? Why would you not just not allow it instead of assigning points?
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